The latest in the "Ask a _____" series.....Ask a gay Christian. (divorce, Jews)

[Pathwalker]

Originally Posted by wildberries61

You must not have been on here long. He was the first honest gay person to come on here and share some VERY PERSONAL experiences. I'm sure his not the "God of the Gays", but he sure seems to have insight the rest of us unless we are gay can not give you. He is married with children and has mentioned even with all that he still has struggles.
I guess we were just trying to guide you to someone if your really looking for answers or maybe your just looking for others opinions and with this subject and being Christian do you want honesty or sugar coated!!

I KNOW who Hoosier is. I've read his posts. I'm familiar with his struggles and such.

I'm saying there is NOTHING he could say to me that I haven't already heard or read about. I'm completely familiar with all the different theories about what might be behind homosexual attraction - all the psychological nuances and opinions and stories. I KNOW all about that stuff. And I'm not going to place Hoosier up on a podium thinking he would be able to give me any additional insight about this. I'm not married. I don't have kids. If Hoosier didn't, and was still able to tell me HOW he overcame his inner emotions, attractions and desires, then maybe I'd be more inclined to hear him out.

[weatherologist]

Originally Posted by WCRob

So at judgment, why wouldn't He look upon my heart and see that I only wanted the love of someone special in my life? Instead, suddenly my heart becomes very wicked and perverted.

Rob,
This is what I am trying to say and please, this is just my humble opinion. I believe that God will look at your heart on judgement day and if you have reconciled with all of these feeling that you are fighting, if you have been able to come to the conclusion in your heart that you are a Christian, you love God and accept Christ as your Lord and Saviour, and that you did good on this earth and you did all you could to bring God glory, and all you wanted was the love of someone special in your life, you will be judged accordingly, BY GOD. Not by anyone on this forum. Not by me. But, again, this is your heart. You have to believe. I had a priest tell me (we were discussing birth control) that one day I would stand before God and that I would need to be able to explain to Him what I had done. And I would have to know in my heart that what I did, I did knowing that God was OK with it.

I am sure that almost every Christian on this forum will disagree with me. But it is not their place to judge you. Only God has that right. You have to reconcile this within yourself.

Continueing to pray for your peace.

Weather...

[Pathwalker]

Originally Posted by weatherologist

Rob,
This is what I am trying to say and please, this is just my humble opinion. I believe that God will look at your heart on judgement day and if you have reconciled with all of these feeling that you are fighting, if you have been able to come to the conclusion in your heart that you are a Christian, you love God and accept Christ as your Lord and Saviour, and that you did good on this earth and you did all you could to bring God glory, and all you wanted was the love of someone special in your life, you will be judged accordingly, BY GOD. Not by anyone on this forum. Not by me. But, again, this is your heart. You have to believe. I had a priest tell me (we were discussing birth control) that one day I would stand before God and that I would need to be able to explain to Him what I had done. And I would have to know in my heart that what I did, I did knowing that God was OK with it.

I am sure that almost every Christian on this forum will disagree with me. But it is not their place to judge you. Only God has that right. You have to reconcile this within yourself.

Continueing to pray for your peace.

Weather...

I know what you're saying. I really do. And maybe that's why I keep sensing God to tell me to STOP listening to people. Seriously, I seem to get that impression from Him a lot.

I guess this all boils down to ME not feeling like I CAN reconcile this unless I actually HEAR from Him either way.

Blueberry mentioned this having something to do with my own doubts, and I suppose earlier I did mention how I don't want to stake my life and salvation on something that hasn't been proven. But it really isn't so much about my doubts as much as it's about me wanting to be sure about something. I'm not sure if that makes sense, so I'll try to phrase it differently....

I don't have any doubts about who I am. And if the Bible wasn't so ambiguous about this, I would have no problem accepting myself as a child of God. But the fact that there are differing opinions about what the Bible actually says, I feel like I'm in limbo - not knowing who to believe. It's not so much that I may have doubts about whether it's okay or not. I simply don't know. And I'm not sure how else to explain what I'm trying to say. Deep down inside, I honestly and truly don't believe being gay is wrong. I just CONFESS that it is because it seems that's what the overriding opinion is, and because it seems safer to do that than to take a chance otherwise.

It's kinda like I'm waiting for the final verdict in a court case about whether it's right or wrong to park a motorcycle on a sidewalk, and I'm just not getting any information that helps me to really know the outcome. The jury seems to be out, and there aren't any signs it will be returning anytime soon. So in the meantime, I'm left wondering: IS it wrong, or ISN'T it? Why won't God simply tell me in a way that I know for sure? If it's wrong, I'll stop parking on the sidewalk. But if it doesn't make any difference to God, then I'll just keep parking it the way I do. But I feel like the Bible says "It's only wrong to park on the sidewalk if an ailing illegal immigrant is going to be walking on it." Well, that is a bit vague. First, how would I know if the person is ailing? Second, how would I even know if they were an illegal immigrant? Third, how would I even know IF an immigrant would be using the sidewalk?

I mean, I know that sounds really off-beat, but I'm simply trying to illustrate how ambiguous the Bible can be on the subject.

I just can't comprehend why He would allow someone to go through this kind of inner struggle and not free them from it. At least give them a more clear sign than what has supposedly been given.

I don't want to be deceived. It's a big fear of mine. I don't want to simply go with what I honestly feel inside, presuming that it's okay with God for me to be gay, and then find out I was deceived when I die.

I've even had what I thought were messages from God telling me it was okay to be gay. I've mentioned lately that I've had some messages that I felt were from God, and some of them pertained to this. And some people seem to think I truly was hearing from God, and she claimed she has a spiritual gift of discerning such things. Other people tell me I have to be careful about such signs, but yet they seem to think the OTHER signs and messages I've received are legitimate.

Why would people tell you that God loves you just as you are, and then when they hear you're gay, suddenly you have to change? Why would God tell me He loves me, and give messages of love to me (which I won't go into right now) if He feels I'm such a perverted abomination?

Whatever. I'm just a screwed up mess.

[kaykay]

I think you are confused and conflicted Rob, not a screwed-up mess! But I know what you are saying. I so wish you could feel the same confidence in the Bible (as it is written now) that I do. That wouldn't make things easy but it would define your paramenters if you know what I mean. But I know you have doubts... The thing that stood out to me, though, in your last post was about God's love for you. Rob, He loves you.

[pocono-jane]

Hi Rob...I have read many of your posts on various threads and my heart goes out to you. I am not "gay", and I do not judge people based on their sexual preferances. Yes, as others have said, you do seem very conflicted, which is understandable. In my opinion (and coming from me only) to someone I really don't know, I would think it's best to just be who YOU are, and not try to be something else or someone else based on what others (spiritual, religious, or otherwise) might think. If you were to try to "change", perhaps you would never be happy or at peace with yourself, and the struggle will continue. Another thought, did you ever think of checking out other Christian denominations who are more accepting? I am familiar (thru friends) with the Congregational sect (United Church of Christ, I think it's called ????) who are "open and affirmative", with everyone welcome and treated with respect. I'm sure there are other Christian churches that would still give you the comfort of having religion, but not put you in conflict with who you really are. Just one gal's opinion...In any case, I wish you all the best life has to offer. Thanks for listening.

[weatherologist]

Originally Posted by WCRob

I've even had what I thought were messages from God telling me it was okay to be gay. I've mentioned lately that I've had some messages that I felt were from God, and some of them pertained to this. And some people seem to think I truly was hearing from God, and she claimed she has a spiritual gift of discerning such things. Other people tell me I have to be careful about such signs, but yet they seem to think the OTHER signs and messages I've received are legitimate.



Whatever. I'm just a screwed up mess.

Rob,
First and foremost, you are not a screwed up mess. Yes, you are confused. But you are a man who is looking for the truth. I man who only wants to please God.

I read your thread about wondering if something was from God. If I remember right, in the end, you decided that you were wrong and it would have gone in a bad direction if you had acted on what you felt you had received. But I want to relay a story to you. This is something that happened to me. When you have read my story, a lot of people will be rolling their eyes and shaking their heads, thinking "poor weather". I tell you this story not because I care what they think, but because I hope that it in some way helps to shed some light on what YOU believe. I was in a very controlling, emotionally abusive marriage. I had a son. There was no physical violence. On the outside, life seemed great to everyone else. But I was at odds with what I was supposed to do. I prayed for an answer. I stuggled for a very long time and remained in the marriage for probably a year longer than I should have. But I kept waiting for my answer. Finally, when I decided I could not take it any more, I decided that I had to leave. My husband was out in his garage working, it was late, I went outside to confront him but stopped outside of his garage to pray for guidance. I prayed to God. I asked for a sign. Anything so that I would know that it was OK for me to leave this man. Immediately the song "I believe I can fly" came on the radio. I had a feeling of peace wash over me. I approached my husband and told him that I had to leave. One year later I was divorced. Do I think that God condones divorce? No, I doubt that he does. But do I believe that in my heart God spoke to me and told me that he loved me and that it was alright for me to leave this man? Absolutely. It's been 10 years. I've remarried and had four more children. God has blesssd me richly. I try to serve him every day. But I am a sinner and every day I fall short. God knows me. He knows my heart. I am at peace with my relationship with God. I will continue to pray for you to find your own peace. It has to come from you. This is about your heart. God knows your heart and he wants you to know that he loves you.

God bless you, Rob.
Weather...

[Blueberry]

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future." Jeremiah 29:11

The LORD appeared to him from afar, saying,"I have loved you with an everlasting love; Therefore I have drawn you with lovingkindness." Jeremiah 31:3

"For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.” Matthew 11:30

*****

I'll stand by my statement that you need an attitude adjustment. It's time to surrender to God, give thanks, and count your blessings. Put Him in the driver's seat. He has wonderful plans for you if you will only let Him work in your life. He loves you more than any human being ever can. Listen to His voice and only His voice; He won't lead you astray.

All people will ultimately fail you, even Bible scholars.

I've been meditating on Naaman today. He would have done any difficult thing God would have commanded if it meant being cured of his leprosy. Yet, Namaan balked at the simple request to bathe in the river. The Pharisees (and other Jews) were willing to do the hard/impossible/tedious things required of the Law, yet they couldn't accept the simple freedom found in Jesus. I think humans put more burdens on themselves than they were ever meant to bear. True freedom is so easy it scares us.

There's nothing more I can say, so my participation in this discussion is at an end. If you are ever in a mood to hear, I'd be more than willing to listen and "talk." In the meantime, I'll be praying that you have clarity of mind, that you'll attain the peace that passes understanding, and that you'll fully comprehend God's great love for you.

And, for what it's worth, I don't consider YOU an abomination. Neither do I judge you; that's God's department. I love you, Rob!

[Pathwalker]

Originally Posted by pocono-jane

Hi Rob...I have read many of your posts on various threads and my heart goes out to you. I am not "gay", and I do not judge people based on their sexual preferances. Yes, as others have said, you do seem very conflicted, which is understandable. In my opinion (and coming from me only) to someone I really don't know, I would think it's best to just be who YOU are, and not try to be something else or someone else based on what others (spiritual, religious, or otherwise) might think. If you were to try to "change", perhaps you would never be happy or at peace with yourself, and the struggle will continue.

You don't know HOW appropriate your post is right now! Truly. This morning, I said "To heck with it". I'm not going to worry about changing. I'm not going to try. I'm going to be me, and I'm going to praise the Lord.

And I felt better! I really did. I felt closer to the Lord than I have in a number of days now.

Originally Posted by pocono-jane

Another thought, did you ever think of checking out other Christian denominations who are more accepting? I am familiar (thru friends) with the Congregational sect (United Church of Christ, I think it's called ????) who are "open and affirmative", with everyone welcome and treated with respect. I'm sure there are other Christian churches that would still give you the comfort of having religion, but not put you in conflict with who you really are. Just one gal's opinion...In any case, I wish you all the best life has to offer. Thanks for listening.

Thank you for the kind words! I will most likely wait on the whole "finding a church" thing, at least for now. I am much more interested in simply listening to God, and no one else! But I really appreciate the recommendation!

[Pathwalker]

Originally Posted by kaykay

I think you are confused and conflicted Rob, not a screwed-up mess!

Not so much anymore after this morning. I just realized that I am who I am, and I don't think it really matters to God. Know why? Because once I decided to stop fighting this whole battle, and I focused on how I KNOW I am in my heart, and what I KNOW my heart wants - which is to simply experience love and to praise God for all His awesomeness - I suddenly felt free! I felt close to God again! I started remembering the messages He's given me, and the things He's shown me. And I just realized that all this fighting and struggling is stupid.

I'll listen to Him and HIM alone from now on. Not the people on an internet message board. And I don't mean that to sound offensive. It's just what I've decided. I'm going to listen to what HE tells me. I'm going to choose freedom, not only from this dumb-butt struggle against being gay, but also from what everyone else tells me the Bible means. I'm going to rediscover Jesus in my own life on my own!

Originally Posted by kaykay

But I know what you are saying. I so wish you could feel the same confidence in the Bible (as it is written now) that I do. That wouldn't make things easy but it would define your paramenters if you know what I mean. But I know you have doubts..

The thing that stood out to me, though, in your last post was about God's love for you. Rob, He loves you.

Yep, I know.

[Pathwalker]

Originally Posted by weatherologist

Rob,
First and foremost, you are not a screwed up mess. Yes, you are confused. But you are a man who is looking for the truth. I man who only wants to please God.

I read your thread about wondering if something was from God. If I remember right, in the end, you decided that you were wrong and it would have gone in a bad direction if you had acted on what you felt you had received. But I want to relay a story to you. This is something that happened to me. When you have read my story, a lot of people will be rolling their eyes and shaking their heads, thinking "poor weather". I tell you this story not because I care what they think, but because I hope that it in some way helps to shed some light on what YOU believe. I was in a very controlling, emotionally abusive marriage. I had a son. There was no physical violence. On the outside, life seemed great to everyone else. But I was at odds with what I was supposed to do. I prayed for an answer. I stuggled for a very long time and remained in the marriage for probably a year longer than I should have. But I kept waiting for my answer. Finally, when I decided I could not take it any more, I decided that I had to leave. My husband was out in his garage working, it was late, I went outside to confront him but stopped outside of his garage to pray for guidance. I prayed to God. I asked for a sign. Anything so that I would know that it was OK for me to leave this man. Immediately the song "I believe I can fly" came on the radio. I had a feeling of peace wash over me. I approached my husband and told him that I had to leave. One year later I was divorced. Do I think that God condones divorce? No, I doubt that he does. But do I believe that in my heart God spoke to me and told me that he loved me and that it was alright for me to leave this man? Absolutely. It's been 10 years. I've remarried and had four more children. God has blesssd me richly. I try to serve him every day. But I am a sinner and every day I fall short. God knows me. He knows my heart. I am at peace with my relationship with God. I will continue to pray for you to find your own peace. It has to come from you. This is about your heart. God knows your heart and he wants you to know that he loves you.

God bless you, Rob.
Weather...

Thanks for sharing that, Weather. I'm really glad you've been able to find peace in your life, and the happiness along with it.

Apparently the prayers that I would find peace have helped, because as you can read in my words to KayKay above, I gave up the struggle this morning and decided I was no longer going to keep fighting this battle. I am simply going to praise God, and listen to Him alone - not all the different voices, and not what everyone tells me the Bible means. I will praise Him, and just be myself. And I felt close to Him again, not angry and bitter. I felt free.