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My husband and I have a true partnership. In the beginning we struggled a bit with division of labor issues (I always felt like I was doing more) but as we have matured and navigated life together, we have really found a good partnership, learned to appreciate each other and each other's sacrifices. If he gets to goof off one day, instead of feeling resentful, I now am glad he gets a break.
Anyway, I believe the biggest issue with non-clear gender roles, is the devaluation of the home, child raising, and taking care of the home. Now it's just all chores, division of labor, not a labor of love. Who is home providing a warm, nurturing place? Nobody. Everybody is working outside the home! Who is raising your child? Strangers at day care. Who is cooking nutritious, healthy meals? McDonald's, Wendy's and ruby Tuesday. Some of these things have completely lost value, and women who do chose to stay home are often times viewed as wasting their time and energy instead of providing important things towards the care and nurture of a family.
Also, women think they can have it all, and it's tremendous pressure to think we can do it all. I have no clue how women who work full time outside the home manage to also keep up with kids, kids activities, homework, dinner, groceries, laundry etc. I work part-time and it's a battle to do it all, and this is with a husband who pitches in with cooking, child care, and carting kids to activities.
So I say people need to do what works for them, and people need to quit devaluing what others find important. As a society we spend way too much time bashing other peoples choices.
Then those people should have made the choice NOT to breed.
Who puts the pressure on women to want to have it all? They have options and each choice has it's consequences. They put the pressure on themselves. If you don't know yourself and your limitations, why do you think it's okay to blame others. You have to be accountable for your own choices.
When the phrase "gender role" is used here, I take it to only refer to the breadwinner/housewife dynamic.
While economic and social choices for women are good news, underlying human psychology remains the same. For instance, the vast majority of women are attracted to leadership and masculinity. Not the "bro" macho masculinity, but a guy who takes initiative, is positive, and makes her feel safe. The problem is the confusion about how to behave...and this has led to MASSIVE discontent and bitterness among both sexes.
I mean we have the "nice" guys who are respectful but just have no spine complaining about a lack of attraction, and the girls who tell themselves they want to change a man into the person they want .....then lose respect for him when he submits and changes for her. Men are putting women on pedestals because that's what pop culture tells them to do (just watch any commercial or sitcom) and women are turned off by this. On the other hand many women are unsure of what they want and end up hurting themselves by dating jerks or being single and complaining about their being no good men.
The good news is, it's possible to remain masculine/feminine in the modern world. Relationships are healthy as long as no one is neutered. It's when we tamper with these base human desires that causes problems...not when we let women have careers!
Now, all that said, let's all go outside and breathe some fresh air Society has its problems but there are still TONS of great individuals out there!
When the phrase "gender role" is used here, I take it to only refer to the breadwinner/housewife dynamic.
While economic and social choices for women are good news, underlying human psychology remains the same. For instance, the vast majority of women are attracted to leadership and masculinity. Not the "bro" macho masculinity, but a guy who takes initiative, is positive, and makes her feel safe. The problem is the confusion about how to behave...and this has led to MASSIVE discontent and bitterness among both sexes.
I mean we have the "nice" guys who are respectful but just have no spine complaining about a lack of attraction, and the girls who tell themselves they want to change a man into the person they want .....then lose respect for him when he submits and changes for her. Men are putting women on pedestals because that's what pop culture tells them to do (just watch any commercial or sitcom) and women are turned off by this. On the other hand many women are unsure of what they want and end up hurting themselves by dating jerks or being single and complaining about their being no good men.
The good news is, it's possible to remain masculine/feminine in the modern world. Relationships are healthy as long as no one is neutered!
Now, all that said, let's all go outside and breathe some fresh air Society has its problems but there are still TONS of great individuals out there!
(Bolded portion above) Women also place *themselves* on pedestals, though... (I have an earlier thread on this, also.) Women ultimately have so much more power than the men, when it comes to setting the parameters for a relationship.
Also, I stand by my earlier statement that women are "programmed" by society to have the preferences they usually want...and men are "programmed" to display these preferences, as any deviation from that norm is strongly discouraged even when they are boys. Society rigs the game, so to speak. For example, can you imagine how different gender relations would be, if society instead overtly discouraged the aggressive, macho, power-exuding male, and instead championed the soft, caring, soft-spoken and sensitive type of man, in young girls' eyes? That would have the exact opposite effect, of what we have now. The point is: the game is completely rigged and biased from the outset.
He didn't say he looked at relationships as a game. He said society does.
I disagree.
Apparently he does, since he used the comparison.
It's certainly not my experience and I'm part of the same society.
Seems as if he's not getting what he wants and is assigning blame.
That's bogus.
I disagree.
Apparently he does, since he used the comparison.
It's certainly not my experience and I'm part of the same society. Seems as if he's not getting what he wants and is assigning blame. That's bogus.
You are saying I said things that I didn't say. Just look around you: what are young boys given to play with? Toy soldiers. Toy war machines. They are inundated with cartoons full of simulated violence. ETA: In the 80s when I was growing up, I thought cartoons like G.I. Joe and Transformers were cool. Now they disgust me, b/c I realize now that they were ultimately only tools and social engineering for encouraging future soldiers in the military. Parents teach their boys that showing outward emotion (particularly overt love and affection) is weak. Crying is weak and for sissies. Hugging and kissing past a certain age is strongly discouraged. They are encouraged to bring out their "inner tough guy", at every turn. Girls on the other hand are discouraged from little if any of the above.
These are only a few examples, of what I'm talking about...
Last edited by Phoenix2017; 07-11-2011 at 02:18 PM..
Reason: Adds
Over the past 50-60 years, where there once were clear gender roles, (Men were the bread winners, women were the mommys) now it seems that which ever person can be whatever he/she wants. My question is not about women's liberation, (I personally would rather date/marry a liberated woman than a woman with societal limitations), but instead how do you think blurred gender roles have effected our (hetrosexual) relationships...
FYI, your title line should read "Affected" not "Effected"
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Society has its problems but there are still TONS of great individuals out there!
(I have an earlier thread on this, also.) Women ultimately have so much more power than the men, when it comes to setting the parameters for a relationship. 
