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Seems this discussion is pretty clear:
1) DC has a physically larger downtown w/ more office space. The gap is only going to grow
2) Philly has a more authentically urban downtown, with more "intensity" at its core. Philly can (potentially) expand the intensity gap with high rise infill.
Basically, the argument is going to be the same in 20-30 years. A larger less intense, less "authentically urban" DT vs. a smaller, more urban DT.
In the bottom half of the picture, you can see the edge of the new SW Downtown with construction going on. In 2020, it will look exactly like the downtown you see to the north. Center City in Philly is great. Downtown D.C. is great. Comparing them is all in good fun. They both are way better than 99% of the U.S. cities downtown's anyway.
In the bottom half of the picture, you can see the edge of the new SW Downtown with construction going on. In 2020, it will look exactly like the downtown you see to the north. Center City in Philly is great. Downtown D.C. is great. Comparing them is all in good fun. They both are way better than 99% of the U.S. cities downtown's anyway.
The current downtown of D.C. pictured below will double in size when construction in SW and NOMA is done:
Then you have Rosslyn which is also apart of Downtown D.C. with these projects under construction:
1800 Moore Tower and Central Place Tower
Just finished in 2010 Turnberry Condo Tower
I think you're throwing in parts of DC that aren't strictly defined as downtown DC, so it throws things off a bit. Going by a strict definition of what's actually labelled as downtown DC and downtown Philadelphia (Center City), Philly really does win this in most aspects. But if we expand downtown DC to all these other districts, then Philly should be allowed to expand just as much and include other parts such as University City which aren't traditionally counted as part of Downtown Philadelphia.
I think you're throwing in parts of DC that aren't strictly defined as downtown DC, so it throws things off a bit. Going by a strict definition of what's actually labelled as downtown DC and downtown Philadelphia (Center City), Philly really does win this in most aspects. But if we expand downtown DC to all these other districts, then Philly should be allowed to expand just as much and include other parts such as University City which aren't traditionally counted as part of Downtown Philadelphia.
University city doesn't look like a downtown CBD though. It looks like a regular urban residential neighborhood. I ran at the Penn Relays many times and I know the area well. DC's central business districts touch each other which might be unique for D.C.
NW Downtown D.C., SW Downtown D.C., NOMA, Rosslyn-Ballston Corridor, and Crystal City all touch each other. There is no break of residential neighborhoods except the potomac river.
Here is a picture showing how the Rosslyn-Ballston Corridor connects with NW Downtown D.C. Keep in mind SW Downtown D.C. is not shown on this picture. NOMA where the parking lots are by Union Station looks nothing like this anymore with new residential high rises everywhere. That whole triangle area of parking lots will be full of buildings in a few years.
University city doesn't look like a downtown CBD though. It looks like a regular urban residential neighborhood. I ran at the Penn Relays many times and I know the area well. DC's central business districts touch each other which might be unique for D.C.
NW Downtown D.C., SW Downtown D.C., NOMA, Rosslyn-Ballston Corridor, and Crystal City all touch each other. There is no break of residential neighborhoods except the potomac river.
Here is a picture showing how the Rosslyn-Ballston Corridor connects with NW Downtown D.C. Keep in mind SW Downtown D.C. is not shown on this picture. NOMA where the parking lots are by Union Station looks nothing like this anymore with new residential high rises everywhere. That whole triangle area of parking lots will be full of buildings in a few years.
University City to what part though? University City on its eastern ends especially is far from simply a residential neighborhood. Also, by what rubric are you judging these downtowns to be better than another?
Also, given the limitations on height in DC, it's pretty expected that it would have to sprawl out in order to have the amount of office space that Philadelphia would have.
Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prelude91
For starters, the architecture is much more interesting in NYC (and Philly for that matter), secondly, NYC tends to incorporate residential/commercial/business a lot better than DC.
DC is a cool city IMO, I have lived here over two years, but you hype up the city way too much. Sure dc is experiencing growth now, but I think the city is losing it's identity very quickly.
In terms of vibrancy and culture and overall "urbaness", there are several cities ahead of DC.
I have to agree with this statement, and i'm from the DMV area, MDAllStar you do wayyyy too much DC hyping on here it gets a little too much for me to see it...It's like your just nonstop DC boosting in every single comment and creating new threads by the hour. We all love DC and it is respected amongst the most elite big cities in the country, but...Newsflash: there are AMAZING cities, outside of DC. Our 5.5 million MSA and 8.5 million CSA can only go but so far. I start to get the feeling that you don't ever leave the DC area, is this true?
But i do disagree that the city will fall off soon. That's preposterous!
Nah, MD is ok! Why do people have problem with MD hyping up DC? Philly bammas do it every other thread. They are just upset because he constantly sh&ts on them with his facts. And when I see post claiming that DT DC is suburban, I tend to laugh. DC has miles of office canyons block after block, something Philly does not have. Only NYC and Chicago have this.
Anyway you slice it, DT DC is growing at an enormous rate and it kills tiny CC. DT DC will soon surpass the Loop. What puzzels me is that, you people keep harping on vibrancy. If DT DC is not vibrant, why is parking such a major issue on nights and weekends DT?
Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
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Oh I agree Downtown DC is a beast, I just got back from LA and was just shocked at how dry and lifeless their downtown was, even on All-Star weekend. You take those skyscrapers out of LA's downtown and it would not even be recognized as the 2nd biggest city in the US. DC's DT is right up their with the best of them, I just would like people to let it be, without the constant hyping of DC is this or that. In turn that is what will cause even more people to hate on it.
Nah, MD is ok! Why do people have problem with MD hyping up DC? Philly bammas do it every other thread. They are just upset because he constantly sh&ts on them with his facts. And when I see post claiming that DT DC is suburban, I tend to laugh. DC has miles of office canyons block after block, something Philly does not have. Only NYC and Chicago have this.
Anyway you slice it, DT DC is growing at an enormous rate and it kills tiny CC. DT DC will soon surpass the Loop. What puzzels me is that, you people keep harping on vibrancy. If DT DC is not vibrant, why is parking such a major issue on nights and weekends DT?
Hmm... I would actually disagree with this statement; I have never really had a problem parking downtown, even on weekends. Just this past weekend I ate at Founding Farmers (in the IMF building), on a Saturday night, and found a spot on the street in front of the building no problem. For valentines day weekend, I ate at Vidalia on M street, again parked on street no problem. Most of the garages have spots on weekend too. Not saying Downtown isn't vibrant, but I never had a issue parking. Hell, I can find parking quite easily in Georgetown on the weekend too.
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