[uswith6]

What about the University of Iowa?

Department of Teaching and Learning - The University of Iowa College of Education (http://www.education.uiowa.edu/teach/programs/ - broken link)

Many times the colleges outside Michigan are cheaper then the state Universities or on par with them
plus aid is sometimes easier to get -- when they try to broaden where there students come from.

[uswith6]

another:

Heidelberg College: Bachelor of Music: Music Education (http://www.heidelberg.edu/academiclife/academicinformation/departments/music/bachelorofmusiced - broken link)

[Coldjensens]

Originally Posted by mewith3

What about the University of Iowa?

Department of Teaching and Learning - The University of Iowa College of Education (http://www.education.uiowa.edu/teach/programs/ - broken link)

Many times the colleges outside Michigan are cheaper then the state Universities or on par with them
plus aid is sometimes easier to get -- when they try to broaden where there students come from.

Thank you. I will pass this along. Probably too big for her. My parents both went to Iowa State, I should suggest that they look there as well.

[Coldjensens]

Originally Posted by mewith3

another:

Heidelberg College: Bachelor of Music: Music Education (http://www.heidelberg.edu/academiclife/academicinformation/departments/music/bachelorofmusiced - broken link)

Thank you. This looks like it might be an appealing option for her. Small school anyway. We will have to try to find out what kind of reputation the school has. Terribly expensive, but scholarships are usually abundant at these types of schools.

Their admissions requriements are pretty low. Is this a good school? One advantage to a school where she substnatially exceeds their admission requriements is that they may offer very good scholarships. Money (or the lack thereof) is going to be a significant problem. Either one of them will only be able to attend schools that offer them substantail scholarships. With two of them starting at the same time, it will be very difficult. Especially in this economy. I do nto want them to take out a bunch of loans because it will be very hard to pay back (especially for the one who wants to be a music teacher).

[Dwatted Wabbit]

Originally Posted by suydam

I just read about it on their site... very cool concept. Thanks for sending me off to do research, it was enlightening.

You're correct, most private schools accept things like the Michigan Tuition Grant, which it sure looks like Hillsdale avoids.

Thanks again.

You are very welcome.

Originally Posted by Hans64

Hillsdale is an extremely right-wing institution and if your child is interested in hearing other viewpoints you will not get it there. Within the wealthy Detroit suburbs where I grew up Hillsdale is somewhat regarded as a second-tier private school for students that did not perform exceptionally in high school. The school has a very conservative social climate that some parents seem to like because the college itself serves "in loco parentis".

Both Kalamazoo and Albion are stronger academically and are held in much higher regard.

It depends on your perspective regarding what is "extremely right wing" and what is "extremely left wing." IMO most colleges today, led by Harvard and Yale and Berkeley, are so far left that the communist party would have no problem loving them.

You might consider why you so rarely hear the term "extremely left wing" or "extremely liberal" while you frequently hear the opposite.

Just FYI, the "wealthy Detroit suburbs" where you grew up are considered enclaves of bumpkins and hayseeds by the elitist east coast/left coast snots at Haavahd, Yale, Berkeley, et al.

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

It cannot be a schools for underperformers. Looking a tthe admission requirements that they sent us, no underperformers are going to get admitted.

Yes, it is not Ferris State. Funny how the left doesn't want even one institution uninfected by the PC disorder that has turned many colleges from places to learn and to think into indoctrination tanks for the politically correct.

[suydam]

I don't buy that there's some leftist conspiracy to keep Hillsdale under the thumb of Ferris State.

I do think you can look at who gets admitted and get a sense of the student body. Regardless of what people in Rochester or Birmingham think of Hillsdale or Kalamazoo you can check and see what someone like US News thinks.

Sure, they have a liberal slant according to some... but they rate Wheaton College (which is decidedly NOT liberal) ahead of Kalamazoo College (which they rate 60th in the country, the highest rated liberal arts school in Michigan).

Michigan is well represented in their list of the top 122 liberal arts colleges in the country, though I find it disappointing we have nothing in the top 50. I was also intrigued that they stopped their ranking at exactly 122. Go figure.

Michigan Schools:

• 60th - Kalamazoo College
• 88th - Hope College
• 98th - Hillsdale College
• 104th - Albion College
• 115th - Calvin College

[Coldjensens]

Those "ratings" are not of much use. Their criteria include conformance to social agenda. I do not know exactly what USN& WR uses, but most of these ratings weigh in such things as "diversity" "Socially disadvantaged backgrounds" ant other things that have nothing whatsoever to do withthe quality of academics. They also place importance on the notariety of the professors. I think that us a useless criteria. I attended a school that was loaded with highly regarded professors. They advised the president and the Supreme COurt among others. They were great at analysis and writing books. However many of them were just terrrible at teaching. Others we never around to teach. They were always flying off to do important things and were were taught by whomever the university could find to fill in.

I have been told by students, including left leaning students that Hillsdale is labeled are right wing extreme only becasue they lack the extreme left liberal indoctrination that is so prevelant at most other colleges and universites. What I was told is that the teaching is more neutral or centrist with perhaps a slight right lean (the left leaning student said that it has a slight right wing tint, while the other students/former students said it has no political leaning whatsoever , but this is considered extreme because the liberal left is missing altogether. I tend to weight the viewpoint of people who actually attended Hillsdale more heavily than people who have never even been there. There are some posts online that claim that the school is extremely right leaning, but those same posts go on to take such absurd posiitions on other things, that it is hard to give them much credibility.

I would love to find a school with no extremeist professors at all. I would prefer to let my children make their own choices rather than being hounded by social indoctrination in school (like I was), but I am not sure that there is a truly neutral place. If Hillsdale leans raght a bit but is not extreme that is probably better than the typical radical left indoctrination that seems ot be prevalent at most colleges and universities (and even in the high schoools these days).

[dutchinnd]

Again, these are out-of-state options, but Minnesota has a very strong music tradition. Have they looked at St. Olaf or Concordia College (that's Moorhead, MN, not Ann Arbor)? Okay, disclaimer--my husband works for Cord. But there is a wide variety within the faculty between more liberal and conservative. It's not unusual for faculty in the humanities to tend toward the left and faculty in the hard sciences to tend toward the right. At Concordia specifically, the Board of Regents has several conservative members of which the faculty and administration are well aware.
Concordia has a very strong music ed program, and my kids right now enjoy that benefit in the excellent music teachers they have in elementary and middle schools.

[dutchinnd]

One other point I was going to make--beyond selectivity ratings, look at average SAT/ACT scores of those registered/attending, not just those accepted. That will give a strong indication of academic climate as well.