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Well, if the Mormons didn't add on to what Jesus taught, what's preexistence, or folks dying and becoming gods on other planets?
Joseph Smith restored what Jesus taught. These things were taught in the beginning and were believed by first and second century Christians. (I can provide evidence to support that statement if need be.) If you'd read my previous post, I made that very clear.
Quote:
You can say Mormonism is the reestablishment of the Church but that would leave God and Jesus impotent. Jesus starts a Church and then it fades quickly only to be reestablished by a man over 1800 years later? I don't think so. Since I agree that God and Jesus is omnipotent, Mormonism which ACTUALLY began in the 1800's can only false.
I know you don't think so. Thank you for your input.
Was Mormonism founded for the benefit of white men who wanted to become gods themselves and lay with every woman they desired legally by marrying them?
Of course it wasn't. There was never a time in the Church's history when people of African descent were not welcome as members. There was never a time in the Church's history when we had segregated congregations. As a matter of fact, Mormons were driven from their homes and out of what was then the United States for a large part because they tended to vote as a block and strongly opposed slavery. Yes, there was a fairly lengthy period of time when Black men were unable to hold the Priesthood. But Joseph Smith personally ordained Black men to the Priesthood. One Black man was even a Seventy (a leadership position within the Church). The ban did not begin until Brigham Young was the President of the Church, meaning that it could not conceivably have been founded with racial discrimination in mind.
With respect to men (white or otherwise) wanting to become gods is concerned, the doctrine of Eternal Progression did not originate with the Mormon Church. I discussed this extensively in post #9 of this thread.
With respect to men wanting to lay with every woman they legally desired, I have covered the topic of plural marriage extensively in posts #6 and #14 of this thread.
You've seen the move "Contact". What's more likely:
Jesus establishes His Church and then the Church, despite the fact that Jesus proclaimed that the gates of Hell would not prevail against it, went quietly into the night 40 years later only to be rediscovered and reestablished by a man in the 1800's despite not a single person knowing about this faith for 1800 years.
OR
That the Catholic Church, which has hard evidence that is is the Christ created Church, which stayed strong and visible for almost 2000 years as Jesus promised, is the true faith and that during a period of many Christian denominations popping into existence in America, a man in the 1800's dupes a bunch of folks that he was reestablishing a Christian church.
I'll take the later as truth. Why, because it just jives a whole lot better.
To the OP>>>>>>>I don't know much about the Mormon Church except for a few friends that were excommunicated for being gay. Their monetary contributions to organizations that are against equal rights for gay citizens and their condemenation of the gay themed movie LATTER DAYS. Though the church has "toned down" it's hatred vented at the LGBT community.
I'll take the later as truth. Why, because it just jives a whole lot better.
And I'll take the former, even though you worded it very differently than I would have done. I'm not interested in debating the matter with you, though, juj. I didn't start this thread to debate the truthfulness of Mormonism. I started it to clear up the misinformation that is being perpetuated about the religion. That's a time-consuming enough endeavor, particularly since people continue to post the same false statements, even after being corrected.
Does the Church excommunicate people for being gay?
No, but it does excommunicate people for having extra-marital sex. A heterosexual woman who lives with her boyfriend or a homosexual man who lives with his boyfriend are equally in danger of being excommunicated. The Church's official position is that unmarried people should remain celibate. The Church does not look upon "being gay" as sinful. It looks upon "sexual intimacy outside of marriage" as sinful.
To the OP>>>>>>>I don't know much about the Mormon Church except for a few friends that were excommunicated for being gay. Their monetary contributions to organizations that are against equal rights for gay citizens and their condemenation of the gay themed movie LATTER DAYS. Though the church has "toned down" it's hatred vented at the LGBT community.
Mormons dont hate anyone, and although it may be hard for some to reconcile, being pro marriage in the context of being Mormon does not equate to being anti-gay. Marriage between man and woman is considered the ultimate act for Mormons to create eternal families in the eyes of God. The Church after prop 8 did issue a statement saying they would support equal civil rights for gay couples, but will never budge on marriage regardless of if its legal or not.
You had me till you brought up Latter Days, which from a gay perspective may be cute. To Mormons its a mockery and so inaccurate to how things work in the mission field that its just ridiculous. Yes, I have seen a portion of this movie.....
I've never figured out what people who say this is the case really mean. Latter-day Saints definitely are aware of what is expected of them, but I've never seen the Church try to exert force on its members. I'll give tithing as an example. The Church teaches us to pay tithing, which is defined as "10% of one's increase." (Whether that's interpreted as gross pay or net pay is left entirely up to the individual.) Paying tithing is one of a dozen or so prerequisites for getting a temple recommend, and a temple recommend is required for entrance into any of the Church's 130+ temples worldwide. All members know of this requirement. It's not sprung on anyone by surprise during the temple recommend interview. There was a period of perhaps five or six years, a number of years ago, when my husband and I didn't pay a dime in tithing. During that period of time, we knew we were not worthy to attend the temple. We simply didn't ask for a recommend since we knew we'd be denied one. We were not, however, shunned by anyone for failing to keep this commandment. As a matter of fact, only our Bishop and his counselors would probably have even been aware that we were not paying tithing. We continued to attend church. We offered public prayers in our worship services, taught Sunday School classes, etc. and did everything else any full-tithe paying member would be able to do -- except attend the temple. Furthermore, no one -- not even our Bishop -- even mentioned to us that we really ought to start paying our tithing. Eventually we started paying it again, of our own free will. Does that really sound "controlling"?
Does the LDS Church believe all other religions/denominations are wrong?
To some degree, yes. Here's why... Let's say that there are 100 points of doctrine, on which different Christian denominations have varying beliefs. Consider the following questions for an idea of what I mean?
1. Is baptism required or optional? Should it be by immersion or by sprinkling? Should babies be baptized?
2. Are we saved by faith, by works, or by a combination of both?
3. Once a person is "saved," can he lose his salvation?
4. Is the Bible inerrant? Should it be our only source of doctrine?
5. Is transubstantiation or real presence a true doctrine or are the bread and wine/water symbolic of Christ's body and blood?
6. Are the Father, Son and Holy Ghost all part of one indivisible substance?
7. What is the fate of a good, honorable person who does not believe in Christ?
8. Should the Church allow women priests?
9. Which is the correct "Sabbath"? Saturday or Sunday.
10. Does God still speak to prophets?
There are currently over 30,000 different Christian denominations in the world. No two of them teach exactly the same things. In one way or another, their doctrines actually contradict each other. So, out of our hypothetical 100 different doctrines, one church might be teaching 25 correct ones and 75 incorrect ones. Another church might be teachings 90 correct ones and 10 incorrect ones. But no two are teaching exactly the same ones. Theoretically, it would be entirely possible that not a single one of the 30,000 is teaching the truth on all 100 doctrines. Mathematically, it is impossible that more than one of them is. So, do we believe they are "all wrong"? We believe "all of them are wrong to a greater or lesser extent."
Does that mean we would say their members are not Christians? No, of course not. We believe that anyone who looks to Jesus Christ as his Savior, who tries to live according to Christ's commandments and who sincerely considers himself to be a Christian is a Christian.
How do Mormons generally treat people of their own faith if they leave the Church? Do parents disown their own children who do so?
We treat them with respect, the same as we would treat them if they were members of the Church. As a member of the Church who lives in Salt Lake City, headquarters of the LDS Church, where roughly 50% of the population is LDS, I know literally thousands of Mormons. Almost every family I know of has had a family member leave the Church (most of them "unofficially").
My sister left the Church. Did my parents disown her? No.
Her husband left the Church. Did his parents disown him? No
Two of my husband's siblings left the Church. Did his parents disown them? No.
Both of my grown children left the Church. Did my husband as I disown them? No.
My nephew is an alcoholic and drug addict, who left the Church. Did his parents disown him? No.
My co-worker's son is now an atheist. Did she or her husband disown him? No.
I have two friends with non-celibate, gay sons? Did they disown them? No.
We do not disown our family members when they make bad choices (and yes, we believe it is a bad choice to leave the Church). We continue to love them, include them in all family activities and pray that they will someday have a change of heart. We would be disobedient to the council of our prophet and apostles if we were were to change the way we feel about our family members who leave the Church. Family is more important to us than anything except for God Himself. I won't say there aren't exceptions, but they definitely are exceptions and not the rule.
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