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The people you don't care for... many of them came here and worked for some of the same american's that you support.. they did not come here and just do nothing, they were the house keepers, the pickers, the planters, the construction workers, the eatery workers and any other jobs that American did not want to give to poor whites a minorities, they gave it to the Illegal immigrants, they attracted them here by the long tradition of using them as cheap labor. If you want to blame anyone blame American people.
For decades, people bragged about their Mexican or Latin American house keeper, their handi man and contractors could not wait to get up early and rush out to pick up van loads for their projects.
The electric company this very day, has set up to cater to Mexicans, who are either on green card or brought in as contract labor, to go along the electric lines and trim the trees back.
American people could be doing these jobs, but the Electric company knows it has to pay a living wage and it has to cover them under Workers Comp if they get hurt. If they can hire Illegal, or people new to the green card program or migrant contract workers, they can by pass all of this. And the American People support it. It's not like the people are blind and don't see who is cutting these trees and climbing to the top to trim the limbs... American's don't care.... they just want the trees trimmed and the electric company don't care because they want the job done as cheap as they can get it .....
Next time you go to some fancy eatery, ask them to give you a tour through the kitchen and dish-washing areas? Guaranteed they will find an excuse why that can't be done.
The average Illegal Immigrant comes to find work, they don't come to steal or create crime, they just want to work and send money home to their family... and many after a while simply build a life here...
If anything, Deal with the people whom are already here, help them get legit, the gang and crime members send them back... or lock them up. But the decent working people.. Help them... the same as we are so eager to help the Chinese, the Russian, or any other people who come from a nation where peoples skin is not black or brown.
This ignores the point: they have come here illegally, which means they are lawbreakers from day 1.
If we are a "nation of laws" we can't pick and choose which laws we will enforce, which we will ignore in some cases and not in others.
Wow! How do you post such ignorance? The prior poster is correct - there is no such thing as American culture because then you would have to further define what is an American. And from your post, it's clearly not any person that doesn't hail from Europe. So the Chinese-Americans who celebrate Chinese New Year is not American? The Indian-American who has elephants at his/her wedding is not American? Where do you get off saying such things?
You are flat out wrong. There is just no other way to put it. There is an American culture. Anyone outside of America looking in can define it. Why can't you?
Everything you posted in the paragraph above in no way conflicts with what I wrote. Chinese Americans celebrating Chinese new year (it's right there in the title) ARE Americans... engaging in a non-American celebration. They continue to be American unless ALL they do is ever celebrate Chinese traditions, only speak Chinese, have no interest in American holidays, etc.
There is also probably an American way to celebrate Chinese New Year. I am not Chinese, so I cannot distinguish. But I guarantee just as we celebrate St. Patrick's Day "American" style as compared to how the Irish do it.... it's probably not "authentic"... but Chinese New Year really has no relevance to anyone who isn't Chinese. I go to Chinese New Year Celebration every year, thrown by non-Chinese speaking friends of Chinese-descent.... and while it's fun, it has no significance to me or 99% of other Americans who don't happen to be Chinese.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TallBull
America is a melting pot of people and cultures because that's what defines America - it is Greek, Irish, Haitian, Puerto Rican, Vietnamese, and Mexican to mention a few. It's straight, gay, transgender. It's Catholic, Protestant, Muslim, Jewish, Athiest and so on. If you're not a first-nation person, you're an immigrant to these lands and you brought your own beliefs, cultures, and practices with you. In other words, you're an immigrant. Now you may be more far-removed from immigrant status as say someone who arrived more recently. But you're not indigenous to America.
Your self-righteous indignation and virtue signalling is getting in the way of your critical thinking skills.
The byproduct of that melted pot - the ACTUAL melted pot - IS American culture. Now, cultures may evolve. American culture has evolved and changed over the years, and has incorporated different traditions into what is norm for the majority of people, regardless of their backgrounds.
What's funny to me is that you seem to accept that "Mexican" can be an identifiable culture, which I agree. But then you seem to forget (or maybe not know) that all Latin America is an immigration destination and melting pot of various cultures as well. They are simply a different mixture than what we have in the US, which is different than Canada's, which for example is heavily French influenced.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TallBull
You're on a forum where no one can see you. So keep it real and say what you mean by "traditional" and "typical". Can someone who has Syrian roots or African roots be "traditional" when they worship or dress? C'mon man! It's 2017. This country is browner and more diverse than it has ever been in its history. When you say ethnic, who or what are you referring to? Mohawk, Lakota, Cherokee? Irish, German, English? El Salvadoran, Panamanian? Ghanian, Beninese?
Answers?
Ethnic food means just that. A food associated with the culture or tradition of another nation. Even restaurant reviews will be able to make the distinction between "American" fare and other types of ethnic foods. Why is it so difficult for you?
And look, before you have an aneurysm, I am first generation. My father, all my aunts and uncles, etc. are immigrants. I don't need - what are most often white privileged liberals - telling ME about an immigrant experience, traditions and integration. I grew up with one foot planted in two cultures so I can spot difference. I can spot authentic vs. Americanized. I can appreciate the melding of peoples as they move from the ethnic ghetto into society at large.
Traditional means exactly that - I have been to very many weddings in my time. Of various religions. Most weddings celebrated by Americans who aren't new or first generation will follow a typical formula after the religious component.
If one is to veer from that, that's OK. But it's not an "American style" wedding. Anything anyone else in the world can describe as "American style ______" is describing OUR CULTURE. Which yes, is the end result of mixing over hundreds of years. If you would like to educate yourself on this, go to google and type in "American Style..." You will get suggestions for:
American style clothing, fashion, movies, magazines, homes, foods....
Walking around in a hijab is not American. It is a foreign practice in America. We don't do that here. Wearing a burkini to the pool is also not American. That's a foreign tradition. It didn't develop here. Hopefully it won't catch on here unless leftists are successful in normalizing backwards third world traditions into American culture. Just as we haven't normalized and incorporated Amish dress styles or Hari Krishna gowns into what is American fashion. Those are fringe cultural practices. They are not "mainstream American" just because they "exist in America." They could be, someday. But hopefully not. It will be a sad day when American sportswear is associated with burkas.
And no, everyone else who lives exactly as they did "back home" while in the US is NOT "just as American" as everyone else. Politically, yes. Vote-wise, yes. Census wise, sure. For passport purposes, OK.
But for any other purpose? Eh....not really. And it's not MY fault that they are seen that way. It's THEIR fault. THEIR choice. I have no obligation to view someone who doesn't speak English, takes no effort to consume American media or interact with Americans on a personal level to understand our cultural mores, etc. as "American" as apple pie. They aren't. No matter how much you jump up and down. Maybe their kids will be. Or grandkids. Most likely by great-grandkids at least.
And I totally get it. My grandparents came here, became American citizens, but they were not ever really American. They left to go back to the old country when they retired, and died happy in the old country. And that's OK. The rest of us here know how to identify as AMERICAN first with respect for our roots.
Multiculturalism has been causing strife in the USA since the 1700s, when English Americans were alarmed at hordes of Germans and Scots Irish coming ashore. In the 1900s there was fear about Catholic immigrants coming in and being more loyal to the Pope than the President. Historically we have chosen immigration over maintain homogeneity because it helps economic growth. What happens is after a while the immigrants assimilate and intermarriage blurs the lines of Us and Them. 100 years from now I suspect they will look at today's anti immigrant hysteria the way we view anti Irish hysteria of the 1900s.
I'm listening currently to a fascinating talk between Douglas Murray and Mark Steyn right now (available on Youtube).
It all seems to boil down to foods for multiculturalists. And often, that's the really cool at first. The first Afghan immigrant can introduce you to his culture and foods. A handful will give some more of that. But by the 100 thousandth Afghan you're getting diminishing returns, and THEIR cultural expectations start to compete with the host country. Afghans have no problem asserting and holding on to their identity. Neither do the Japanese or Koreans.
But westerners? Canadians? Americans? Europeans? Well, you embrace that damn change to the fabric of your societies and culture or else you're a small minded nazi bigot!
Also, multiculturalism is in fact, boring. Only when every capital of Europe has been turned into the same boring repetition of kebab shops and halal burger joints, and the cathedral spires converted to minarets will they wake up. Or maybe they won't. It's also always funny to me how "diverse" or "multicultural" often refers to places and neighborhoods which are mono-ethnic. They just have to be non-white and suddenly they are "diverse!" Well, no, a place that is 95% black is actually NOT diverse. A pakistani borough is NOT diverse.
Unfortunately, the conditioning of the European and Western mind to believe they have nothing to offer (despite the entire rest of the world being attracted to their cultures in the first place) is pathological at this point.
The people you don't care for... many of them came here and worked for some of the same american's that you support.. they did not come here and just do nothing, they were the house keepers, the pickers, the planters, the construction workers, the eatery workers and any other jobs that American did not want to give to poor whites or to minorities, they gave it to the Illegal immigrants, they attracted them here by the long tradition of using them as cheap labor. If you want to blame anyone blame American people.
For decades, people bragged about their Mexican or Latin American house keeper, their handi man and contractors could not wait to get up early and rush out to pick up van loads for their projects.
The electric company this very day, has set up to cater to Mexicans, who are either on green card or brought in as contract labor, to go along the electric lines and trim the trees back.
American people could be doing these jobs, but the Electric company knows it has to pay a living wage and it has to cover them under Workers Comp if they get hurt. If they can hire Illegal, or people new to the green card program or migrant contract workers, they can by pass all of this. And the American People support it. It's not like the people are blind and don't see who is cutting these trees and climbing to the top to trim the limbs... American's don't care.... they just want the trees trimmed and the electric company don't care because they want the job done as cheap as they can get it ..... when these people get hurt, they dump them, hire another and have not a second thought about it, and line them up to be deported if they can. American has not changed it still has systems structure to abuse people and thenwhine and complain about the people it has abused. heck, they did it to black people for centuries and still do it, when they can no longer use them for free or next to nothing, they want to denigrate them by any and every means possible and then shun them in civic and social matters.
Next time you go to some fancy eatery, ask them to give you a tour through the kitchen and dish-washing areas? Guaranteed they will find an excuse why that can't be done.
The average Illegal Immigrant comes to find work, they don't come to steal or create crime, they just want to work and send money home to their family... and many after a while simply build a life here...
If anything, Deal with the people whom are already here, help them get legit, the gang and crime members send them back... or lock them up. But the decent working people.. Help them... the same as we are so eager to help the Chinese, the Russian, or any other people who come from a nation where peoples skin is not black or brown.
The vast majority of those complaining about illegal immigration would still be complaining if Russians or Chinese people were streaming across the border .
This ignores the point: they have come here illegally, which means they are lawbreakers from day 1.
If we are a "nation of laws" we can't pick and choose which laws we will enforce, which we will ignore in some cases and not in others.
You are so adamant, do you know whether your ancestry came here legally? No you don't.... you assume....
I'm not advocating for this nation to be flooded with illegals, but I also think they should not get an instant picture of Mexicans in their mind when the world Illegal Immigrant is used. Most white people are not concerned about the Various Easter Europeans or Asian's, especially if they have money.
Money become more the matter, than Illegal Immigrants, because if it was about Illegal Immigrants, the picture in peoples mind would not just be of Mexicans...
this is nothing new... it was done in the 1930's after the Railroads were built, it was done to the Chinese.
what is Wrong with some American people... who think they can use others until they had their fill, then say, "Go home"!!!
Now with people like the Republican in Office and Trump and his agenda, more and more American are trying to get to these same countries, they once complained about the people from those countries coming here. Only American want to go there and they want "instant acceptance".....
The more Republican Screw Up America, the worst it will be for "all people" and standard habit for "SOME" white people is, when things get financially challenged or bad for them, SOME white people's racism becomes elevated to a fever pitch... !!!!!
Now that China is prosperous and Americans are angry because the Chinese now have all the Money American use to have... NOW, the same greedy slave chasing university grads who were taught to chase slave labor are not pushing to move anything they can to Mexico, and next they will try to change Central America so they can ship more Industry looking for more slave wage labor. That's the Imperialist Madness that is Taught at these Ivy League and the Network of Top Tier University. They teach a format of covert "economic treason" against the generalized American public, all for the sake of chasing slave labor around the globe, at the expense of a stable living standard for American people.
You are flat out wrong. There is just no other way to put it. There is an American culture. Anyone outside of America looking in can define it. Why can't you?
Everything you posted in the paragraph above in no way conflicts with what I wrote. Chinese Americans celebrating Chinese new year (it's right there in the title) ARE Americans... engaging in a non-American celebration. They continue to be American unless ALL they do is ever celebrate Chinese traditions, only speak Chinese, have no interest in American holidays, etc.
There is also probably an American way to celebrate Chinese New Year. I am not Chinese, so I cannot distinguish. But I guarantee just as we celebrate St. Patrick's Day "American" style as compared to how the Irish do it.... it's probably not "authentic"... but Chinese New Year really has no relevance to anyone who isn't Chinese. I go to Chinese New Year Celebration every year, thrown by non-Chinese speaking friends of Chinese-descent.... and while it's fun, it has no significance to me or 99% of other Americans who don't happen to be Chinese.
Your self-righteous indignation and virtue signalling is getting in the way of your critical thinking skills.
The byproduct of that melted pot - the ACTUAL melted pot - IS American culture. Now, cultures may evolve. American culture has evolved and changed over the years, and has incorporated different traditions into what is norm for the majority of people, regardless of their backgrounds.
What's funny to me is that you seem to accept that "Mexican" can be an identifiable culture, which I agree. But then you seem to forget (or maybe not know) that all Latin America is an immigration destination and melting pot of various cultures as well. They are simply a different mixture than what we have in the US, which is different than Canada's, which for example is heavily French influenced.
Ethnic food means just that. A food associated with the culture or tradition of another nation. Even restaurant reviews will be able to make the distinction between "American" fare and other types of ethnic foods. Why is it so difficult for you?
And look, before you have an aneurysm, I am first generation. My father, all my aunts and uncles, etc. are immigrants. I don't need - what are most often white privileged liberals - telling ME about an immigrant experience, traditions and integration. I grew up with one foot planted in two cultures so I can spot difference. I can spot authentic vs. Americanized. I can appreciate the melding of peoples as they move from the ethnic ghetto into society at large.
Traditional means exactly that - I have been to very many weddings in my time. Of various religions. Most weddings celebrated by Americans who aren't new or first generation will follow a typical formula after the religious component.
If one is to veer from that, that's OK. But it's not an "American style" wedding. Anything anyone else in the world can describe as "American style ______" is describing OUR CULTURE. Which yes, is the end result of mixing over hundreds of years. If you would like to educate yourself on this, go to google and type in "American Style..." You will get suggestions for:
American style clothing, fashion, movies, magazines, homes, foods....
Walking around in a hijab is not American. It is a foreign practice in America. We don't do that here. Wearing a burkini to the pool is also not American. That's a foreign tradition. It didn't develop here. Hopefully it won't catch on here unless leftists are successful in normalizing backwards third world traditions into American culture. Just as we haven't normalized and incorporated Amish dress styles or Hari Krishna gowns into what is American fashion. Those are fringe cultural practices. They are not "mainstream American" just because they "exist in America." They could be, someday. But hopefully not. It will be a sad day when American sportswear is associated with burkas.
And no, everyone else who lives exactly as they did "back home" while in the US is NOT "just as American" as everyone else. Politically, yes. Vote-wise, yes. Census wise, sure. For passport purposes, OK.
But for any other purpose? Eh....not really. And it's not MY fault that they are seen that way. It's THEIR fault. THEIR choice. I have no obligation to view someone who doesn't speak English, takes no effort to consume American media or interact with Americans on a personal level to understand our cultural mores, etc. as "American" as apple pie. They aren't. No matter how much you jump up and down. Maybe their kids will be. Or grandkids. Most likely by great-grandkids at least.
And I totally get it. My grandparents came here, became American citizens, but they were not ever really American. They left to go back to the old country when they retired, and died happy in the old country. And that's OK. The rest of us here know how to identify as AMERICAN first with respect for our roots.
Excellent post! Those who say we have no American culture will still remain in denial though. It doesn't suit their agenda.
And what is it supposed to look like after the melting is complete? I think we all know the answer, but I'd like to see someone spell it out.
I really want to know what is so awful about different people living together and getting along with each other while maintaining pieces of their own backgrounds.
Nothing.
There is NOTHING wrong with different people living together and getting along. He did not say there was.
He is rightly criticizing trying to force the issue via government diktat and social engineering.
Diversity in of itself is fine. It just is.
Diversity as an intent, a social policy, a voting weapon, or an endless obsession is ignoble by default.
I'm listening currently to a fascinating talk between Douglas Murray and Mark Steyn right now (available on Youtube).
It all seems to boil down to foods for multiculturalists. And often, that's the really cool at first. The first Afghan immigrant can introduce you to his culture and foods. A handful will give some more of that. But by the 100 thousandth Afghan you're getting diminishing returns, and THEIR cultural expectations start to compete with the host country. Afghans have no problem asserting and holding on to their identity. Neither do the Japanese or Koreans.
But westerners? Canadians? Americans? Europeans? Well, you embrace that damn change to the fabric of your societies and culture or else you're a small minded nazi bigot!
Also, multiculturalism is in fact, boring. Only when every capital of Europe has been turned into the same boring repetition of kebab shops and halal burger joints, and the cathedral spires converted to minarets will they wake up. Or maybe they won't. It's also always funny to me how "diverse" or "multicultural" often refers to places and neighborhoods which are mono-ethnic. They just have to be non-white and suddenly they are "diverse!" Well, no, a place that is 95% black is actually NOT diverse. A pakistani borough is NOT diverse.
Unfortunately, the conditioning of the European and Western mind to believe they have nothing to offer (despite the entire rest of the world being attracted to their cultures in the first place) is pathological at this point.
Another excellent post, thank you. Also, importing millions of Mexicans and other Latinos via too much legal and illegal immigration of their ethnic group isn't diversity either. Diversity is ok just as long as it is done equally and that it doesn't overtake the mainstream culture of a country. Of course, liberals will call it bigotry, racism, xenophobia, etc. unless it is mostly a white society losing their cultural identity then it's A-ok with them. Hypocrites!
The people you don't care for... many of them came here and worked for some of the same american's that you support.. they did not come here and just do nothing, they were the house keepers, the pickers, the planters, the construction workers, the eatery workers and any other jobs that American did not want to give to poor whites or to minorities, they gave it to the Illegal immigrants, they attracted them here by the long tradition of using them as cheap labor. If you want to blame anyone blame American people.
For decades, people bragged about their Mexican or Latin American house keeper, their handi man and contractors could not wait to get up early and rush out to pick up van loads for their projects.
The electric company this very day, has set up to cater to Mexicans, who are either on green card or brought in as contract labor, to go along the electric lines and trim the trees back.
American people could be doing these jobs, but the Electric company knows it has to pay a living wage and it has to cover them under Workers Comp if they get hurt. If they can hire Illegal, or people new to the green card program or migrant contract workers, they can by pass all of this. And the American People support it. It's not like the people are blind and don't see who is cutting these trees and climbing to the top to trim the limbs... American's don't care.... they just want the trees trimmed and the electric company don't care because they want the job done as cheap as they can get it ..... when these people get hurt, they dump them, hire another and have not a second thought about it, and line them up to be deported if they can. American has not changed it still has systems structure to abuse people and thenwhine and complain about the people it has abused. heck, they did it to black people for centuries and still do it, when they can no longer use them for free or next to nothing, they want to denigrate them by any and every means possible and then shun them in civic and social matters.
Next time you go to some fancy eatery, ask them to give you a tour through the kitchen and dish-washing areas? Guaranteed they will find an excuse why that can't be done. This is true of many business, that has a passion for using people, including the corporations that move around to the other side of the world, still chasing slave labor and boasting about their profits from doing so, and they boast right in front of the people they have devastated, but still expect these people to buy their products. If american stop buying stuff from american companies that produce it in foreign lands, then those companies will have to change or they will simply ship and market their stuff in other countries where people are unsuspecting of the methodology of their programs. American, European, Dutch and Other Nation with Majority Anglo, have been doing this for Centuries, all for greed, and here 2000 yrs later, they are still crying broke and desperate and still chasing Avarice by every means of greed they can... It's basically insane, all it does it make hardships spread where there should be prospering societies.... Greed is the biggest issue that feed the havoc and then greed chaser can't get along with anyone, because they want to "hoard and claim everything", as if they think they are entitled. Time will keep showing them they are living a delusion and that delusion makes hell every place they promote it.
The average Illegal Immigrant comes to find work, they don't come to steal or create crime, they just want to work and send money home to their family... and many after a while simply build a life here...
If anything, Deal with the people whom are already here, help them get legit, the gang and crime members send them back... or lock them up. But the decent working people.. Help them... the same as we are so eager to help the Chinese, the Russian, or any other people who come from a nation where peoples skin is not black or brown.
Who cares for law breakers? It's only the greedy who hire illegals. Are we supposed to care about them and their illegal hires while Americans get laid off or denied their jobs? Most Americans are law abiding and do care!! All those jobs you mentioned were once held by Americans for a fair wage until millions of cheap illegals flooded our border to make the rich, richer. That doesn't matter to you?
No one has a right to a better life by breaking laws and taking from others what doesn't belong to them. Illegals send billions out of our country not spent in our economy. Americans have families to feed also. How are they working if not by using a fake or stolen SS number or working for cash evading taxes? Those are felonies! These are selfish people who only care about themselves.
No, no more amnesties! Americans need their jobs back and it never makes sense to reward criminal behavior. Decent people don't break laws! This has nothing to do with skin color. Get a grip! It's about our laws and why they are in place to protect our own citizens. Legal immigration is ok in controlled numbers that doesn't impact our own citizens negatively and we have always allowed legal immigrants into our country. Illegal immigration is against the law and has a negative impact on law abiding Americans.
The vast majority of those complaining about illegal immigration would still be complaining if Russians or Chinese people were streaming across the border .
Are you sure?
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