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I read something that said Ireland is about 10 percent continental European, partly due to the Norwegians raiding it and such but mostly due to English and Scots being planted into there over the centuries.
"planted"? There has also been natural migration over then centuries.
I really have no interest in getting into a racist argument, and I am unsure what my nationality has to do with the question at hand. In my opinion the English look very much like other populations of northwest Europe, and many have a markedly different look from the Irish. Frankly this is all I will say on the subject, as I find culture to be a more important determinant of "ethnicity, and have little interest in discussing racial phenotypes, racial markers, or racial categorization.
Quote:
Originally Posted by John-UK
Not so.
Can you go into detail? In 1814 half if not most of the Irish spoke the Irish language which is totally unintelligible to an English speaker. They were also a different religion - Catholic, while the English were Anglicans. So the Irish both spoke a different language, and adhered to a different religion. In other words, the Irish had unique culture and traditions that were culturally quite different from the English. If they weren't that different, they wouldn't have had to assimilate to English culture.
A German would have a much easier time trying to understand Italian than an Englishman would the Irish language, as German and Italian are more closely related than the English and Irish languages. Also, about 40% of Germans were Catholic and shared the same religion as Italians. In my opinion comparing a Bavarian and a Lombardian to an Englishman and an Irishman in 1814 is a relatively fair comparison. Today, not so much.
No worries hobbesdj - I just don't agree with your comment that they look different and the reason I asked your nationality was because I don't think you are from that area to make such an inaccurate comment. Yes I'm happy to leave the discussion as well.
No worries hobbesdj - I just don't agree with your comment that they look different and the reason I asked your nationality was because I don't think you are from that area to make such an inaccurate comment. Yes I'm happy to leave the discussion as well.
For what it's worth, I have been to England well over ten times, and Ireland five or six times, not including brief airport stops for connecting flights. I fly for free on Delta, and it allows me visit my family in Ireland with ease. This is a good illustration of why making assumptions about someone based on their nationality/race/religion or other characteristics can be flawed. You can't judge a book by it's cover!
Like I said, I was speaking culturally, not genetically.
But if we are to talk about ancestry, the English look quite different from the Irish to me. I know many like to say that the English, Irish, Scottish, and Welsh are all the same, but to me the English (and some Scots) clearly look a lot like people from Scandinavia, West Germany, Holland, etc. Obviously not exact copies, but very similar. Perhaps they are a halfway point between continental Northern Europe and Ireland. There is a definitely an "English look" that I instantly recognize in England, the US, and Australia, but I definitely don't find in Ireland. And this makes a lot of sense considering that the history books tell us that the English are largely descended the Angles and Saxons from the area of Frisia and Southern Denmark.
Yes exactly. The English are "Germanic". The Irish act very different and look very different. They just have a different and unique appearance that strikes you compared to the more Germanic looking English.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie20
Here is a collage of people from Co. Mayo who took part in the National Genograph Project.
I bet you don't really have a good idea of what Irish look like. It is very difficult to tell people apart. Are you an American by any chance?
Interesting you say Frisia because on Gedmatch I and my family get either North Dutch or Frisia a lot despite being fully Irish Celts.
Wow. No matter how desperately you want to be English, you aren't. If you want any chance to be English, push for a reunification with the UK. The fact is that the Irish are a totally different and foreign people with a unique culture, different religion, and clearly different ancestry. I know you want to be English instead if Irish very badly but the Irish are way too foreign compared to English and even the Scots.
Yes exactly. The English are "Germanic". The Irish act very different and look very different. They just have a different and unique appearance that strikes you compared to the more Germanic looking English.
Wow. No matter how desperately you want to be English, you aren't. If you want any chance to be English, push for a reunification with the UK. The fact is that the Irish are a totally different and foreign people with a unique culture, different religion, and clearly different ancestry. I know you want to be English instead if Irish very badly but the Irish are way too foreign compared to English and even the Scots.
Get over yourself. I've no desire to be English but I do understand the genetics. That's a Gedmatch program run from my brother's dna. It is what it is. I put it up because the other poster was blabbing on about the English and Frisians and Anglo-Saxons etc just to show that it is not that cut and dry. Anyway it shows my brother is closer to Dutch than the English. Don't accuse me of something I've never said. Go and research before you post and show your ignorance.
How completely ignorant and you obviously don't know what you are talking about. I have an interest in the genetics and have for years that's why I know all this BS about the English being different is complete hogwash. You obviously have no knowledge about those populations or the history. Wow yourself.
For what it's worth, I have been to England well over ten times, and Ireland five or six times, not including brief airport stops for connecting flights. I fly for free on Delta, and it allows me visit my family in Ireland with ease. This is a good illustration of why making assumptions about someone based on their nationality/race/religion or other characteristics can be flawed. You can't judge a book by it's cover!
Well that's nice. I'm from an Irish family and live in Australia. Over 30% of Australians are of Irish descent. I'm still baffled by how they look so different because I don't see it and no one here can tell the difference between an Irish Australian or an Australian of English background. Interesting how people think two neighbouring populations can look that different. I think a lot of this is more political than anything.
No worries hobbesdj - I just don't agree with your comment that they look different and the reason I asked your nationality was because I don't think you are from that area to make such an inaccurate comment. Yes I'm happy to leave the discussion as well.
Bernie
I don.t think that he.s from Europe. Yes..according to Sykes and many others, all the inhabitants of the islands are practically identical. I guess that the only difference are foreigners that came after Romans that are a minority..also present in ancient Hiberna..many saxons kicked out by Normans..Normans..etc.I can.t distibguish Irish from English and Scots..except by their speech and demeneors.Ancient Pics..for example..were almost the same people than Irish..etc.
I don.t think that he.s from Europe. Yes..according to Sykes and many others, all the inhabitants of the islands are practically identical. I guess that the only difference are foreigners that came after Romans that are a minority..also present in ancient Hiberna..many saxons kicked out by Normans..Normans..etc.I can.t distibguish Irish from English and Scots..except by their speech and demeneors.Ancient Pics..for example..were almost the same people than Irish..etc.
Yes thanks Miserere. I've accepted the history of Britain and Ireland and I'm quite happy that Ireland is an independent country. On the other hand if anyone wants to say the populations are drastically different they really need to back that up. Culturally different but to say they are physically different well that is just not backed up by genetics and because I say this it doesn't mean I want to be English.
I'm not going to post genetic plots and more information on the subject because I know that it will get the thread shut down but people need to go and do some proper research on the subject and leave the agendas they have behind. It is what it is. Anything I've said is just based on actual genetics and I've looked at studies for years. Also a few of my family members including myself have had our dna analysed. I'm not talking out of my arse like some others.
Last edited by Bernie20; 10-08-2014 at 01:47 AM..
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