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All this talk of transportation systems is a moot point if people don't live, work and play within walking distance of these systems. Do any of these cities really meet that qualification?
So let's look at other ways of defining "urbanism" -- independently or locally owned restaurants, hi-caliber nightclubs, extensive boutique shopping -- Miami wins this hands down. I also tend to look at the PEOPLE in an area and their ATTITUDES as to whether a place has an URBAN or PROGRESSIVE attitude. Ghetto culture is NOT urbanism. Timid overweight suburbanite Republicans and Bible thumpers are NOT part of urbanism. Attractive, in-shape people with low obesity rates, people who speak multiple languages, people willing to try new things, who take care of themselves and learn about different cultures -- these are the traits that define urbanism.
Miami of all 4 of these cities wins this HANDS DOWN. Fashion designers usually open their first stores in New York, LA and Miami. Miami is a trend-setter when it comes to nightlife, music, DJ culture (non hip-hop DJs) such as the Winter Music Conference and the Electronic Music festival. Health-conscious restaurants. Model agencies. Artistic media outlets. Boutique hotels. Progressive politics.
Plus, the beautiful beaches in Miami add a classy sensuality that you find in places like the French Riviera, Ibiza, the Greek Islands, Honolulu and other upscale beach locales.
Residents of another city would rather pick Myrtle Beach or Panama City. That's their prerogative. But then they can't claim urbanism in the same breath.
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Originally Posted by Melchior6
I'm originally from the DC area but now live in Charleston. I do visit Atlanta now and then. Anyway the last time I was there my ..um impression was that the city was being overrun by a lot of young hoodlum types. And I would guess that had something to do with the demise of the Underground..? And yeah Buckhead was disappointing. Anyway, I haven't visited the areas you mentioned but next time I'm in Atlanta I will defintely check them out.
If you are from D.C. then I know you here the same thing about it. Chocolate City?Home of Marion?LOL!!
Like the other poster said ,nobody really hangs out Downtown ATL near Underground.It does need some work.But go just a few blocks North and you will find new emerging areas around the Aquarium,Centennial Olympic Park all the way up Marietta St to W.Marietta St.Buckhead is going through a big time Development.It will not be finished until 2012.It still will not be what it was,but something much more upscale."Streets of Buckhead"http://http://www.thestreetsofbuckhead.com/ (broken link)
http://davidshanahan.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/streets-of-buckhead.jpg (broken link)
http://www.greenpeaches.net/storage/StreetsOfBuckhead.jpeg (broken link)
Miami of all 4 of these cities wins this HANDS DOWN. Fashion designers usually open their first stores in New York, LA and Miami. Miami is a trend-setter when it comes to nightlife, music, DJ culture (non hip-hop DJs) such as the Winter Music Conference and the Electronic Music festival. Health-conscious restaurants. Model agencies. Artistic media outlets. Boutique hotels. Progressive politics.
Plus, the beautiful beaches in Miami add a classy sensuality that you find in places like the French Riviera, Ibiza, the Greek Islands, Honolulu and other upscale beach locales.
Residents of another city would rather pick Myrtle Beach or Panama City. That's their prerogative. But then they can't claim urbanism in the same breath.
This fantasized version of Miami is obviously not reality.
Downtown is basically the hangout for inner city teens and homeless people my dude, Midtown and Buckhead are really Atlanta's CBD. The only thing Downtown is GA State and Centennial Park, and all those young hoodlum types you saw were just little high school kids. Thats the thing to do in Atlanta when your a teenager, hop on the train and ride downtown to 5 Points. I did it when I was in high school, and my children (if Im still here) will probably do the same. Its a big deal because the 4 different lines of our subway meet up at the 5 points station which is right next to Underground, and kids go down there to meet up and see other kids from different parts of Atlanta. So if you went downtown to 5 Points/Underground and got scared by a bunch of high school aged kids, then you would probably get scared in a lot of other places too
I don't know about the term "scared" perhap ill at ease is a better term. Apparently a lot of other people feel the same way because besides those so called "high school kids", me and my wife found ourselves all alone there. Oh and in case you're wondering, I'm Black.
I DO NOT HAVE TO BE IN SANDY SPRINGS TO DETERMINE IF ITS URBAN OR SUBURBAN! THE PLACE IS SUBURBAN!
Ummm, that's the same thing I said too.
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Lots of people have made claims about Houston just off Streetview; I don't get pissed because it's probably true. Anyone can go on streetview and look at The Woodlands and Pearland and come to the conclusion that they are both suburban. It dosen't take rocket science to determine that.
It doesn't take rocket science to realize that is not a proper way to make a judgement of an area, particularly if no one has been there in person.
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Your too busy concentrating on that one remark and skipping over other posters claiming SS was urban. Your arguing with someone because they made a statement about comparing SS to exurbs in Texas. You don't like it? too bad, I still think so.
WTH is this, a conversation at the HS cafeteria table? What next, "I know you are, but what am I?" And it's "you're," not "your." And again, my argument is that you're making snap judgments and conclusions of a location based on anecdotes and surfing the web on Streetview, not so much about what the area looks like. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this.
I don't know about the term "scared" perhap ill at ease is a better term. Apparently a lot of other people feel the same way because besides those so called "high school kids", me and my wife found ourselves all alone there. Oh and in case you're wondering, I'm Black.
Im sure you were all alone, like I said in my other post, no one hangs out downtown except teenagers, and bums. And I wasnt wondering what race you were as you alluded to you being black earlier, and if you felt ill at ease well then, I guess its just what your used to. I lived in DC for a few years and have spent time in allot of other cities as well, and for the life of me I never have and never will get how people can come to Atlanta and feel scared or "ill at ease". If you felt ill at ease in 5 Points, then you would probably ball up like a child if you walked thru Englewood in Chicago, Trinidad in DC, Barrone & Melphamine in New Orleans or the many other areas that make 5 points in Atlanta look like Beverley Hills. I find it hilarious how some people such as yourself try to paint Atlanta as some giant slum, but when my cousins from North Philly come down here they always comment on how clean Atlanta looks
If you are from D.C. then I know you here the same thing about it. Chocolate City?Home of Marion?LOL!!
Like the other poster said ,nobody really hangs out Downtown ATL near Underground.It does need some work.But go just a few blocks North and you will find new emerging areas around the Aquarium,Centennial Olympic Park all the way up Marietta St to W.Marietta St.Buckhead is going through a big time Development.It will not be finished until 2012.It still will not be what it was,but something much more upscale."Streets of Buckhead"http://http://www.thestreetsofbuckhead.com/ (broken link)
Thanks. That looks nice. I will definitely check it out.
This fantasized version of Miami is obviously not reality.
Lol, how could I have missed that ridiculous post? LMAO...So I suppose since L.A has all of that and moreso than Miami, L.A. is the epitome of "urbanism."
Urban has a lot of different definitions. His/hers just happens to exclude Black folks and he/she is equating it to a "classy sensuality" (whatever the hell that is). So does Boston have a "classy sensuality," and if it does not, is it not urban? What about Philly or Baltimore? I'd love to know what these would be considered since they don't exude "classy sensuality."
Sounds like Miami boosterism with someone with little experience in Atlanta or any other southern metropolis.
It doesn't take rocket science to realize that is not a proper way to make a judgement of an area, particularly if no one has been there in person.
WTH is this, a conversation at the HS cafeteria table? What next, "I know you are, but what am I?" And it's "you're," not "your." And again, my argument is that you're making snap judgments and conclusions of a location based on anecdotes and surfing the web on Streetview, not so much about what the area looks like. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this.
Thank you for you're cooperation, sir. Did I use it right this time!??!?!
Im sure you were all alone, like I said in my other post, no one hangs out downtown except teenagers, and bums. And I wasnt wondering what race you were as you alluded to you being black earlier, and if you felt ill at ease well then, I guess its just what your used to. I lived in DC for a few years and have spent time in allot of other cities as well, and for the life of me I never have and never will get how people can come to Atlanta and feel scared or "ill at ease". If you felt ill at ease in 5 Points, then you would probably ball up like a child if you walked thru Englewood in Chicago, Trinidad in DC, Barrone & Melphamine in New Orleans or the many other areas that make 5 points in Atlanta look like Beverley Hills. I find it hilarious how some people such as yourself try to paint Atlanta as some giant slum, but when my cousins from North Philly come down here they always comment on how clean Atlanta looks
Dude I don't want to get inot a pissing contest with you. But when I was younger I use to hang out some pretty rough areas in South East DC my self like Bowling Green, Berry's Farm etc..even Bed Stuy in New York. But I guess when you're older and financially sucessful, you start to see yourself as a target..
I think the underlying issue Mel, and I don't know what you looked like back in them days, but imagine when you were hanging out as a young'n many people probably assumed the same about you. They saw you with your boys, and imagine if they just looked at y'all and said that was a sign the neighborhoods were in decline. Most of those kids hanging out down there are just that, kids, who need something to do. Personally, we used to do the downtown thing because the midtown and Buckhead spots were all 21+. So New Year's Eve was spent multiple times going to the Undeground.
People in general have a distrust for young people simply because we're taught to be scared of young folks and think they're all up to no good, which, statistically, is very far from the case.
Granted the apprehension is a natural feeling and hard to avoid, but we all got started on this topic from you saying that the presence of "young hoodlums" was a sign of Atlanta's downfall. Certainly, it's not, as evidenced by the active nightlife that has now spread all over the city, the city of Atlanta's steady population growth, and influx of young professionals both black and white who are now finding the city more convenient than the suburbs and are steadily transforming formerly blighted neighborhoods. Secondly, those young kids are probably not hoodlums and are mostly just kids who need something to do, just like in most major cities where nightlife is geared towards 21 up crowds. It's just unfortunate that if we were to see a group of white skater kids downtown, I'm sure our immediate reaction wouldn't be that the city is in decline.
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