Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Do you always try to mix up the intent of a very clear post or is it just that you like to think you are in possession of so much information begging to be shared? The woman died of measles in as much as those children died from the vaccine. Measles compromised her already weakened state and pneumonia, whether from measles or not, would have killed her regardless. If those children were never vaccinated they would be alive today. Since we cannot verify what is in the vaccine, we cannot access risk until after it is too late. Therefore, mandating vaccination is wrong.
..
SuzyQ is in possession of a tremendous amount of information that she quite generously shares on these threads to clear up fear mongering and deliberate misrepresentation. I'm glad you recognize the depth and breadth of that knowledge because facts and science actually matter when it comes to health.
Poor hygiene kills exponentially more people than any medical intervention, if you want to panic over anything I'd suggest you focus on that.
Even in third world countries, the risk of NOT vaccinating is incredibly high and the risk of a medical error administering the vaccine is very low. While the deaths are tragic, hopefully they will improve the processes and hygiene at those hospitals.
To try to use this as evidence of your anti-science bias is a profound overreach and as others have pointed out is one of the best examples of the anti-vax crew not letting the facts get in the way of a good conspiracy.
SuzyQ is in possession of a tremendous amount of information that she quite generously shares on these threads to clear up fear mongering and deliberate misrepresentation. I'm glad you recognize the depth and breadth of that knowledge because facts and science actually matter when it comes to health.
Poor hygiene kills exponentially more people than any medical intervention, if you want to panic over anything I'd suggest you focus on that.
Even in third world countries, the risk of NOT vaccinating is incredibly high and the risk of a medical error administering the vaccine is very low. While the deaths are tragic, hopefully they will improve the processes and hygiene at those hospitals.
To try to use this as evidence of your anti-science bias is a profound overreach and as others have pointed out is one of the best examples of the anti-vax crew not letting the facts get in the way of a good conspiracy.
All she is doing on here is preaching to the choir. Proof is in the pudding. Has she changed anybody's minds even just here on CD with quoting science until pigs fly?
My personal vote for myself is flat out NO. If anyone else cares to comment? Has your mind been changed regarding vaccinations by the science quoting "medical professionals"?
All she is doing on here is preaching to the choir. Proof is in the pudding. Has she changed anybody's minds even just here on CD with quoting science until pigs fly?
My personal vote for myself is flat out NO. If anyone else cares to comment? Has your mind been changed regarding vaccinations by the science quoting "medical professionals"?
You do realize it doesn't make you sound too credible to post on a scientific issue and then to feel like putting quotation marks around "medical professionals" helps your case? Most people seek a wide range of professional guidance from those trained in the field and who research extensively.
In answer to your question, yes, absolutely I've learned a tremendous amount from SuzyQ and the others who post clear science to defeat every anti-science post. I've shared that science with my friends with young children to help them understand the clear benefits of childhood vaccinations.
Every single one of these threads and the anti-science mumbo jumbo that gets tossed out to scare folks away from legitimate public health prevention (and the very clear data refuting those claims from SuzyQ, Katarina and others) reinforces my support for vaccine mandates in public schools so conspiracy theorists can't put others at risk.
So yes, to many many people science matters.
There are those that are too rigid, stubborn or self absorbed to consider their role in a public health model and I'm willing to bet that SuzyQ, Katarina and the others wouldn't waste her time on them.
However, on threads like this where someone might read a headline like the OP is irresponsibly using to advance an agenda (even when the facts don't support it), science and data are CRITICAL to ensuring that person protects their child from the very real, very deadly diseases vaccines prevent.
However, on threads like this where someone might read a headline like the OP is irresponsibly using to advance an agenda (even when the facts don't support it), science and data are CRITICAL to ensuring that person protects their child from the very real, very deadly diseases vaccines prevent.
Using the title of the article as the title of the thread is irresponsible and advancing an agenda? What facts don't support that there was panic when kids started dying when vaccinated?
The reservoir of any number of diseases is in animals, not sure what your point is exactly.
Did you read the post I quoted?
Quote:
Originally Posted by WayneCounty how do you think they diagnose it if it has "never been isolated in a human"???? did you pass sixth grade biology???
If it can be found in animals then it can be isolated from them to use in diagnostic tests such as antibody or PCR but if it was never isolated in humans then it actually may not exist or at the very least doesn't appear to replicate enough to cause harm. Antibody and PCR testing don't isolate viruses only parts of what they think are parts of the virus or the body's reaction to it in the form of antibodies.
Being able to diagnose isn't dependent on having it be isolated in a human (which it hasn't ever been).
Do you always try to mix up the intent of a very clear post or is it just that you like to think you are in possession of so much information begging to be shared? The woman died of measles in as much as those children died from the vaccine. Measles compromised her already weakened state and pneumonia, whether from measles or not, would have killed her regardless. If those children were never vaccinated they would be alive today. Since we cannot verify what is in the vaccine, we cannot access risk until after it is too late. Therefore, mandating vaccination is wrong.
The woman died from pneumonia caused directly by the measles virus.
If the children in Kenya had been vaccinated by someone adequately trained to do it properly they would be alive today. If the vaccine had not been stored in the same refrigerator with laboratory chemicals they probably would be alive today, but there is no guarantee that the "cleaner" might not still have chosen the wrong thing to reconstitute the vaccine with. If the vaccine had been the problem, then children in other areas of the country who received the vaccine from the same lot would have gotten sick, too. They did not.
In your eagerness to blame the vaccine you jumped the gun when you started this thread. There is to date no evidence that the vaccine itself caused the two deaths and strong reason to believe it did not.
Quote:
In cases where hemorrhagic fever kills, it would not need cell culture growth to be seen... it would be in sufficient quantity already.
You asked for photos of Ebola from human beings; I provided them.
Quote:
Also, that last article has a photo that can be purchased on Getty Images. It was first displayed in 2010 in an article about cold blasting as a treatment for drug resistant bacteria. Not the first time an image has been repurposed...
The source of the virus in the photo is clearly stated. It originally came from a human being. The original photo was taken in 1976, not 2010.
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj
The reservoir for ebola is in animals...
Humans catch it from animals, but the virus has clearly been isolated from humans, despite the statement to the contrary from the poster that started this particular exchange. It is idiotic to suggest otherwise.
Using the title of the article as the title of the thread is irresponsible and advancing an agenda? What facts don't support that there was panic when kids started dying when vaccinated?
The day before you posted your link the media had already reported that it was a hygiene and administration issue unlikely to be related to the vaccine, and likely related to an untrained cleaner administering the vaccine.
You either didn't even bother checking your own link or you deliberately omitted the actual facts because they didn't support your flimsy assertion. The headline wasn't the issue, using an African hygiene issue as support for your anti-science stance against vaccines? That is imo irresponsible and advancing an agenda.
The woman died from pneumonia caused directly by the measles virus.
She had underlying health conditions and was in a health facility when she contracted measles which showed zero symptoms and was only discovered upon her death. There is so little known about this case. We know more about the situation in Kenya then this one. WA state disease surveillance hasn't even put the case into their surveillance stats that are up to date through the end of August. Her death was reported in early July.
Quote:
If the children in Kenya had been vaccinated by someone adequately trained to do it properly they would be alive today. If the vaccine had not been stored in the same refrigerator with laboratory chemicals they probably would be alive today, but there is no guarantee that the "cleaner" might not still have chosen the wrong thing to reconstitute the vaccine with. If the vaccine had been the problem, then children in other areas of the country who received the vaccine from the same lot would have gotten sick, too. They did not.
Are you claiming to know what caused the deaths? That's more then the investigators know. How would you know that the deaths were due to the cleaner (who had worked for the health dept. for 8 years and administered vaccinations a number of times before) using the wrong solution. That may be what you think could have possibly happened but that is just your theory and is not confirmed. The results of any investigation (if there was one) have not been released. If you have info on that please share your source.
Quote:
In your eagerness to blame the vaccine you jumped the gun when you started this thread. There is to date no evidence that the vaccine itself caused the two deaths and strong reason to believe it did not.
The thread title was correct. The children died after being vaccinated for measles in Kenya. That's a fact. The details are yet to be known. I doubt we will ever know. All that the officials are doing currently is pointing fingers. The media hasn't released any info for some time.
Last edited by MissTerri; 09-28-2015 at 02:11 PM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
