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I agree with you Even if Paul isn't speaking of the Faith of Jesus Christ, nevertheless, the Faith here isn't of ourselves, its a product of Gods Grace, and accompanies Salvation by Grace from Eph 2:5. Remember believers by Grace Acts 18:27
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
Here are a few other scriptures that come to mind:
Act 14:27 and having come and gathered together the assembly, they declared as many things as God did with them, and that He did open to the nations a door of faith;
Act 16:14 and a certain woman, by name Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, worshipping God, was hearing, whose heart the Lord did open to attend to the things spoken by Paul;
Php 1:29 because to you it was granted, on behalf of Christ, not only to believe in him, but also on behalf of him to suffer;
You are going to have to show, now, how Revelation 2:2 is not in conjunction with the agape love of God.
Otherwise, you lose.
What do you know of Revelation, Revelation speaks to Gentiles becoming Jews and it depicts 23 high holy days in detail from Rosh Hashanah to Shemini Atzeret.
You cant understand any of it because you arent a Jew or even trying to be a Jew, you arent in the religion of Christ, and Revelation is depicting what is said and done in 23 holy days of Messiah. You should really stop quoting it, it is quoting idioms, prays and functions done in the temple by priests and congregation during each of the holy days.
You dont know any of these traditions, prayers, idioms or rituals said and done in the 7 feasts of Christ.
It was written by a Jew in captivity in hidden coded form, and the code that unlocks the keys is what is said and done in the 7 feasts of Messiah that you havent a clue about.
You can write the date on every chapter of Revelation, and while every Christian should know this, they dont even try to learn it.
You
Revelation 2
and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
You
Revelation 3
Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
You are going to have to show, now, how Revelation 2:2 is not in conjunction with the agape love of God.
Otherwise, you lose.
You have plucked that from its context which is doing the opposite of what you claim it is doing. It is NOT confirming the apostles who came after the originals It is excoriating the false teachings of the Nicolaitans, followers of Nicholas, the first such appointed apostle. He was not the only such false apostle back then and YOU have no way of knowing how many of their teachings survived without testing them with the Holy Spirit as revealed by Jesus on the Cross.
You have plucked that from its context which is doing the opposite of what you claim it is doing. It is NOT confirming the apostles who came after the originals It is excoriating the false teachings of the Nicolaitans, followers of Nicholas, the first such appointed apostle. He was not the only such false apostle back then and YOU have no way of knowing how many of their teachings survived without testing them with the Holy Spirit as revealed by Jesus on the Cross.
The fact that the early church found the false apostles to be false indicates that they found the true apostles to be true. If the apostles who penned the holy scriptures had actually been false, they would have been discovered as such.
The church of Ephesus represents the early church and relates to the preservation of the Christian faith as the early church would discover who among the early teachers were true and false and would exalt the true teachers and would expose the false teachers as false.
If those who had penned the holy scriptures were false apostles, they would have been discovered as such and their teachings would not have been included in what we call the Holy Bible today.
They were good trees; and as such the fruit that they bore (the scriptures that they penned) was also good (Matthew 7:15-20).
The fact that the early church found the false apostles to be false indicates that they found the true apostles to be true. If the apostles who penned the holy scriptures had actually been false, they would have been discovered as such.
The church of Ephesus represents the early church and relates to the preservation of the Christian faith as the early church would discover who among the early teachers were true and false and would exalt the true teachers and would expose the false teachers as false.
If those who had penned the holy scriptures were false apostles, they would have been discovered as such and their teachings would not have been included in what we call the Holy Bible today.
They were good trees; and as such the fruit that they bore (the scriptures that they penned) was also good (Matthew 7:15-20).
Ephesus was the outlier view of the early church that believed in a wrathful God and eternal punishment. The majority view was UR. You have hooked your wagon to the false Gospel that served the purpose of worldly leaders and men seeking power over the masses.
Ephesus was the outlier view of the early church that believed in a wrathful God and eternal punishment. The majority view was UR. You have hooked your wagon to the false Gospel that served the purpose of worldly leaders and men seeking power over the masses.
Even if the majority view was UR (and I am not certain that it was) the understanding of the apostles was that of ET.
I will not argue that the majority view wasn't UR.
But I will take that information and turn it to the advantage of my own argument, that the truth of holy scripture is ET rather than UR.
Mat 7:13, Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Mat 7:14, Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Last edited by justbyfaith; 09-11-2021 at 12:31 AM..
Even if the majority view was UR (and I am not certain that it was) the understanding of the apostles was that of ET.
I will not argue that the majority view wasn't UR.
But I will take that information and turn it to the advantage of my own argument, that the truth of holy scripture is ET rather than UR.
Mat 7:13, Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Mat 7:14, Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
What you have translated as "destruction" is more properly translated as "waste" which is what the dross in your spirit IS. That is why it must be refined out. What you have interpreted as future truth actually refers to what was true back then. Few people back then were finding the narrow gate of agape love and forgiveness Jesus came to demonstrate and achieve to perfection.
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