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Old 09-06-2022, 07:30 AM
 
923 posts, read 237,898 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G.Duval View Post
Elect means spiritual, even Gnostics who are known, basicaly spiritually (like shamans ) present themselves in spirit where they may receive knowledge and even foreknowledge. That us why Paul tells Christians to train their senses (Heb.5). Elect examples are like Paul or Thimoty , Paul's hand picked.
I'm only saying people have nothing to do with salvation. It is God who arbitrarily selects a group of names to save.
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Old 09-06-2022, 07:31 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal Flavius View Post
No, the prodigal son and the son who stayed home are God's only 2 sons.

Jesus only told us the literal history of Israel and Judah, and EVERY ONE KNEW ISRAEL WOULD RETURN ONE DAY.

Israel had been lost for 700 years BECAUSE they rejected the law, they rejected Judaism from the very first king, and herding swine is THE VERY DEFINITION OF LAWLESSNESS..


Judah has never left God, the prodigal Israel left God 320 years before God ended their kingdom for lawlessness.
And 7000 is example of elect, in this case from "holy race".
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Old 09-06-2022, 08:32 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G.Duval View Post
Elect is depicted as Older Brother in Prodigal Son Story.
"‘Son, you are always with me,’ the father said, ‘and all that is mine is yours."
Did you understand this?

Quote:
Hence one of the blessings of election in Christ before the foundation of the world, it is that the chosen ones have been accepted of the Father, hence in a accepted justified state with God the Father; And this again before the foundation of the world, and before Faith in time. God is well pleased with their persons, according as He chose them in Christ before the foundation, and as Paul wrote to the Corinthian Church 1 Cor 1:30

30But of him [God the Father] are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
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Old 09-06-2022, 08:38 AM
 
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Originally Posted by 1689dave View Post
Foreknew =

30.100 προβλέπομαιb; προγινώσκωb: to choose or select in advance of some other event—‘to choose beforehand, to select in advance.’

This means people do not determine their election. It would not be grace if they did. It would be rewarding the self-righteous.

Louw, J. P., & Nida, E. A. (1996). In Greek-English lexicon of the New Testament: based on semantic domains (electronic ed. of the 2nd edition., Vol. 1, p. 362). United Bible Societies.
Also when it comes to election, the word foreknew has to do with knowing the person chosen, moreso than his or her actions. God had a knowledge of them, a close association like a companion, or like His Sheep or members of His Body the Church. Thats why He could tell people or will tell people "I never knew you" meaning I never knew you as my companion, my close associate, never had a union with you.
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Old 09-06-2022, 12:01 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1689dave View Post
Foreknew =

30.100 προβλέπομαιb; προγινώσκωb: to choose or select in advance of some other event—‘to choose beforehand, to select in advance.’

This means people do not determine their election. It would not be grace if they did. It would be rewarding the self-righteous.

Louw, J. P., & Nida, E. A. (1996). In Greek-English lexicon of the New Testament: based on semantic domains (electronic ed. of the 2nd edition., Vol. 1, p. 362). United Bible Societies.
faith and self-righteousness are not synonymous terms.
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Old 09-06-2022, 04:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by justbyfaith View Post
faith and self-righteousness are not synonymous terms.
They are if faith is a condition you must meet to save yourself. This is not biblical faith, but a self-righteous act of the depraved will to act like a Christian to become one. It's worse. It is salvation by hypocrisy
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Old 09-06-2022, 09:38 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 1689dave View Post
They are if faith is a condition you must meet to save yourself. This is not biblical faith, but a self-righteous act of the depraved will to act like a Christian to become one. It's worse. It is salvation by hypocrisy
The Bible teaches us that we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand (Romans 5:2).

So I'm afraid your point of view is unbiblical.
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Old 09-07-2022, 03:43 AM
 
923 posts, read 237,898 times
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Originally Posted by justbyfaith View Post
The Bible teaches us that we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand (Romans 5:2).

So I'm afraid your point of view is unbiblical.
No. it means you reject salvation by grace and trust in your own self-righteousness to save you. Jesus is the author and finisher of the believer's faith.
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Old 09-07-2022, 12:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 1689dave View Post
They are if faith is a condition you must meet to save yourself. This is not biblical faith, but a self-righteous act of the depraved will to act like a Christian to become one. It's worse. It is salvation by hypocrisy
Agreed !
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Old 09-07-2022, 12:24 PM
 
4,627 posts, read 1,170,418 times
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Originally Posted by justbyfaith View Post
The Bible teaches us that we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand (Romans 5:2).

So I'm afraid your point of view is unbiblical.
Thats talking about the saved, regenerate believer has access to Gods throne of Grace. It has nothing to do with the spiritually dead sinner exercising an act of faith to get themselves saved.
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