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View Poll Results: Are people from the Celtic countries ethnically still different from the English?
Yes, they aren't any more English than a German or an Italian is, totally different ethnicity 36 24.49%
They're somewhat closer to being English than any other ethnicities are, but they're still different enough 74 50.34%
I consider all British Isles groups one single meta-ethnicity 37 25.17%
Voters: 147. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-11-2013, 08:35 AM
 
4,680 posts, read 13,435,317 times
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Wrong! Blood of the Isles is now outdated and outpaced by genetic research which is moving so fast. 85% of the English, Welsh, Scottish and Irish genetic make-up is not identical as Sykes claimed( all fantasy). Even the R1b suclades are different as well from Basques. In Britain, the "purest" are still the Welsh are more related to the Irish on one hand and to the French on the other, While most English are more similar to the Dutch, Germans and some Scandinavians. I guess they're back to the beginning. Recently the University College of London studying a Y-DNA chromosome that appears in almost all males of Denmark and Northern Germany, found that 50% of male Britons also have that segment. That speaks for itself. So Oppenheimer was illusioned! Pigmentation across the Isles clear clearly shows that as one goes west in Britain, dark hair, dark eyes and red hair increases. This is clearly is patterned due to invasions. I'm not claiming that the Saxons exterminated all Britons in their way, rather they took many Keltic women and had serfs too. For this reason, the country of Wales came into existence, the Welsh were called so by the Saxons, because they looked foreign to them.

 
Old 03-11-2013, 11:57 AM
 
614 posts, read 3,212,604 times
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I consider all British Isles group to be one ethnicity, and akin to the division between say a Catalan, Galician, Andalusian etc in Spain.
 
Old 03-11-2013, 12:05 PM
 
Location: Near Tours, France about 47°10'N 0°25'E
2,825 posts, read 5,265,333 times
Reputation: 1957
"ethnicities" have their unity byt their language. Catalans are a distinct ethnicity from Castillans only if they have Catalan-speaking culture as their native culture. In Britain, the huge majority of British people are of English-speaking culture and not of the Gaelic or Brythonic ones, as such they are the same ethnicity. Wanting them to be different is race-based 19th century romantic idea without real justification other than internal nationalism.
 
Old 03-11-2013, 04:52 PM
 
233 posts, read 449,794 times
Reputation: 77
You are right there. Catalan nationalists from the 19th century were "racial supremacists". According to them, Catalans were "Francs" and Spanish sort of Morrocans. Of course, that was entirely demential.

The same thing with Basque nationalists (Sabino Arana), he was a kook, totally deranged, worse than Gobineau.
 
Old 03-11-2013, 05:19 PM
 
Location: Near Tours, France about 47°10'N 0°25'E
2,825 posts, read 5,265,333 times
Reputation: 1957
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gargamel10 View Post
You are right there. Catalan nationalists from the 19th century were "racial supremacists". According to them, Catalans were "Francs" and Spanish sort of Morrocans. Of course, that was entirely demential.

The same thing with Basque nationalists (Sabino Arana), he was a kook, totally deranged, worse than Gobineau.

Really? That's sound weird than Catalan thought they were franks... Just because Catalonia has been ruled by Frankish kings once uppon a time would make them Francks? Even us french people are not much descent of franks, so Catalans!?...

I hope really one day people will understand that ethnicities are cultural concepts and not racial/genetic ones, that is completly different.
 
Old 03-13-2013, 12:38 PM
 
370 posts, read 951,096 times
Reputation: 292
The former president of Catalonia once said that we were "Carolingians"...of course, I guess he was referring to the fact that Charlemagne conquered (and abandoned) Catalonia 1100 years ago. Just poppycock.

Catalans, people that have Catalan last names, are mostly Occitans, Provençals, Aquitaine and Swiss since almost all the original population died during five consecutive plagues of bubonic plague....and now those "Catalans" are a scant minority, around 15 percent, so go figure..

So the Catalan culture survives even considering that "genetic" Catalans, if such thing exists, must be around 5 percent...and in very remote areas.
 
Old 03-13-2013, 12:44 PM
 
Location: Scotland
7,956 posts, read 11,849,637 times
Reputation: 4167
Yeah, but if you are born in an area, you feel an affinity to it even though your ancestors were from elsewhere. It is YOUR place of birth.
 
Old 03-15-2013, 10:27 PM
 
Location: Pluto's Home Town
9,982 posts, read 13,765,700 times
Reputation: 5691
I think they are more similar than the Ango-Saxon racial apologists claimed in the past, but distinctive in other ways. The Irish, Scottish, and Welsh do seem to have more of the R1b genes, vs the R1a genes in the Germanic countries and in England. However, the Y chromosomes from conquerers suggest hegemony, whereas the maternal DNA of the ancient Britons and other Celts seem much closer, suggesting a common origin of most British peoples. So, again they are more similar than different genetically, but their histories and self perceptions are different, of course, and that affects their self-perceptions.

I chose the middle option in the poll.
 
Old 03-18-2013, 06:32 AM
 
370 posts, read 951,096 times
Reputation: 292
Quote:
Originally Posted by paull805 View Post
Yeah, but if you are born in an area, you feel an affinity to it even though your ancestors were from elsewhere. It is YOUR place of birth.

Us solis as opposed to Us sanguine
 
Old 03-18-2013, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Vancouver, Canada
3,715 posts, read 5,269,473 times
Reputation: 1180
they're all the same to me
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