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Old 11-25-2016, 06:28 AM
 
66,558 posts, read 30,358,972 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
I'm anti- government being allowed to funnel poor kids into subpar public schools.
As am I. That grossly disproportionately harms minority kids. I simply can't understand how liberals justify that. Unless they're willing to flat out admit they want to maintain a permanently dumbed down and poor Dem voter base.
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Old 11-25-2016, 06:30 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
As am I. That grossly disproportionately harms minority kids. I simply can't understand how liberals justify that. Unless they're willing to flat out admit they want to maintain a permanently dumbed down and poor Dem voter base.
Except vouchers don't really help poor kids or minorities. Milwaukee has had vouchers for over 25 years, and educational outcomes have not been fixed. Draining Milwaukee Public Schools of financial resources has not made them better, either.
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Old 11-25-2016, 06:43 AM
 
17,810 posts, read 19,821,142 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaseMan View Post
Except vouchers don't really help poor kids or minorities. Milwaukee has had vouchers for over 25 years, and educational outcomes have not been fixed. Draining Milwaukee Public Schools of financial resources has not made them better, either.
What educational outcomes are you looking for? It drains Public Schools of money without expectation of success... which is a good thing, you expect success to get the money.... parents who have the vouchers will measure that success and perhaps the outcome YOU wanted is not the same outcome that the parent's wanted... vouchers does one thing and one thing only, it empowers the parents over the teachers... and teachers hate that... teachers can no longer choose who succeeds and who does not... parent's can choose the success of their kids...
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Old 11-25-2016, 06:45 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
7,215 posts, read 7,916,204 times
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Originally Posted by evilnewbie View Post
What educational outcomes are you looking for?
The fact that you have to ask this shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. The rest of your post was some tiresome teacher bashing that is becoming more and more passe.
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Old 11-25-2016, 06:49 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaseMan View Post
The fact that you have to ask this shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. The rest of your post was some tiresome teacher bashing that is becoming more and more passe.
I said what are YOU looking for... apparently reading comprehension was not taught in your school....
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Old 11-25-2016, 06:49 AM
 
8,823 posts, read 4,731,210 times
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Think vouchers for low income families to attend private and public school is a good thing, if this is what it entails. Also for towns/cities with multiple schools. Parents/Children should have the option to go to their school in their location. However, should if parents opt to can apply to a lottery selection that would try to place the Child in the 3 public schools of choice in the City/Town. In hopes make Schools focus on becoming equal across the board with education/services. Eventually do away with Department of Education and transfer powers to the States. Allow schools to make their own choices. Allow States/Towns manage and allocate funding for education their own way. Do away with Common Core and Standardized Testing. States evaluate school's every six months release data that evaluates schools strong points and weak points.

Only two issue's I could get behind with Federal Government involvement is nationwide standard qualifications to be a teacher and a bill passed creating a minimum teachers salary of $65,000 a year.

Last edited by RunD1987; 11-25-2016 at 07:04 AM..
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Old 11-25-2016, 06:50 AM
 
66,558 posts, read 30,358,972 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaseMan View Post
Except vouchers don't really help poor kids or minorities. Milwaukee has had vouchers for over 25 years, and educational outcomes have not been fixed. Draining Milwaukee Public Schools of financial resources has not made them better, either.
It depends on where the vouchers can be used. If they're only for public charter schools, the same problems are present that exist in the public school system. If they can be used at private schools, both Time Magazine and the Washington DC voucher program have found better educational results among the voucher students. On my phone now, but I'll post links in a bit.
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Old 11-25-2016, 06:51 AM
 
66,558 posts, read 30,358,972 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilnewbie View Post
What educational outcomes are you looking for? It drains Public Schools of money without expectation of success... which is a good thing, you expect success to get the money.... parents who have the vouchers will measure that success and perhaps the outcome YOU wanted is not the same outcome that the parent's wanted... vouchers does one thing and one thing only, it empowers the parents over the teachers... and teachers hate that... teachers can no longer choose who succeeds and who does not... parent's can choose the success of their kids...
Very well-stated.
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Old 11-25-2016, 07:04 AM
 
Location: Northern NJ/Amagansett, NY
11,008 posts, read 10,207,437 times
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The democrats always like to say that charter schools are "draining" tax dollars from the public schools. I am wondering, if you are removing the income, but simultaneously removing the expense, how is it draining anything? Isn't it a wash? For example, in my home state of NJ, we pay upwards of $30K per student per year in the poorest school districts. So if you take away that $30K, but you also take away that student that is costing $30K, it seems like it is neutral to me, not a loss. With less students, the schools use less resources and needs to pay less teachers and administrators.

I don't pretend to know a whole lot about this issue, so I would like someone to explain to me how this is "draining" tax dollars from public schools.

Why am I not to believe that this is nothing more than the democrats supporting and defending the public school teacher's union?
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Old 11-25-2016, 07:06 AM
 
17,810 posts, read 19,821,142 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnesthesiaMD View Post
The democrats always like to say that charter schools are "draining" tax dollars from the public schools. I am wondering, if you are removing the income, but simultaneously removing the expense, how is it draining anything? Isn't it a wash? For example, in my home state of NJ, we pay upwards of $30K per student per year in the poorest school districts. So if you take away that $30K, but you also take away that student that is costing $30K, it seems like it is neutral to me, not a loss. With less students, the schools use less resources and needs to pay less teachers and administrators.

I don't pretend to know a whole lot about this issue, so I would like someone to explain to me how this is "draining" tax dollars from public schools.

Why am I not to believe that this is nothing more than the democrats supporting the public school teacher's union?
Probably by volume discount... 3 students at 30k each together will only cost 70k, so a 20k left over...
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