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As a general statement, it never fails to amaze me in this section how no one can ever just say their own personal experience w/o being overwhelmed by others.
PSA: people talking about themselves or their parents or whatever is not an assault on anyone else's situation or choices!
KA has covered anything I had to say. The math doesn't work for living at home with dementia. The 24x7 staffing including the pay differentials for nights, weekends, and holidays ends up being well into 6 figures.
Tokinouta has a gaping hole in his logic. He's assuming he will have the mental capability to make independent decisions. With dementia, it doesn't work that way. It's like suggesting they use Uber or Lyft. You get in the car and say "take me home". It ends badly because Tokinouta now has dementia and can't remember his address.
I guess my only comment is about the studio. I hope the OP removed all the sharp objects. I don't have a good sense for the finances but renting their house and using rental income to jam them into a studio sounds like "estate preservation" and isn't doing anything for their quality of life. I didn't do it that way. My mom is in a larger 2 bedroom apartment with a Steinway parlor grand in the living room. The rent is more but not that much more. When her dementia advances to the point where she can't play the piano and she doesn't recognize anyone, I'll move her to smaller quarters in a facility that gives her better care than an ALF.
KA has covered anything I had to say. The math doesn't work for living at home with dementia. The 24x7 staffing including the pay differentials for nights, weekends, and holidays ends up being well into 6 figures.
Tokinouta has a gaping hole in his logic. He's assuming he will have the mental capability to make independent decisions. With dementia, it doesn't work that way. It's like suggesting they use Uber or Lyft. You get in the car and say "take me home". It ends badly because Tokinouta now has dementia and can't remember his address.
I guess my only comment is about the studio. I hope the OP removed all the sharp objects. I don't have a good sense for the finances but renting their house and using rental income to jam them into a studio sounds like "estate preservation" and isn't doing anything for their quality of life. I didn't do it that way. My mom is in a larger 2 bedroom apartment with a Steinway parlor grand in the living room. The rent is more but not that much more. When her dementia advances to the point where she can't play the piano and she doesn't recognize anyone, I'll move her to smaller quarters in a facility that gives her better care than an ALF.
Ok, I think you've all had enough fun at my expense. I'm a she by the way. With dementia it does work that way. I just think it's more about what the senior wants to do with their life. I think they should still be able to make some choices. I have no idea why that's such a big deal to you or KA but it seems it is.
The math does work, and has been working for people who are at home with dementia.
In-Home Care
For many dementia patients, in-home care is the preferred style of care for as long as possible.
In-home care allows for dementia patients to receive daily visits to help with personal care and other tasks, including food preparation, without needing to leave the comfort of their own homes.
In-home care is often covered by Medicaid. The only qualification is that the patient would otherwise be in need of moving to a nursing home or other care facility if the in-home care had not provided. Dementia Care: What's Covered by Medicaid and What's Not( you know why that is? Because when you move someone with early dementia you can advance them twice as fast)
You can stay home until you are actually in the end stages when you can no longer function. You can still function quite well and when you can't you are most likely in the last year of your life. I know plenty and if you'd read my posts you'd realize my sister is a nurse who has cared for many patients with dementia. She has also done in home visits with a team. They have a lot of resources to help keep seniors, even with dementia at home until the end of life stage. This is also true of seniors with cancer, parkinson's, diabetes and a variety of other slow moving chronic disease.
I suggested getting use to such things as Lyft and other devices like Alexis early so that you are able to use them as you age. Like you said, your mom is still playing piano. Learning anything new at that time would of course be difficult. When I'm old they'll have driverless cars and many other advances. Many people with first and second stage dementia can still do routine things they are use to doing with devices that serve as reminders. They have social workers who can set you up with the same drivers and cards with your address and emergency phone numbers. I know this because it happens all the time. Why that surprises you I have no idea. The internet is free to search for these truths. More and more seniors will be staying at home longer. It won't just be me.
A lot of seniors who are incontinent wear pull ups. They change them on their own. Many patients do not need changing until they can no longer walk to the bathroom on their own which is in the last stages of dementia according to my sister. At home seniors with walkers still get to the bathroom to change themselves believe it or not and they encourage walking as long as they can. They still get food and go from room to room. The last year or so is when you usually need round the clock care, and you are dying at that point. Hospice takes over for most part, even in a nursing home and who ever thought I meant those people can still function without help didn't read my posts.
You're a harsh bunch! I guess I'll just look forward to my dementia and not knowing how to get home. No worries, I'm sure they'll just drive me to the senior prison at that point or as one poster suggested I can just shoot myself. KA seems like the big boss over here. I'll have to follow their lead as I know absolutely nothing about this. Ok Whatever. I'll take my chances. I'll prepare and see how it works out trying desperately to stay in my own home as I age with all my facilities blowing away with the wind. Is that the answer you're looking for? I'll hope for the best as I drive my children crazy trying to deal with old demented me.
I take it you all don't make any plans because why do that with all those horrid senior moments ahead of you? You'll just leave it up to who's around?
Ok, I think you've all had enough fun at my expense. I'm a she by the way. With dementia it does work that way. I just think it's more about what the senior wants to do with their life. I think they should still be able to make some choices. I have no idea why that's such a big deal to you or KA but it seems it is.
The math does work, and has been working for people who are at home with dementia.
In-Home Care
For many dementia patients, in-home care is the preferred style of care for as long as possible.
In-home care allows for dementia patients to receive daily visits to help with personal care and other tasks, including food preparation, without needing to leave the comfort of their own homes.
In-home care is often covered by Medicaid. The only qualification is that the patient would otherwise be in need of moving to a nursing home or other care facility if the in-home care had not provided. Dementia Care: What's Covered by Medicaid and What's Not( you know why that is? Because when you move someone with early dementia you can advance them twice as fast)
You can stay home until you are actually in the end stages when you can no longer function. You can still function quite well and when you can't you are most likely in the last year of your life. I know plenty and if you'd read my posts you'd realize my sister is a nurse who has cared for many patients with dementia. She has also done in home visits with a team. They have a lot of resources to help keep seniors, even with dementia at home until the end of life stage. This is also true of seniors with cancer, parkinson's, diabetes and a variety of other slow moving chronic disease.
I suggested getting use to such things as Lyft and other devices like Alexis early so that you are able to use them as you age. Like you said, your mom is still playing piano. Learning anything new at that time would of course be difficult. When I'm old they'll have driverless cars and many other advances. Many people with first and second stage dementia can still do routine things they are use to doing with devices that serve as reminders. They have social workers who can set you up with the same drivers and cards with your address and emergency phone numbers. I know this because it happens all the time. Why that surprises you I have no idea. The internet is free to search for these truths. More and more seniors will be staying at home longer. It won't just be me.
A lot of seniors who are incontinent wear pull ups. They change them on their own. Many patients do not need changing until they can no longer walk to the bathroom on their own which is in the last stages of dementia according to my sister. At home seniors with walkers still get to the bathroom to change themselves believe it or not and they encourage walking as long as they can. They still get food and go from room to room. The last year or so is when you usually need round the clock care, and you are dying at that point. Hospice takes over for most part, even in a nursing home and who ever thought I meant those people can still function without help didn't read my posts.
You're a harsh bunch! I guess I'll just look forward to my dementia and not knowing how to get home. No worries, I'm sure they'll just drive me to the senior prison at that point or as one poster suggested I can just shoot myself. KA seems like the big boss over here. I'll have to follow their lead as I know absolutely nothing about this. Ok Whatever. I'll take my chances. I'll prepare and see how it works out trying desperately to stay in my own home as I age with all my facilities blowing away with the wind. Is that the answer you're looking for? I'll hope for the best as I drive my children crazy trying to deal with old demented me.
I take it you all don't make any plans because why do that with all those horrid senior moments ahead of you? You'll just leave it up to who's around?
There ares no bosses. Some people get very defensive. They think if someone else has a different perspective, it somehow challenges their own. Many of the regulars here have a one-size fits all approach. Telling them that just causes them to say no I don't, BUT ............. and re-state for the 100th time why they have the opinion they have. Poor dead horsies getting beaten forever!
PS thank you for this intel about in-home care. I feel it should help my brother someday, but maybe not, because, Texas.
He does not need round the clock care even though sometimes he can't get to the bathroom. Nothing to do with dementia, but he has the same attitude about nursing homes and I get why. I would not want to be in one either and pray that I don't have to.
I've learned a lot from you over the years about this subject. It's lead to discussions in my house about what I want. I'm only in my 40's and I've started thinking about it. I bug my parents to get it in writing and have ignored my requests so far because "they're going to be here for years". Sigh
Thanks for the feedback. Keep bugging them!
And don't forget to line things out for yourself as well. I'm not there 100 percent but I'm getting there. I do have a will, a General Durable POA, a medical POA and a medical directive, and instructions upon death, a list of important telephone numbers, etc. I'm 55 and have had a will since I was about 30. I do have to revise it occasionally because I've had it since I was so young but that's OK.
Be sure you name BACK UP PEOPLE as POA as well as executor, because your first choice may not be able to perform the duties for whatever reason.
KA has covered anything I had to say. The math doesn't work for living at home with dementia. The 24x7 staffing including the pay differentials for nights, weekends, and holidays ends up being well into 6 figures.
Tokinouta has a gaping hole in his logic. He's assuming he will have the mental capability to make independent decisions. With dementia, it doesn't work that way. It's like suggesting they use Uber or Lyft. You get in the car and say "take me home". It ends badly because Tokinouta now has dementia and can't remember his address.
I guess my only comment is about the studio. I hope the OP removed all the sharp objects. I don't have a good sense for the finances but renting their house and using rental income to jam them into a studio sounds like "estate preservation" and isn't doing anything for their quality of life. I didn't do it that way. My mom is in a larger 2 bedroom apartment with a Steinway parlor grand in the living room. The rent is more but not that much more. When her dementia advances to the point where she can't play the piano and she doesn't recognize anyone, I'll move her to smaller quarters in a facility that gives her better care than an ALF.
Good points all the way around. I agree with you about the studio apartment and the house especially.
Ok, I think you've all had enough fun at my expense. I'm a she by the way. With dementia it does work that way. I just think it's more about what the senior wants to do with their life. I think they should still be able to make some choices. I have no idea why that's such a big deal to you or KA but it seems it is.
The math does work, and has been working for people who are at home with dementia.
In-Home Care
For many dementia patients, in-home care is the preferred style of care for as long as possible.
In-home care allows for dementia patients to receive daily visits to help with personal care and other tasks, including food preparation, without needing to leave the comfort of their own homes.
In-home care is often covered by Medicaid. The only qualification is that the patient would otherwise be in need of moving to a nursing home or other care facility if the in-home care had not provided. Dementia Care: What's Covered by Medicaid and What's Not( you know why that is? Because when you move someone with early dementia you can advance them twice as fast)
You can stay home until you are actually in the end stages when you can no longer function. You can still function quite well and when you can't you are most likely in the last year of your life. I know plenty and if you'd read my posts you'd realize my sister is a nurse who has cared for many patients with dementia. She has also done in home visits with a team. They have a lot of resources to help keep seniors, even with dementia at home until the end of life stage. This is also true of seniors with cancer, parkinson's, diabetes and a variety of other slow moving chronic disease.
I suggested getting use to such things as Lyft and other devices like Alexis early so that you are able to use them as you age. Like you said, your mom is still playing piano. Learning anything new at that time would of course be difficult. When I'm old they'll have driverless cars and many other advances. Many people with first and second stage dementia can still do routine things they are use to doing with devices that serve as reminders. They have social workers who can set you up with the same drivers and cards with your address and emergency phone numbers. I know this because it happens all the time. Why that surprises you I have no idea. The internet is free to search for these truths. More and more seniors will be staying at home longer. It won't just be me.
A lot of seniors who are incontinent wear pull ups. They change them on their own. Many patients do not need changing until they can no longer walk to the bathroom on their own which is in the last stages of dementia according to my sister. At home seniors with walkers still get to the bathroom to change themselves believe it or not and they encourage walking as long as they can. They still get food and go from room to room. The last year or so is when you usually need round the clock care, and you are dying at that point. Hospice takes over for most part, even in a nursing home and who ever thought I meant those people can still function without help didn't read my posts.
You're a harsh bunch! I guess I'll just look forward to my dementia and not knowing how to get home. No worries, I'm sure they'll just drive me to the senior prison at that point or as one poster suggested I can just shoot myself. KA seems like the big boss over here. I'll have to follow their lead as I know absolutely nothing about this. Ok Whatever. I'll take my chances. I'll prepare and see how it works out trying desperately to stay in my own home as I age with all my facilities blowing away with the wind. Is that the answer you're looking for? I'll hope for the best as I drive my children crazy trying to deal with old demented me.
I take it you all don't make any plans because why do that with all those horrid senior moments ahead of you? You'll just leave it up to who's around?
There are no bosses here. There ARE a lot of people with extensive first hand experience with caregiving and/or dealing with elderly loved ones and a myriad of situations. Lots of different perspectives that are based in real life experiences.
The math often doesn't work at a certain point and it's not always simply because dementia has increased. Mobility issues are another game changer. Other serious illnesses as well. Depression often plays a huge role in the scenarios. Combine issues and it's often unworkable from many perspectives (not just money).
The point that I and others are trying to make to you is that every situation is very different - different issues, different illnesses, different personalities, different financial decisions and situations, different options in different areas of the country. It shouldn't surprise anyone - people of any age - if there comes a point when it's not a workable plan for them, or their loved ones, to remain at home. We should all have a backup plan.
Long term in home care costs are often NOT covered by Medicaid (for starters, one has to qualify financially for Medicaid) or insurance and are often very cost prohibitive. And of course most people prefer to stay home as long as possible, and their families prefer it too - no one is talking about chunking elderly parents into long term care before it's the most logical choice based on their actual needs.
Everyone interacting on this forum is on the internet. I'm pretty sure they all know how to research things online. But we come here to discuss things because in spite of all we find Googling things, it's often helpful to ask questions or discuss issues with other real people going through similar situations.
As a general statement, it never fails to amaze me in this section how no one can ever just say their own personal experience w/o being overwhelmed by others.
PSA: people talking about themselves or their parents or whatever is not an assault on anyone else's situation or choices!
You're right. Just because the OP's parents are in an ALF DOES NOT mean that others will be "forced"* to be in an ALF in the future.
Yes, we all know that people would prefer to live in their own homes, and not be a "burden" to anyone and none of that really does anything to help the OP in helping his parents adjust to their ALF and each other.
*I say forced loosely in this scenario, because apparently Mom and Dad moved on their own free will.
So that the record is straight, I did not say at any point that I had a problem with people who must be in some type of situation to receive on-going care. Certainly, some people are unable to care for themselves. Not everyone has a family who can deal with being a care-giver. I'm speaking only for myself. When and if I'm a drooling incontinent who thinks Tony Curtis is the president, it really isn't going to matter much where I am, is it? In the meantime, I'd like to be home.
LOL -- I don't know who you're trying to "set the record straight with" here but it's all good! You sounded very irritated about your kids asking you to live with them so maybe they're the ones you should set the record straight with once and for all so they stop bugging you about it. (I mean that sincerely, not trying to be snarky.)
[quote=KathrynAragon;49432914]There are no bosses here. There ARE a lot of people with extensive first hand experience with caregiving and/or dealing with elderly loved ones and a myriad of situations. Lots of different perspectives that are based in real life experiences.
The math often doesn't work at a certain point and it's not always simply because dementia has increased. Mobility issues are another game changer. Other serious illnesses as well. Depression often plays a huge role in the scenarios. Combine issues and it's often unworkable from many perspectives (not just money).
The point that I and others are trying to make to you is that every situation is very different - different issues, different illnesses, different personalities, different financial decisions and situations, different options in different areas of the country. It shouldn't surprise anyone - people of any age - if there comes a point when it's not a workable plan for them, or their loved ones, to remain at home. We should all have a backup plan.
Long term in home care costs are often NOT covered by Medicaid (for starters, one has to qualify financially for Medicaid) or insurance and are often very cost prohibitive. And of course most people prefer to stay home as long as possible, and their families prefer it too - no one is talking about chunking elderly parents into long term care before it's the most logical choice based on their actual needs.
Everyone interacting on this forum is on the internet. I'm pretty sure they all know how to research things online. But we come here to discuss things because in spite of all we find Googling things, it's often helpful to ask questions or discuss issues with other real people going through similar situations.[quote]
That's how I entered this discussion. I was responding to the OP whose parents want to return home from the facility with which they have become disenchanted. My response was to present MY side of what has become a problem for many elderly who are capable of living at home despite what their adult children may think. I figured it might be helpful to hear from a person who is decades older than most of the adult children here. I thought you might like to see the view from up here.
Most of the replies lead me to believe that discussion only counts when everyone agrees. If that's the case, what's to discuss?
Last edited by theatergypsy; 09-06-2017 at 06:51 AM..
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Whatever. I'll take my chances. I'll prepare and see how it works out trying desperately to stay in my own home as I age with all my facilities blowing away with the wind. Is that the answer you're looking for? I'll hope for the best as I drive my children crazy trying to deal with old demented me. 
