The problem of women saying they don't like having lots of girlfriends. (talks, acquaintance)
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maciesmom Of course sometimes people are treated wrongly. And of course one who is treated wrongly should move on.
Have no idea what this has to do with the topic at hand. Men as well as women can be on both the giving and receiving end of tgat. If it is something that repeats itself regularly, it's time for some introspection though. That's true about many things, not just relationships and gender.
What it has to do with is your comment....
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maciesmom
MY experience is that people whose experience with one sex is predominantly negative, need to ask themselves what their part in that has to do with themselves, their biases or their inability to choose friends wisely.
we don't all sabbatoge relationships with women, or make blanket statements b/c we didn't experience disloyalty from other women b/c we are dysfunctional in picking friends...
relationships with friends, need time to nurture, need time to get to know each other, and to see if we have some common ground...and in the past few years, I've learned to look for good and bad qualities...but when someone hurts you, then its time to re-think the relationship...I'm glad, maciesmom, that I found out, but for me, winning and loosing women friends have been a life experience, all in itself....I'm sorry if I've offended you in any way...
I do enough with regard to educating people about DV and supporting a woman's right for autonomy over her own body. I fail to see, though, why "supporting women" means ignoring an entire other gender when it comes to opportunities to have good friendships. Not every man is the enemy and like I said before, many of them are our allies. Being friends with men and supporting the rights of women aren't mutually exclusive.
I agree. And it's the man-hating aspect of feminism that really turns me off.
I had one woman tell me that other women had hurt her more than any man ever had. And she had been in some abusive relationships with men, but she said her experiences with disloyal and cruel women were far worse. I was young when she told me this. As time went on, I began to see her point. I've also seen many women refuse to train or mentor other women in the workplace, but I noticed they were always ready and willing to help a man, in most cases.
Feminists act like it's mostly men who abuse children and commit domestic violence. This is a myth. There are just as many women who abuse children, possibly more. There are also a lot of women who are violent toward their spouses.
I agree. And it's the man-hating aspect of feminism that really turns me off.
I had one woman tell me that other women had hurt her more than any man ever had. And she had been in some abusive relationships with men, but she said her experiences with disloyal and cruel women were far worse. I was young when she told me this. As time went on, I began to see her point. I've also seen many women refuse to train or mentor other women in the workplace, but I noticed they were always ready and willing to help a man, in most cases.
Feminists act like it's mostly men who abuse children and commit domestic violence. This is a myth. There are just as many women who abuse children, possibly more. There are also a lot of women who are violent toward their spouses.
I had a friend just like this and would always tell me how bad, catty, b***hy women can be. I ignored that at first but then the red flags started to surface. She herself was mean as hell and she yelled at an autistic girl once. A few nights ago she screamed at me over the phone and I hung up on her. Other women weren't the problem, she was. I haven't spoken to her since but she keeps texting me.
Yes, I have also known people like this. Each and every woman I've ever heard say that they don't like women because of how they are so (insert insult of choice), turns out they are the ugliest human beings to other women. No wonder other women don't like them!
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Originally Posted by maciesmom
The issue is not your personal experience but your claim that your experience is somehow representative of more, most, all...women (and I would say the same if someone said the same about men). Your experience is your experience only. It does not represent women as a group.
MY experience is that people whose experience with one sex is predominantly negative, need to ask themselves what their part in that has to do with themselves, their biases or their inability to choose friends wisely.
Bingo.
People are different (of course), have different interests, and therefore will form different sorts of relationships. I'm also an INTJ woman, and most of my interests are considered "male". I play hockey, play the drums, do home renos and get all dirty, used to mountain bike, love math and all those sorts of things.
I'm not unique, even if my interests aren't particularly common. I spent my youth and early adulthood playing sports with guys, hanging out with guys, and got along in some ways better with guys in general than with girls in general. But the best friends I've ever had were women who also shared my same interests.
Yes, I have also known people like this. Each and every woman I've ever heard say that they don't like women because of how they are so (insert insult of choice), turns out they are the ugliest human beings to other women. No wonder other women don't like them!
Bingo.
People are different (of course), have different interests, and therefore will form different sorts of relationships. I'm also an INTJ woman, and most of my interests are considered "male". I play hockey, play the drums, do home renos and get all dirty, used to mountain bike, love math and all those sorts of things.
I'm not unique, even if my interests aren't particularly common. I spent my youth and early adulthood playing sports with guys, hanging out with guys, and got along in some ways better with guys in general than with girls in general. But the best friends I've ever had were women who also shared my same interests.
I grew up with guys to, played all the sports, and generally had more guy friends then female friends, but the female friends I have now....are not only unique, but we have a good solid relationship...and they are not all like I am, one of them hates gardening, but we have so many other things in common.
And most of these ladies, feel exactly the same way I do about females....
I'm not fond of females as a whole, but, I've also known some truly awesome woman. I've got younger women at work, who come and share family personal things with me, and they feel the same way about women as a whole...so....
Not everyone who is not fond of women, is a mean woman or dysfuncational....sorry, not true.
I truly take offense to anyone who feels differently on the subject, (then I or my friends) and feel they have to label it as some kind of dysfunction....
yes, a lot of times in my case I chose the wrong friends, but in more cases then not, I chose correctly....as I said, I'm talking through experience, and that's ok....I figure I've earned it.
Last edited by cremebrulee; 02-21-2017 at 10:20 AM..
Of course .... it's not a question of whether they are 'allowed' to make friends with whomever they please. The question is whether they should feel any obligation at all to their own sex because of the second class position that sex has been relegated to and it's attempts to free itself of that position.
In other words, should women be obliged to try, as best they are able, to help women in general toward a societal reform where both sexes are treated equally?
The answer to your last question is yes. But societal reform has nothing to do with who you have as friends. I'm not going to select friends based upon their gender, age, race, marital status, or position in society. I choose them based upon common interests or an affinity for their personality. I'm talking about a friendship that develops naturally from being around one another and recognizing a good heart and a kindred soul. I have friends of all races, ages, orientations, etc, but it just so happens that a MAJORITY (not all) of them are male. My closest friends are female, but they number 1 or 2 usually. The poster asked about having LOTS of girlfriends, which I don't, and never have, had. Class struggle most certainly does not enter into my choice of friends. What do girlfriends have to do with reforming society? It would be better to ask if we've ever participated in the political process, or done any work to help promote equality.
The answer to your last question is yes. But societal reform has nothing to do with who you have as friends. I'm not going to select friends based upon their gender, age, race, marital status, or position in society. I choose them based upon common interests or an affinity for their personality. I'm talking about a friendship that develops naturally from being around one another and recognizing a good heart and a kindred soul. I have friends of all races, ages, orientations, etc, but it just so happens that a MAJORITY (not all) of them are male. My closest friends are female, but they number 1 or 2 usually. The poster asked about having LOTS of girlfriends, which I don't, and never have, had. Class struggle most certainly does not enter into my choice of friends. What do girlfriends have to do with reforming society? It would be better to ask if we've ever participated in the political process, or done any work to help promote equality.
I see your point. I don't have a problem with what you are saying. I do have a problem with some other comments on here that are quite derogatory toward women.
If I were to judge, based on this thread, it might appear that it is not men who are holding women down.
If women behave badly, maybe they're holding themselves down? If you think of life in those terms. I didn't realize there was "affirmative action" for friends.
I grew up with guys to, played all the sports, and generally had more guy friends then female friends, but the female friends I have now....are not only unique, but we have a good solid relationship...and they are not all like I am, one of them hates gardening, but we have so many other things in common.
And most of these ladies, feel exactly the same way I do about females....
I'm not fond of females as a whole, but, I've also known some truly awesome woman. I've got younger women at work, who come and share family personal things with me, and they feel the same way about women as a whole...so....
Not everyone who is not fond of women, is a mean woman or dysfuncational....sorry, not true.
I truly take offense to anyone who feels differently on the subject, (then I or my friends) and feel they have to label it as some kind of dysfunction....
yes, a lot of times in my case I chose the wrong friends, but in more cases then not, I chose correctly....as I said, I'm talking through experience, and that's ok....I figure I've earned it.
I challenge you to change 'women/females' for 'blacks' or any other group that has suffered discrimination. And guys/men for 'whites'.
Whether male or female or black or white, I wouldn't want to be browbeaten about politics every minute I was with a "friend." People really need to chill out.
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