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You fail in understanding even what is being discussed. Lets refresh.... you claimed you left this forum because of the name calling....you were called un-American....yada, yada, yada.
I found a post where you called Obama un-American, hence you were name calling, ya'know the same thing that you left this forum for. Do you even get my point?
It's there for everyone to see why I left the forum but you insist on posting your lies and continue to make yourself look foolish. Carry on.
When you quote a comment from another poster and completely fail in comprehending what that poster is stating, it makes you look wrong, not the other poster.
Random you make a valid point. The fact is the jobs the illegals take would not be jobs those you described would be interested in. The jobs like roofing, drywall, landscaping etc are difficult back breaking jobs. Not for the lazy segment of our population. The illegals have in fact displaced many citizens from their chosen trades. One can not compete with illegals when you need to pay taxes on what you earn. Drywallers and such subcontractors. They pay the full SS not the half most of us pay. They also pay workmans comp insurance full price. They also will be held accountable for defects in their work. Illegals simply move on. A legal can and will be sued if they try that.
Jobs that were once done as entry level jobs for our children are now done by illegals. Once again illegals have displaced citizens.
This is no victimless crime.
Add to the job theft.
ID Theft, ID fraud, Tax fraud and evasion. The cost is in the billions.
Then you have theft of medical services. Illegals love the ER, they can't be turned down and of course using a false name they escape paying the bill. Cost is in the billions.
Public schools for their children require us to provide interpreters and tutors. Cost is in the billions.
Well, that's just too bad, they should find a new line of work, one that actually REQUIRES education and then you wouldn't be having to compete with the lowest of the low. Tutors and interpreters? That sounds like new jobs to me! And for educated people too!
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomPersonInNY
And this is exactly what I mean about the selective reading and knee-jerk responses in this forum. I was not talking about when they are found in the desert, but about the NYS welfare system. I already made that clear in my original post. Illegal aliens are not entitled to any form of welfare in NY. Only if they have an anchor baby, which many do not. Does that clarify things for you?
That is true, but for most on here, they think that illegals can get all kinds of welfare which is simply not true.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory
You are talking about a minority of Americans that are too lazy to work though. That simply isn't true of the majority. Illegal aliens are being hired simply because they work cheaper not because Americans can't be found for the job or because they are too lazy to work. I agree however, that every able-bodied American should be working and not collecting welfare. In today's economy it is hard for a blue-collared American to find a job that will feed their family though. Sometimes unemployment pays more. Illegals have already taken many of those blue-collared jobs and for the reason I already cited. Americans have had their wages reduced due to illegal immigration also. Those are just the facts and no I am not calling you pro-illegal. However, there is no justification for them to break the law nor for the employers to break the law by hiring them with idiotic, false claims they can't find an Americans to do the job for a "fair" wage.
too bad, again go to college for something that is in demand, the days of not having a degree at all are over. If people choose to stay ignorant of that fact, then they choose to deal with the consequences of their actions and lack of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory
There are however many non-lazy Americans who have always done roofing, drywall, landscaping, etc. until the arrival of cheap, illegal labor that drove them off those jobs. You're right they have been displaced or their wages reduced due to illegal immigration.
You're right again. Those entry level jobs that our American youth used to be able to get are getting scarcer now also due to illegal immigration. Everything else you have said is spot on also, tinman.
Illegals didn't drive them off those jobs...your typical greedy American did. They wouldn't even have those jobs if people didn't hire them, but like most people, you would never blame an american, now would you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory
Where is your proof that the majority of those of us for the rule of law are just masking our racism? You see what you want to see. It doesn't represent the majority and I am certainly not masking any racism. Why would you use the term anti-"immigration" crowd? It is illegal aliens that we object to not immigrants. Now who is being dishonest?
I did not say that! I said that I have passed by schools that were a sea of Hispanic kids. I did not say that they were all illegals or the product of illegal parents. I would imagine that some of them were though. If you're going to quote me at least quote me correctly!!
My handle is Oldglory not Oldnavy. What is your point of calling me that? I object to change in our culture and language via illegal immigration. That's being unreasonable? All of our unemployed Americans are not college material and in fact are blue-collared workers that enjoy their trades. Does that make them ignorant? Many of them are middle-aged and have to earn a living to feed their families not attend a college and to become something you think they should be and give up the jobs they love or have their wages reduced to accommodate illegal aliens. It is our blue-collared workforce that has been most negatively impacted by illegal immigration not that you seem to care.
Do you actually think that our government will monitor these newly legalized illegals to learn English and pay fines, etc. They can't even keep track of visa overstayers! It would be very costly to monitor all that anyway. The bottom line is that we don't need these people and it makes no sense to reward them for breaking our immigration laws. If those jobs they are holding were freed up for Americans they in turn would be bolstering our economy. There are only 50 million Hispanics in this country including the illegal alien kind. Gee that means there are 265 million non-Hispanics in this country. Yet you think that Hispanics are some kind of answer to our economy and the big answer to propping it up? What are the rest of us...chopped liver? Take illegals out of the equasion and the Hispanic population is even smaller.
I am done with you because you can't debate civilly and you have resorted to pulling the race card. Funny how you don't think that it is racist to put one's ethnic group above our immigration laws and rewarded for breaking them and yet "we" are the racists? I will no longer read your posts or reply to you.
I did quote you "oldglory" or whatever your name is, now you are changing what you said because you're depends on all in a knot lol. All of unemployed americans are not college material? Too bad, suck it up. There is a theory that intelligence increases as one gets older and strives to learn more, like right now, my head hurts because I have been studying for an exam, but you know what? I suck it up and deal with it. You don't see me coming on here whining about taking 180 question exam, now do you?
As for the propping up the economy, they are outspending all other races except for the majority which is purely due to number reasons, I don't know, sounds impressive to me, at a time where the majority of americans are not wanting to spend anything at all, sounds like they are helping more than hurting the economy. I just get the feeling that no matter what, if you were put in the minority whether it be hispanic or something else you would still find a reason to complain and that's a sad life to live.
Well, that's just too bad, they should find a new line of work, one that actually REQUIRES education and then you wouldn't be having to compete with the lowest of the low. Tutors and interpreters? That sounds like new jobs to me! And for educated people too!
That is true, but for most on here, they think that illegals can get all kinds of welfare which is simply not true.
too bad, again go to college for something that is in demand, the days of not having a degree at all are over. If people choose to stay ignorant of that fact, then they choose to deal with the consequences of their actions and lack of.
Illegals didn't drive them off those jobs...your typical greedy American did. They wouldn't even have those jobs if people didn't hire them, but like most people, you would never blame an american, now would you?
I did quote you "oldglory" or whatever your name is, now you are changing what you said because you're depends on all in a knot lol. All of unemployed americans are not college material? Too bad, suck it up. There is a theory that intelligence increases as one gets older and strives to learn more, like right now, my head hurts because I have been studying for an exam, but you know what? I suck it up and deal with it. You don't see me coming on here whining about taking 180 question exam, now do you?
As for the propping up the economy, they are outspending all other races except for the majority which is purely due to number reasons, I don't know, sounds impressive to me, at a time where the majority of americans are not wanting to spend anything at all, sounds like they are helping more than hurting the economy. I just get the feeling that no matter what, if you were put in the minority whether it be hispanic or something else you would still find a reason to complain and that's a sad life to live.
Why should legal citizens be forced to find new trades so that illegals can make a living?
Go get an education? That costs money and they lost their career. What of their own families who depend upon them? Should Legal citizens go without so that illegals can thrive?
Tutors and interpreters. Why should this nation facilitate criminal behaviors?
Why should legal citizens be forced to find new trades so that illegals can make a living?
Go get an education? That costs money and they lost their career. What of their own families who depend upon them? Should Legal citizens go without so that illegals can thrive?
Tutors and interpreters. Why should this nation facilitate criminal behaviors?
Umm no it doesnt. There are plenty of grants and scholarships for people that want to learn. I used the FAFSA just like everyone else. Its just a matter of not being lazy and doing it. As for the tutors and interpreters, you are looking at the glass as half empty instead of half full..They would only hire legal people for those jobs and they usually require education. I went to school so that way i didnt have to do those jobs and now i am in a job that cant be off shored, nor can an illegal take it. If Americans want it, its there and if not, thats fine, but dont whine about it.
Umm no it doesnt. There are plenty of grants and scholarships for people that want to learn. I used the FAFSA just like everyone else. Its just a matter of not being lazy and doing it. As for the tutors and interpreters, you are looking at the glass as half empty instead of half full..They would only hire legal people for those jobs and they usually require education. I went to school so that way i didnt have to do those jobs and now i am in a job that cant be off shored, nor can an illegal take it. If Americans want it, its there and if not, thats fine, but dont whine about it.
You missed my point. It doesn't matter if grants are available. No legal citizen should be forced from their trade so that illegals can thrive. Besides while dad is going to school who will provide for his family? It isn't as cut and dry as you make it.
Another factor is not everyone is cut out to go to college. I certainly wasn't and I am still not. Sit me down in a class room and I go into a coma. I grew up on a farm and don't feel that I am lazy but for me school sucked. I have a good job and I doubt any illegal can do it. But I know good folks who have been lowballed out their trades by illegals. No citizen should have to deal with that.
You missed my point. It doesn't matter if grants are available. No legal citizen should be forced from their trade so that illegals can thrive. Besides while dad is going to school who will provide for his family? It isn't as cut and dry as you make it.
Another factor is not everyone is cut out to go to college. I certainly wasn't and I am still not. Sit me down in a class room and I go into a coma. I grew up on a farm and don't feel that I am lazy but for me school sucked. I have a good job and I doubt any illegal can do it. But I know good folks who have been lowballed out their trades by illegals. No citizen should have to deal with that.
Ahhh, so there we have it. Illegals went to construction contractors offices and said, in Spanish, I'll work for $5.00 an hour as a framer and a roofer. I don't think so tin.
Is it stupid Americans standing on street corners waiting for the contractor to come by in their pick up truck who might be hiring for day, week, month? <very heavy sarcasm here>
No wonder I don't normally post in this immigration forum, some people make no sense at all.
You fail in understanding even what is being discussed. Lets refresh.... you claimed you left this forum because of the name calling....you were called un-American....yada, yada, yada.
I found a post where you called Obama un-American, hence you were name calling, ya'know the same thing that you left this forum for. Do you even get my point?
You might be interested in this also. Sounds like someone needs to address their own hypocricy. Scroll down to the last post. Quote: " You are un-American when you support illegals entering the US illegallly when there is no demand for them, support illegals who take from Americans in more ways than one"
Ahhh, so there we have it. Illegals went to construction contractors offices and said, in Spanish, I'll work for $5.00 an hour as a framer and a roofer. I don't think so tin.
Is it stupid Americans standing on street corners waiting for the contractor to come by in their pick up truck who might be hiring for day, week, month? <very heavy sarcasm here>
No wonder I don't normally post in this immigration forum, some people make no sense at all.
I give up, you conservatives win the debate.
Come on Jive I made no such statement. The illegals didn't show up in mass, it was a gradual affair. And yes they did force legals out because they can do it cheaper. They dont have to pay the taxes or back their work.
I never met a drywall contractor standing on a corner waiting for a builder to hire them. Builders learned that they could find the illegals by trolling the home depot parking lots etc. Legals have been forced from their trades and this is only one piece of the problem.
One can argue that illegals are hard workers. So are americans. One can not argue that this country can't survive without illegals.
Why should legal citizens be forced to find new trades so that illegals can make a living?
Go get an education? That costs money and they lost their career. What of their own families who depend upon them? Should Legal citizens go without so that illegals can thrive?
Tutors and interpreters. Why should this nation facilitate criminal behaviors?
Simply amazing that anyone would suggest that Americans give up the jobs they enjoy to illegal aliens, isn't it? Construction, landscaping, etc. use to pay a living wage for an American to feed their families until the arrival of cheap, illegal labor. We have always had a large blue-collared workforce and as I said many Americans enjoy physical work rather than sitting at a desk all day but they should give up those jobs to foreingners who don't even have a right to work or reside in this country? WTH!!
As for the employers that hire them someone has a selective reading problem because we have all said that the employers are also to blame and that they should be severely punished and e-verify implemented to stop them from their unlawful hiring practices. Note once again though that this person never blames the illegals at all. They are both equally guilty! Yeah, these illegals are just the innocents in all of this. What wharped thinking!
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They can't even keep track of visa overstayers! It would be very costly to monitor all that anyway. The bottom line is that we don't need these people and it makes no sense to reward them for breaking our immigration laws. If those jobs they are holding were freed up for Americans they in turn would be bolstering our economy. There are only 50 million Hispanics in this country including the illegal alien kind. Gee that means there are 265 million non-Hispanics in this country. Yet you think that Hispanics are some kind of answer to our economy and the big answer to propping it up? 
