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The "Different Jesus" argument has no merit since they say that Jesus Christ of the Holy Bible, son of God of the Holy Bible is our Saviour.
You're right. Mormons believe every word the Holy Bible has to say about Jesus Christ. Every single word. If anyone thinks there are two different individuals who could potentially be the person described as the Messiah in the scriptures, that's the person with the problem.
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That fact is the cornerstone of Christianity. If Lucifer and Jesus were brothers is it irrelevant to Jesus Christ being the Saviour of the world.
It's totally irrelevant. Besides, I addressed that argument in Finn's thread a couple of weeks back. When I specifically answer a question and then someone comes back with the same old argument as soon as he has the opportunity, it speaks volumes about how completely closed-minded he is. I've never urged anyone on this forum to convert to Mormonism, but I have tried on many, many occasions to present the truth about what we believe. Our beliefs may be unfamiliar to people but, as you and a few others have illustrated, Phazelwood, they are not hard to understand by someone who puts forth even a minimum amount of effort. People who repeat the same misleading criticisms time after time are simply showing everybody else that they're either incapable or unwilling to learn anything new about somebody else's belief system.
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Celestial Sex is not an argument against it, not when Christianity teaches of a divine impregnation of a human in order for his son to be born on earth.
I'm not even sure what saved33 was getting at with this "celestial sex" stuff. What on earth is that anyway? We believe that Jesus Christ was born to the Virgin Mary and that He was, in some miraculous way, fathered by God. This is the same thing the rest of Christianity believes.
Mormons use the book of Mormon as a compliment to the Holy bible, they believe in Jesus Christ as Saviour and the Jesus they refer to is from the Holy Bible.
They are as Christian as any other Christian who believes in Jesus as Saviour.
Christians acknowledge the cornerstone of their faith as Jesus Christ as do Mormons.
I can't rep you again yet, Phazelwood, but I can at least publicly thank you.
Galatians 1:6-9 comes to mind when the LDS church is discussed:
"I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel - which is really no gospel at all.
Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heavenshould preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned.
As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!"
Hmm, Mormonism began in the year 1820 with several visitations from alleged messengers from heaven ...
We Latter-day Saints use that particular passage, too. It is one of many in which Paul prophesied of an apostasy (or "falling away") that would take place shortly after his death. Among his other statements are these:
Among his statements to Christ's followers, are these:
Acts 20:29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition…
2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears…
Paul made it absolutely clear that the flock would not only be attacked, it would not be spared, Christ would not return to the earth until this universal "falling away" or "apostasy" had taken place, these things were already beginning to take place as he spoke, and the doctrines taught by the Savior would, in time, cease to endure.
Additionally Revelation 14:6 states that in the latter days, the following event could be expected to take place: And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people...
If the everlasting gospel was to already behere, what point would there have been to God telling John that an angel would deliver it in the last days?
To us Muslims, Mormons are Christians. I believe the Jews also consider them to be Christian. I also suspect that to many who use the name Christian, the Mormons are seen to be fellow Christians.
Then again I notice that those Christians who say Mormons are not Christians are those who belong to sects that claim to be the only true Christians. Sometimes those who claim to be the true Christians do not act very Christian. Just my view as an outsider peeking in through the window.
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Originally Posted by Phazelwood
You can argue about their doctrine being true or not, you can believe it or not, you can make the case against it.
That actually is irrelevant to being a Christian.
Mormons whether what much of what they believe or practice is right or not still believe what Christians believe when it comes to faith and salvation.
Jesus Christ of the holy bible is our Saviour and they believe that too. None of what anyone is saying about their system of belief and doctrine changes that.
The reason that it is so hypocritical for a Christian to go down this road is because Christianity itself is full of all kinds of variances in belief, that IS why there are so many denominations and church splits. This group believes this is better than that group, so we are going to go off and start on our own and we'll do it the "right" way.
Yet, the only thing that has any significant merit in all that variation is a belief that Jesus Saves us. That is also what Mormons believe no matter how much other stuff you bring up trying to hide that similarity.
I'd have to beg to differ with you...it is VERY relevant.
We are not talking a minor "doctrinal nor denominational" difference...we are talking about a group that follows a FALSE prophet.
You may need to study up a bit more on the LDS AND the definition of a cult.
When the LEADER of a religious movement says he or she was imparted with special knowledge,gifts,powers etc that nobody else has upon earth and only HIS teaching to a select group is the right way...that ol' buddy IS a cult.
You can paint it any color with any sized brush,but you can't change a hog into a goat or vice versa..
Last edited by Miss Blue; 10-10-2011 at 05:47 PM..
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Location: Democratic Peoples Republic of Redneckistan
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Originally Posted by Woodrow LI
To us Muslims, Mormons are Christians. I believe the Jews also consider them to be Christian. I also suspect that to many who use the name Christian, the Mormons are seen to be fellow Christians.
Then again I notice that those Christians who say Mormons are not Christians are those who belong to sects that claim to be the only true Christians. Sometimes those who claim to be the true Christians do not act very Christian. Just my view as an outsider peeking in through the window.
You are quite wrong there.
I belong to no "sect"...I,like millions of others just believe the Holy Bible and my Bible tells me not to follow a false prophet to hell...not Mohammed/Muhammed,not Joseph Smith,not Sun Myung Moon...CHRIST and Christ only....those "prophets" will stand for themselves on judgment day and I wouldn't trade places with any of them even with my many,many faults.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity [lawlessness].
2 Pet 2:3 [NIV] In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping
1 Cor 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
Mat 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Mark 13:22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall show signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
Last edited by Miss Blue; 10-10-2011 at 05:52 PM..
I belong to no "sect"...I,like millions of others just believe the Holy Bible and my Bible tells me not to follow a false prophet to hell...not Mohammed/Muhammed,not Joseph Smith,not Sun Myung Moon...CHRIST and Christ only....those "prophets" will stand for themselves on judgment day and I wouldn't trade places with any of them even with my many,many faults.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity [lawlessness].
2 Pet 2:3 [NIV] In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping
1 Cor 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
Mat 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Mark 13:22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall show signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
I believe you have just verified what I said.
Last edited by june 7th; 10-29-2011 at 10:38 AM..
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Location: Democratic Peoples Republic of Redneckistan
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Originally Posted by Woodrow LI
I believe you have just verified what I said.
Well if that's the case,I guess maybe we DO agree on something...those are my beliefs and I am not ashamed of them nor should I be.
Your "sect" figures I'm wrong,my "sect" figures you are...hopefully we all are right and all make heaven or our version of...but IF the Holy Bible turns out to be the right one(and I firmly believe it is) then Matthew 7:21-23 will be what most hear just prior to entering an eternal torment in hell's fire.
I didn't write the book nor the rules of engagement.
Last edited by Miss Blue; 10-10-2011 at 05:50 PM..
What do Mormons teach about how Christ came to be? Something about celestial sex?
Mormons teach that Jesus and Satan/Lucifer were brothers.
Mormons do follow a different Jesus and not the Christ. Don't let them fool you.
"In bearing testimony of Jesus Christ, President Hinckley spoke of those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints "do not believe in the traditional Christ. No, I don't. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak. For the Christ of whom I speak has been revealed in this the Dispensation of the Fullness of Times. He, together with His Father, appeared to the boy Joseph Smith in the year 1820, and when Joseph left the grove that day, he knew more of the nature of God than all the learned ministers of the gospel of the ages."
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