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Old 01-06-2013, 02:14 PM
 
7,112 posts, read 9,351,112 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no kudzu View Post
I think we all agree the rapists should be punished to the fullest extent of the law. But what about the kids who are on the tape laughing about it, making the whole thing out to be a joke? Seems like the guy on tape may have even witnessed part of the attack. Should he be prosecuted as an accomplice if he did nothing to stop it? or if he knew about the rape after the fact and did not come forward to offer his testimony or information? His callousness has me really perturbed. Is this the macho posturing of young boys? Is this peer pressure? Mob mentality? or is he just an idiot?
Maybe all of the above. People protect themselves from their own fear of rape by blaming the victim and siding with the offender. I used to work in rape-crisis centers and some victims got hounded right out of their schools without the staff doing ANYTHING about it.

 
Old 01-06-2013, 02:22 PM
 
13,612 posts, read 10,307,432 times
Reputation: 17659
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post
Many women could avoid rape by altering their actions.

Some people have no culpability. This girl did.
We all like to look at the reasons that something happened when it comes to situations like this. We are not comfortable with the fact that it could happen to us.

Sixteen years old. Her brain is not even fully developed yet. Was it stupid to get drunk around a bunch of jocks who had been drinking as well? Yes. Was she there because she was trying to fit in with the popular crowd? Probably.

I wasn't terribly street smart when I was sixteen. That doesn't justify rape, peeing on her, and then posting the pics and videos on social media. Not by a long shot.
 
Old 01-06-2013, 02:31 PM
 
Location: Soldotna
2,268 posts, read 1,806,123 times
Reputation: 1067
Quote:
Originally Posted by NLVgal View Post
We all like to look at the reasons that something happened when it comes to situations like this. We are not comfortable with the fact that it could happen to us.

Sixteen years old. Her brain is not even fully developed yet. Was it stupid to get drunk around a bunch of jocks who had been drinking as well? Yes. Was she there because she was trying to fit in with the popular crowd? Probably.

I wasn't terribly street smart when I was sixteen. That doesn't justify rape, peeing on her, and then posting the pics and videos on social media. Not by a long shot.
No, you are right. Nothing justifies it and no one deserves to be victimized.

And zebras don't deserve to be eaten. And fish don't deserve to have hooks in their mouths. And kids don't deserve to be child soldiers. And dogs don't deserve to be abused.

It happens. This is life. **** happens.

At 13, I was a hoodlum and definitely street smart. I have been victimized once. Not raped. In hindsight it is clear it was completely avoidable. Its never happened since. I took responsibility and made adjustments. I'm lucky it didn't turn out worse.

This is not a function of biology or developed brains but of environment.

Notice how kids in bad positions tend to get wiser much more quickly. The street kids in Brazil have more street smarts than most adults in America.
 
Old 01-06-2013, 02:39 PM
 
2,873 posts, read 4,766,223 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post
Assuming your neighborhood is safe? WTF?
So women should never leave their homes? This is exactly what I'm talking about. The only way to follow 'the rules' and avoid rape is to stop living. If a woman is breaking 'the rules' by jogging a block from her house in a suburban neighborhood then the rules don't work. They can't work, because following them becomes impossible.


Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post


Don't even get me started on date rape and trusting unknown men.
She had been dating him for six months. See how easy it is to judge?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post

If people accept responsibility and take more precautions many more people would avoid problems. Its an undeniable fact. Not all bit many.

Even if it isn't politically correct...

Some people have no culpability. This girl did.
No, she didn't. She made some dumb choices.

The boys made a horrific choice. Dumb does not outweigh horrific.
 
Old 01-06-2013, 03:07 PM
 
Location: Soldotna
2,268 posts, read 1,806,123 times
Reputation: 1067
Quote:
Originally Posted by ParallelJJCat View Post
So women should never leave their homes? This is exactly what I'm talking about. The only way to follow 'the rules' and avoid rape is to stop living. If a woman is breaking 'the rules' by jogging a block from her house in a suburban neighborhood then the rules don't work. They can't work, because following them becomes impossible.
Women can do whatever they want.

Go ahead and take a walk in the bad part of town at night. Go ahead... I dare you.

Apparently common sense isn't so common.

Quote:
She had been dating him for six months. See how easy it is to judge?
Bad judgment is bad judgment. I bet she thought he was so cool and no way is he talking to me!!!! And omg omg I gotta tell the girls about this and oh he is so cute!!!! And I'm going to be popular and the cool kids will like me OMG OMG!!!!!!

Why does this happen year after year? You'd think people would learn...

Quote:
No, she didn't. She made some dumb choices.
She made bad choices.

People in the real world are responsible for their choices and their consequences.

Ideally you aren't faced with these choices until adulthood but hey...

Even baby zebras get eaten.
 
Old 01-06-2013, 03:11 PM
 
18,852 posts, read 31,727,414 times
Reputation: 26118
Society is the problem. Rape is not new....it has happened for eons.

Last edited by jasper12; 01-06-2013 at 03:12 PM.. Reason: edit
 
Old 01-06-2013, 03:26 PM
 
2,873 posts, read 4,766,223 times
Reputation: 4292
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post
Women can do whatever they want.

Go ahead and take a walk in the bad part of town at night. Go ahead... I dare you.

Apparently common sense isn't so common.
It wasn't a bad neighborhood. It wasn't at night. Still her fault?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post

Bad judgment is bad judgment. I bet she thought he was so cool and no way is he talking to me!!!! And omg omg I gotta tell the girls about this and oh he is so cute!!!! And I'm going to be popular and the cool kids will like me OMG OMG!!!!!!
What does the above have to do with the man raping her? BTW...she was an adult, not a starry-eyed teen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post


She made bad choices.

People in the real world are responsible for their choices and their consequences.

Ideally you aren't faced with these choices until adulthood but hey...

Even baby zebras get eaten.
Lions can't make a choice NOT to eat zebras. Men CAN make a choice not to rape.
 
Old 01-06-2013, 03:29 PM
 
1,617 posts, read 2,466,114 times
Reputation: 1352
I think society can contribute to the problem, especially by not reporting, not helping a victim; I think the basic problem is the rapist, he is the offender and he needs to be accountable.

What possible poor choice would it be when an 84 year old woman is in her own home- minding her business - her home gets broken into and the offender sexually assaults her? What could see have done differently to avoid that from happening? Nothing, I reckon.
 
Old 01-06-2013, 03:30 PM
 
Location: Soldotna
2,268 posts, read 1,806,123 times
Reputation: 1067
Quote:
Originally Posted by ParallelJJCat View Post
It wasn't a bad neighborhood. It wasn't at night. Still her fault?
The girl was at a party with a bunch of boys and alcohol. May as well have been a bad neighborhood.


Quote:
What does the above have to do with the man raping her? BTW...she was an adult, not a starry-eyed teen.
Wait. We are talking about the teen still right? Or are you speaking of someone else?

Quote:
Lions can't make a choice NOT to eat zebras. Men CAN make a choice not to rape.
And women CAN make better choices...
 
Old 01-06-2013, 03:41 PM
 
2,873 posts, read 4,766,223 times
Reputation: 4292
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymouseX View Post
The girl was at a party with a bunch of boys and alcohol. May as well have been a bad neighborhood.




Wait. We are talking about the teen still right? Or are you speaking of someone else?
You said my friend was responsible for her rape because 'she thought she was safe in her neighborhood? Come on!'

So my question is was my friend just not meant to leave the house? Ever? She should have expected rape in a neighborhood known for its safety at mid-morning on a spring day?

You said my other friend was responsible for her rape 'because she trusted an unknown guy' Expect he wasn't unknown, and she wasn't a kid dating for popularity. He wasn't a jerk and hadn't been abusive before that point.

There is always a different choice. Another poster just brought up an old woman in her own home. Could she avoid being raped? Well, yes, probably. She could have bought a security system. She could have moved to a different neighborhood. She could have employed two guards to watch over her (but not male, because then it would be her fault if they raped her.)

So how dumb does the choice need to be before the woman becomes responsible for another person's actions? Is not having a security system dumb enough to make it her fault? Living alone? Leaving the house?

Breathing?
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