Are we about to become the #1 hotspot in the U.S.? (Houston: professionals, costs)

[jerbear30]

Originally Posted by JTEMT-B

I’m sorry, what experience do you have? How many coronavirus patients have you come in contact with? What title comes after your name that makes me think your opinion is even worth wiping my ass with?

It’s funny how y’all wanna “thank me for my service,” up until I disagree with your false ideologies. 1.25 million people die in car accidents each year, and COVID deaths haven’t even reached 600k. Doctors and scientists also argued that we were short on ventilators, and now they are all sitting in a warehouse somewhere collecting dust. I’ve used my ventilator once since covid started, and that wasn’t even for a covid patient. Go to your closest medical center and ask a RT how “short” they are on ventilators. Everyone I’ve asked replies, “We never even got close.”

But no, CNN is much more reliable than we are out in the field.

I'm not talking about ventilators. Ventilators WERE exaggerated, which we all now know. I'm happy to concede something when there is evidence for it, as are scientists themselves. But to use that specific mistake as a "proof" that doctors and scientists are going to be wrong about everything is not rational. Technically it counts as a rhetorical fallacy (if they make one error, therefore everything they say is an error). It's a way to avoid the substance of what science is saying. My wife's oncology team made a couple of errors in treating her, but they were generally brilliant and they cured her of her disease. I think you can see the danger of canceling the scientific community for one mistake when we should obviously judge them on the whole, especially when so much is at stake.

As to your own experience, yes it is by definition anecdotal. That means its limited to what you know and you are one person. You are correct that the virus does not kill a high percentage of the people infected, so it is even unlikely that as one EMT you will know someone who has been infected who also dies. That doesn't mean that a whole ton of people won't die. This is because the disease infects a TON of people so even a small percentage is quite high. Here in the US, 38k people died in car accidents last year, while 140k have died from COVID already. That IS unprecedented. The danger of disease is not only determined by the percentage of people it kills, but also by the number of people it infects. Think about it for a moment from a math and statistics perspective. If a disease infects 100 people and kills 100% of them, it will not be nearly as dangerous as a disease that infects millions of people and kills only .05% of them, as COVID does.

Finally, I do appreciate the work that EMT's do, but the last I checked, EMT's are not qualified to advise based on their own experience about international pandemic protocols. I don't trust myself to know that and I don't trust you because you are not qualified. I don't even trust CNN. I DO trust the consensus of scientists and doctors.

[JTEMT-B]

Originally Posted by jerbear30

I'm not talking about ventilators. Ventilators WERE exaggerated, which we all now know. I'm happy to concede something when there is evidence for it, as are scientists themselves. But to use that specific mistake as a "proof" that doctors and scientists are going to be wrong about everything is not rational. Technically it counts as a rhetorical fallacy (if they make one error, therefore everything they say is an error). It's a way to avoid the substance of what science is saying. My wife's oncology team made a couple of errors in treating her, but they were generally brilliant and they cured her of her disease. I think you can see the danger of canceling the scientific community for one mistake when we should obviously judge them on the whole, especially when so much is at stake.

As to your own experience, yes it is by definition anecdotal. That means its limited to what you know and you are one person. You are correct that the virus does not kill a high percentage of the people infected, so it is even unlikely that as one EMT you will know someone who has been infected who also dies. That doesn't mean that a whole ton of people won't die. This is because the disease infects a TON of people so even a small percentage is quite high. Here in the US, 38k people died in car accidents last year, while 140k have died from COVID already. That IS unprecedented. The danger of disease is not only determined by the percentage of people it kills, but also by the number of people it infects. Think about it for a moment from a math and statistics perspective. If a disease infects 100 people and kills 100% of them, it will not be nearly as dangerous as a disease that infects millions of people and kills only .05% of them, as COVID does.

Finally, I do appreciate the work that EMT's do, but the last I checked, EMT's are not qualified to advise based on their own experience about international pandemic protocols. I don't trust myself to know that and I don't trust you because you are not qualified. I don't even trust CNN. I DO trust the consensus of scientists and doctors.

I’m an EMT now? I thought I was a paramedic. Hmm, guess you know best.

We actually have our own COVID protocols that were decided on in conjunction with our medical directors, but our critical care team wrote them. Paramedics, not physicians. I believe what the CDC puts out on their own websites for the most part, but I DO NOT (and no one should) trust the WHO and the MSM.

Also, suspected covids are being counted as confirmed covids for government kickbacks. I know that for a fact.

[As Above So Below...]

Originally Posted by elnina

Don't forget that now we are testing ONLY people with symptoms, so many asymptomatic but positive going to be not detected or accounted for.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/06/u...-shortage.html

Also an increase in people dying at home suggests coronavirus deaths in Houston may be higher than reported

That isn’t true though. I’ve been tested twice and never had any symptoms. Having symptoms isn’t a requirement to be tested.

[elnina]

Did you read the articles I posted?
You have been tested, but wouldn't be tested anymore. For right now, only people with symptoms get tested. Test shortage and labs above capacity.

[jerbear30]

Originally Posted by JTEMT-B

I’m an EMT now? I thought I was a paramedic. Hmm, guess you know best.

We actually have our own COVID protocols that were decided on in conjunction with our medical directors, but our critical care team wrote them. Paramedics, not physicians. I believe what the CDC puts out on their own websites for the most part, but I DO NOT (and no one should) trust the WHO and the MSM.

Also, suspected covids are being counted as confirmed covids for government kickbacks. I know that for a fact.

I'm sorry about the EMT/Paramedic error. I guess it's hard for me to reconcile the CDC's perspective on COVID, most of which I've read quite carefully, and your statement that COVID is mostly media-generated cow poo. It seems like that is not at all the CDC perspective.

[As Above So Below...]

Originally Posted by elnina

Did you read the articles I posted?
You have been tested, but wouldn't be tested anymore. For right now, only people with symptoms get tested. Test shortage and labs above capacity.

Ive been tested twice asymptomatically and one of those was last week. I have insurance so perhaps that’s the difference.

[JTEMT-B]

Originally Posted by jerbear30

I'm sorry about the EMT/Paramedic error. I guess it's hard for me to reconcile the CDC's perspective on COVID, most of which I've read quite carefully, and your statement that COVID is mostly media-generated cow poo. It seems like that is not at all the CDC perspective.

I do feel the need to apologize for being condescending. I felt that when you said “what nonsense,” my intelligence and experience was being challenged. Nevertheless, I am a professional, and I hold myself to a higher standard than what I have portrayed myself as here. I’m man enough to admit when I’m wrong, so I apologize for my aggression and condescension.

That being said, you do have a point about social distancing and wearing PPE in circumstances of close proximity. However, there is a massive disconnect between what is being reported and what we are seeing here in the field. We are all scratching our heads here. They say cases are up 400%, yet we see nothing on our end. The ICU’s have vacancies, the ED’s COVID intubation room gathers dust, and all of the nursing homes that house 70% of our covid cases are allowing visitors and downgrading PPE requirements. Where are all of these cases?!

I think the CDC compiles the data they have available, but the CDC is at the mercy of the facilities who report these cases for factual information. I think the CDC has a good idea of what we are dealing with, but I don’t believe the numbers are 100%.

[Mr. Krinkle]

You may not be seeing anything in the field, but the TMC sure is.
https://www.tmc.edu/coronavirus-upda...med-surg-beds/

[chris_ut]

Which area do you work JTEMT? My wife is an icu doctor in the valley and their ICUs are full right now. They had to move adults into the children’s ICU. Earlier in the week they were out of ventilators but then 5 of the patients died that same day and freed some up.

[jerbear30]

Originally Posted by JTEMT-B

I do feel the need to apologize for being condescending. I felt that when you said “what nonsense,” my intelligence and experience was being challenged. Nevertheless, I am a professional, and I hold myself to a higher standard than what I have portrayed myself as here. I’m man enough to admit when I’m wrong, so I apologize for my aggression and condescension.

That being said, you do have a point about social distancing and wearing PPE in circumstances of close proximity. However, there is a massive disconnect between what is being reported and what we are seeing here in the field. We are all scratching our heads here. They say cases are up 400%, yet we see nothing on our end. The ICU’s have vacancies, the ED’s COVID intubation room gathers dust, and all of the nursing homes that house 70% of our covid cases are allowing visitors and downgrading PPE requirements. Where are all of these cases?!

I think the CDC compiles the data they have available, but the CDC is at the mercy of the facilities who report these cases for factual information. I think the CDC has a good idea of what we are dealing with, but I don’t believe the numbers are 100%.

I have heard that there are some areas that have a real paucity of cases and then some other areas that account for the heavy load of cases nationwide. This is why it's so hard to manage for individual facilities--it's spread out unevenly. I'm glad you are working with the CDC guidelines. I think this will be a slog but that in a year from now, we'll be past the worst of it and on our way to economic recovery.