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Nice trick you tried to pull there. Adding in the 46% that don't pay federal income taxes to that 90% of your. Of course when you add in non payers in with the middle class who do pay more than the top 1% you might get a lower overall effective tax rate.
How about you check the second highest quintile and compare their effective rate with the top 400 taxpayer effective rate.
God, when are people like you going to stop with this ridiculous refrain. Just because you pay sales tax on the local level doesn't mean you contribute one iota to the Federal coffers.
Fact is, almost half of this country pays nothing. And 1/4 of this country actually TAKES money from the system.
Look at the chart I just posted. 3/5 (the MAJORITY ) of this country TAKES money from the system (gets more in services and benefits than they pay in taxes).
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Meanwhile, those of us in the top 5% of the country put in 60% of everything. Someone isn't paying their fair share, but it sure as hell isn't me.
First, without check, I doubt you checked either, your single mother probably would not qualify for these programs you list. And I suspect your dollar amounts are maximum benefits that she wouldn't get based on the income you attributed to her. Especially, when you add the mystery man's income. If you are going to lay out a scenario please keep it factual and legal. Let's not make everyone a criminal in your example to justify your agenda. Let's assume the single mother reported ALL household income or the mystery man doesn't exist.
Let's look at this single mother's costs:
Rent, national average about $800 a month or $9,600 a year.
Food and personal needs about $600 a month or $7,200 a year.
Utilities, heat, lights and water about $250 a month or $3,000 a year.
Car loan, about $250 a month or $3,000 a year.
So far I have costs of $22,800.
Gas for that car, 30 gallon at $3.33 or $100 a week or $5,2000 a year.
$28,000 now, what are we forgetting? Taxes?
Let's add another $2,500 in all the state, local, city, sales, FICA, gas and others like licensing of the driver and the car.
$30,500 now, still think there are thing we left out.... Insurances? Entertainment? Cable? The costs associated with producing their income? Clean clothes? Repairs on that beater car? Christmas and birthdays? Telephone?
Forget about vacations, movies adding to their education, forget saving or planning to put the kid in college.
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Originally Posted by Mircea
That is a patently false statement.
Since you're having such a difficult time, I'll spell it out for you in gory detail.
As I've proven before, there are people who pay no taxes of any kind. With the Earned Income Credit not only do they pay no federal taxes, but the taxpayers actually give them a gift of money.
Someone with an adjusted gross income of $17,000 (that means they've already taken exemptions and deductions) and one child pays $0 in federal taxes and they get a free cash tax-payer gift of $2,865.
Google EIC and go to the IRS web-site and do it yourself if you want.
Assuming the entire $17,000 is 100% disposable ((which means I am giving you the benefit of the doubt) and assuming every single thing they purchase is taxable (again, I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt) at a rate of 5.5% Sales Tax they would have paid $935 in Sales Taxes.
The free taxpayer gift of $2,864 would negate their Sales Taxes.
The story so far....
Our free-loading Welfare Queen has paid $0 in federal taxes, plus received a free cash tax-payer gift of $2,865, against $935 in Sales Tax.
That leaves our Welfare Queen with $1,930 of free tax-payer gift money to spend as she pleases.
The city earnings tax workers pay here is 2.1% of income (and not refundable) so that would be $675 on $32,150 ($32,150 - $15,150 for standard deduction for head of household and two exemptions = $17,000)
The story so far...
Our Welfare Queen paid $0 in federal income taxes, and got a free cash tax-payer gift of $2,865.
$2,865 Free Tax-Payer Cash Gift to the Welfare Queen
- $935 in sales taxes (assuming the entire $17,000 was taxable)
- $675 in city/county earnings payroll tax
-------
$1,255
Our Welfare Queen still has $1,255 in free tax-payer cash left.
If she buys 30 gallons of gasoline per week, she'll spend about $632 in State and federal gasoline excise taxes.
That still leaves our Welfare Queen $600+ from her original generous free tax-payer gift.
So, as you can see, those who receive the EITC pay no taxes of any kind.
More children increases the amount of the free generous taxpayer gift.
Now some will scream FICA/Medicare, but that isn't really a tax. She will get a 150% to 200% return on they money she paid in, meaning she'll get back every penny she put in and then 50% to 100% more.
You don't see any need, because you're blinded by your ideology, and you refuse to examine the facts as reality really is.
So, we have a woman and 2 children, and their income is $11,300 per year, so they are in "poverty," right?
Man are you naive.
They're only looking at the woman's actual earned income.
Let's add:
1] $6,072 in Food Stamp benefits
2] $560.40 in WIC benefits
3] $5,520 in ADC
4] $7,200 in HUD benefits
5] $3,600 in Electric/Heat susidies
That comes to:
$22,952 in benefits, plus the earned income equals $34,252
Now let's add the EITC.
Your estimated Earned Income Tax Credit amount for 2010 is $4,530.
(I pulled that straight from the IRS web-site).
That brings it to $38,782
Now, living with her is a man who probably fathered one of the children. He has a job that pays $12.50/hour and has his own company sponsored health care benefits. He averages 40 hours per week.
His income is $26,000 per year.
So her real true actual total earned and unearned income is $64,782
And you said people like that are in "poverty." Ha.
And then what is so hypocritical is that you want to tax the unearned income of the "rich" yet you ignore the unearned income of those in "poverty" (snicker).
The only thing remotely resembling poverty in the US would be on an Indian Reservation (pick one). The people you claim are "impoverished" aren't really living in poverty, and even if that were true, it is their own choice, because they made bad decisions about drugs, alcohol, gambling, criminal activity or relationships, and I'm under no moral or ethical obligation to subsidize their life-styles. That's their mission in life and if they cannot do it here, then they need to emigrate and live where they can.
God, when are people like you going to stop with this ridiculous refrain. Just because you pay sales tax on the local level doesn't mean you contribute one iota to the Federal coffers.
Fact is, almost half of this country pays nothing. And 1/4 of this country actually TAKES money from the system. Meanwhile, those of us in the top 5% of the country put in 60% of everything. Someone isn't paying their fair share, but it sure as hell isn't me.
When are people like you going to understand that you can't squeeze blood from a stone? Those making $22,000 and less don't have spare money to pay income taxes. Do you really want to force the elderly, living on Social Security and possibly a meager pension, who have to skimp on every penny, to pay more taxes while you leave the ultra-rich with the lowest tax-rates in generations? Do you really think those college students trying to earn book money are the real goldmine that's going to heavily contribute to federal revenue? Do you really think those high-school kids working minimum wage at McDonald's are the ones that you want to increase taxes instead of the top 400?
The people who don't pay taxes earn a tiny portion of national income. They are the ones struggling. Of course, the morally bankrupt conservatives are the modern day Sheriff of Nottinghams -- wanting to raise taxes on the poor and struggling class and leave the rich private jet owner class with low taxes. It's clear that the GOP does believe in tax-hikes, just not on the rich.
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Originally Posted by Mircea
As I've proven before, there are people who pay no taxes of any kind. With the Earned Income Credit not only do they pay no federal taxes, but the taxpayers actually give them a gift of money.
Someone with an adjusted gross income of $17,000 (that means they've already taken exemptions and deductions) and one child pays $0 in federal taxes and they get a free cash tax-payer gift of $2,865.
Nobody disputed that some people don't pay taxes. That's a pretty weak claim of victory. What is in dispute is fairness. Unlike you, I think that before we start looking for more government revenue in the pockets of people earning $17K a year with children, we should be looking for government revenue from billionaires who have a far greater ability to pay taxes without enduring ANY hardship.
It's mindboggling that your side will defend tax-breaks for those with abundance and favor tax-increases for those living below the poverty line.
The people who don't pay taxes earn a tiny portion of national income.
Then they can pay a proportionately tiny portion of the federal income tax revenue. Why shouldn't everyone feel the pain when the government overspends? That's the only thing that will unite the country to rein in out-of-control government spending and skyrocketing national debt.
Like I said, when you absolve any particular group from paying federal income tax, you create a class of people that will always be able to vote themselves more and greater freebies, services, and benefits at someone else's expense. That enables and encourages corruption as politicians try to outdo each other promising more and better freebies, services, and benefits in exchange for votes.
Everyone should have a stake in how, and how much, the government spends by being an equal contributor. The lack of such now causes politicians to play one side of the country against the other with the end result that nothing productive ever gets accomplished.
Everyone should have a stake in how, and how much, the government spends by being an equal contributor. The lack of such now causes politicians to play one side of the country against the other with the end result that nothing productive ever gets accomplished.
Sound familiar?
Ah, so paying taxes is a "stake?" Well, I think the rich should have a bigger stake since they have a bigger stack. What gets accomplished is larger government revenues.
I don't know. This nuevo-middle class has sure risen and blossomed during and after "Reaganomics". However, where the true inequality lies is between the working-class and the modern "middle class", the working-class has suffered ever since the 70's(?) and has been all but forgotten. Now this new middle-class created since that time is falling out. Maybe the trend will continue and the masses will at least level out, even if the rich stay rich. If you're suffering, get a master's degree. Then maybe in 20 years when too many have master's degrees somebody can come on here and tell you that you need a doctorate.
Ah, so paying taxes is a "stake?" Well, I think the rich should have a bigger stake since they have a bigger stack. What gets accomplished is larger government revenues.
When are people like you going to understand that you can't squeeze blood from a stone?
FALSE ARGUMENT..
No one is suggesting we squeeze money from a stone. I think EVERYONE should pay taxes, and yes, EVERYONE who does, should have their taxes lowered. The problem isnt a lack of income, its OVER SPENDING..
You sit here non stop babbling about how the rich should pay more, and your only defense for this nonsense is that the poor are poor, as if somehow the rich are to blame for it.. Nonsense.. If you live on welfare and social security, YOU are destined to be poor. Its the way of the wold. You cant have people in poverty, who are rich. By mathmatical calculations, thats impossible.
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) of this country TAKES money from the system (gets more in services and benefits than they pay in taxes).
