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I see no indication of that either in Scripture or the historical teaching of the Church. As a matter of fact, I've never heard that before in my life. Is there a particular theologian who has taught that?
You tell me. Aren't you a professor? Isn't teaching what you do?
My adoption of Christianity was not through the efforts of any teacher or theologian specifically. I encountered an overarching consciousness in deep meditation that I know is God (the "knowing" cannot be explained or reasoned out). The descriptions of the Holy Spirit in the Bible and as demonstrated unambiguously by Jesus Christ on the Cross EXACTLY matched the consciousness I encountered and experienced directly. There is no doubt, confusion, or the possibility of a mistake.
Now, that could be a mere coincidence that such descriptions and actions would be found in the Spiritual Fossil Record of speculations about God, but I choose not to think so. Consequently, any descriptions or attributions to God that are NOT COMPATIBLE with those described and demonstrated by Jesus Christ on the Cross cannot be true, IMO. That is especially true of the primitive and barbaric nonsense attributed to God's wrath. The God exemplified by Jesus Christ would NEVER need such a horrendous and bloody sacrifice to forgive us for ANYTHING let alone some ancient disobedience by our progenitors. It is preposterous!
My adoption of Christianity was not through the efforts of any teacher or theologian specifically. I encountered an overarching consciousness in deep meditation that I know is God (the "knowing" cannot be explained or reasoned out). The descriptions of the Holy Spirit in the Bible and as demonstrated unambiguously by Jesus Christ on the Cross EXACTLY matched the consciousness I encountered and experienced directly. There is no doubt, confusion, or the possibility of a mistake.
Now, that could be a mere coincidence that such descriptions and actions would be found in the Spiritual Fossil Record of speculations about God, but I choose not to think so. Consequently, any descriptions or attributions to God that are NOT COMPATIBLE with those described and demonstrated by Jesus Christ on the Cross cannot be true, IMO. That is especially true of the primitive and barbaric nonsense attributed to God's wrath. The God exemplified by Jesus Christ would NEVER need such a horrendous and bloody sacrifice to forgive us for ANYTHING let alone some ancient disobedience by our progenitors. It is preposterous!
Yes, I'm familiar with your story. I just found it ironic that you, a teacher, said "what need have we of men to teach us?"
Also, your claim of Peter's possession of the keys being only temporary is a claim I've never heard before. I was just wondering where you had heard it.
Yes, I'm familiar with your story. I just found it ironic that you, a teacher, said "what need have we of men to teach us?"
Teaching requires possession of knowledge of the subject that exceeds what is available to the student. In the case of God, no such knowledge exists from which to be a teacher.
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Also, your claim of Peter's possession of the keys being only temporary is a claim I've never heard before. I was just wondering where you had heard it.
We are told that under the New Covenant, God has His truth "written in our hearts" and the Comforter (Holy Spirit) will guide us to it in agape love. My experience convinces me, and your Bible narrative about Jesus tells me that by dying on the Cross, His human consciousness was "born again" as a Spirit called the Comforter (His Holy Spirit) and would be sent to abide with us. The Holy Spirit came at Pentecost. What need would Peter have of keys or we of Peter except to spread the Good News?
Teaching requires possession of knowledge of the subject that exceeds what is available to the student. In the case of God, no such knowledge exists from which to be a teacher.
Yet you presume to teach us your agape love gospel...
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD
We are told
Told by whom? A man?
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD
that under the New Covenant, God has His truth "written in our hearts" and the Comforter (Holy Spirit) will guide us to it in agape love. My experience convinces me, and your Bible narrative about Jesus tells me that by dying on the Cross, His human consciousness was "born again" as a Spirit called the Comforter (His Holy Spirit) and would be sent to abide with us. The Holy Spirit came at Pentecost. What need would Peter have of keys or we of Peter except to spread the Good News?
I find it better to place my trust in something more objective than one's experience, whether mine or another's.
Teaching requires possession of knowledge of the subject that exceeds what is available to the student. In the case of God, no such knowledge exists from which to be a teacher. We are told that under the New Covenant, God has His truth "written in our hearts" and the Comforter (Holy Spirit) will guide us to it in agape love. My experience convinces me, and your Bible narrative about Jesus tells me that by dying on the Cross, His human consciousness was "born again" as a Spirit called the Comforter (His Holy Spirit) and would be sent to abide with us. The Holy Spirit came at Pentecost. What need would Peter have of keys or we of Peter except to spread the Good News?
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Originally Posted by EscAlaMike
Yet you presume to teach us your agape love gospel...
Not really. I interpret what you have been taught by men who had a very different concept of God from that of their supposed teacher and exemplar, Jesus Christ. Sadly, their misconception of God is what caused them to completely misinterpret what Jesus did on the Cross resulting in the OPPOSITE understanding of God than the one demonstrated by Jesus.
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Told by whom? A man?
I am using the only information available and it is the same as that used by your mentors.
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I find it better to place my trust in something more objective than one's experience, whether mine or another's.
When you have direct experience and then encounter a narrative that exactly matches what you encountered, that tends to support your experience. When you can reconcile the elements of the narrative with your revised understanding of God using the same narrative source, that tends to solidify your understanding of God.
How do you explain that the Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Anglicans, Copts, and Armenians all hold to Apostolic succession?
But it's the RCC dreaming stuff up...
Jesus said "thou art Peter and upon this rock I will build My church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it"
There is nothing here about a supposed succession, Peter did not say anything about a succession, the bible does not speak about any successor to Peter.
The rock is the foundation upon which the church is built, you cain't have a succession of foundations, there can only be one foundation. The foundation is Christ whom Peter taught.
No scripture for that you are just believing that because your church tells you it is so. Which dtinks of adding to what the scriptures actually state.
besides all the other verses, there's:
"and I confer a kingdom on you, just as my Father has conferred one on me," Luke 22:29
and that kingdom came with keys, given to Kefa, connoting authority; visible as day in the scriptures.
"and I confer a kingdom on you, just as my Father has conferred one on me," Luke 22:29
and that kingdom came with keys, given to Kefa, connoting authority; visible as day in the scriptures.
And the key to the kingdom is Jesus Christ, not the rcc. And the scripture you refered to was directed to all the followers of Jesus and not just Peter.
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