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Thank you. I am SO VERY SYMPATHETIC about the stress people experience in real life, who just want to relax and watch the game. That guy on bended knee is just too much stress for me to handle...
Never mind the sort of "stress" these players taking a knee are drawing attention too, before they begin their efforts to entertain you in the comfort of your own home. Can I have another one of those beers?
Yeah, because people are really going to take overpaid athletes seriously when it comes to protesting their perceived injustices. Especially when a good portion of the players have been charged with crimes and walked away with little to no actual punishment. Kneeling over inequality is laughable.
Police brutality? Here's a thought: tell your community to stop being criminals and putting themselves in a situation where the police even notice them. There's a reason police tend to be more likely to go on the offensive in black neighborhoods: that's where the crime happens and where they are more likely to get assaulted by the people who they are trying to protect and serve. Any experienced officer with experience in the "hood" is going to be far more likely to react with swift violence in those neighborhoods than in suburbia. It doesn't matter if the officer is white, black, or chartreuse. It's dangerous, and they're more likely to meet perceived threats with actual violence. If the players were really worried about deaths in the black community they'd be protesting their own communities in areas like Chicago and St. Louis, where shooting up the neighborhood is a weekend hobby.
I fully support their right to protest, but I also have the right to laugh at their idiocy.
No doubt this is an issue that also seriously divides America, with Trump in the mix in typical embarrassing fashion, and no doubt there have been more than a few prior threads about this as a result, but rather than let this get buried in one of those many prior threads, I think Kareem's recent insights about all this sports protest business are particularly worthy of consideration...
"Sports is one of the few areas in which Americans of all races can talk to each other. Right now, it may be the country’s best hope for meaningful dialogue"
If only Trump and more Americans would/could consider what they are so badly missing. Purposely or unwittingly, I'm really not sure...
They're engaging in politics at work. Their employer has the right to tell them not do to so. If they don't like it, they're free to find other employment
My employer has a "no political discussions at work" policy, so the NFL isn't unique. Politics at work is disruptive, especially in this day and age.
It's really that simple. You, and the author of the article, are making it far more complicated than it is.
Here's what the kneeling NFL players and their apologists need to understand - the NFL is an entertainment business. It makes 100% of its revenue either directly or indirectly from the audience. The audience is under no legal, contractual, constitutional or even tyrannical obligation to give their patronage to that particular business.
Over the last two seasons, television ratings, ad revenue and merchandise sales for that business are all down. All of these measures relate directly to the interest of the audience. The audience has begun speaking, and their message is that right, wrong or indifferent, a growing number of them simply do not care, do not want their sports entertainment politicized and will be increasingly tuning out the NFL and its products.
There's exactly nothing the NFL collective bargaining agreement, a written scold by former NBA star, or the admonition of the Social Justice left can do to make people watch something they don' feel like watching. Either the NFL entertains those who seek it out for entertainment, or the audience tunes out.
That's the point. That's the end of the story.
So you think that the concussion issue, the end of the cable television era and the fact that games aren't competitive isn't a problem I think out of the 17 Sunday Night games last season, over 10 were two possession or more games. Close games will keep fans and I realize that we can't force those games. I won't be naïve and think that we can, but there weren't flexed schedule being utilize to put a potential great game replace a meh game last year either. I mean who would watch the Browns versus Bengals besides the loyal fans of both teams?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian
The purpose of business is to create, sustain and grow profits for the owners of that business. Period. That's a basic, fundamental economic principle. Even non-profits have to make profit, they just have to put the profit back into the business instead of paying it out to shareholders/owners. No profit means eventual death of the business. Period, the end.
The NFL is an entertainment business. It makes its profits by entertaining the audience with the sport of American football, not with social justice, political advocacy or lobbying. Its revenue and profit depend entirely on whether or not people want to watch/patronize the sport of American football as entertainment.
If the business, for whatever reason, gives the audience reasons NOT to tune in, they hurt their revenue, which in turn hurts the profit. Hurt profit long enough, the business dis. It ceases to exist. Thus, the NFL as a business will do that which is in the interests of the business, not society, not political advocacy according to one ideological bent, and not according to the scolds of a small fraction of the employees and their apologists.
And maybe there is an audience that wants racial politics and cultural scolding with their football. Maybe that audience is even bigger than the audience that just wants to watch football. It's the NFL's business. I will make my choice based on what entertains me, not what the culture thinks I owe them.
I seem to remember reading the NFL had a good year last year in regards to revenue. In fact it went up 4.9% so please, tell me how the kneeling is really hurting the bottom line of the NFL. They are billionaires rather than billionaires?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CtrlEsc
This is my attitude too. I am a veteran. I fought and lost a lot under that flag (or more precisely with it on my shoulder.)
However, I swore to uphold the Constitution. Part of that is allowing people the freedom to speak their minds (or kneel if they want.) I find it disrespectful that they would kneel rather than stand as is convention but that's their freedom to do so. If the NFL wants to allow them to take a knee, I see it as no different than Casual Friday at the office. A relaxing of the rules.
I have the choice to support the NFL financially or not; I choose not.
Additionally, the local high school team decided that they wanted to kneel to in support of Kaepernick. So when they came to my door looking to sell stuff for football boosters, I said no and explained to them why. I am a veteran. I fought for them to have that freedom to protest, but I do not have to support their choices financially. It's my freedom to choose what I support.
I thank you for your service and you are doing things right. What I see from too many is this attack on the players for not being patriotic because they don't stand for the anthem. That isn't patriotism, that is fascism when you force people to be patriotic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferd
your issue isn't with me then. you can "bull" me all you want but nothing you said addresses what I said.
nowhere in my comments did I discuss "rights".
shoot I didn't even discuss what I think owners should do.
What I said was, these guys are claiming they are bringing attention to a serious problem in this country. The thing is, if that's real, then what they need are people like ME to side with them but instead of doing something that actually brings people like me on board they are peeing on my leg and telling me its raining.
I aint biting. im not going to support a pack of knucklehead intentionally insulting me. I am not going to take serous a group of guys who collectively put a hundred million bucks in the bank every year and cry "poor pitiful me"...
so again you can call bull and you can cry about rights but nothing you said deals with my post or thoughts on the matter.
1) you said Donald Trump called it like it was it in your OP and he didn't. I have gone to professional sports events far too many times in my life and I can recall fans at NASCAR races, hockey, football, soccer, baseball and even basketball (by far the sport I've been to the least) sitdown during the anthem. Why don't you and others claiming the players are pissing on the flag and the military doing it to then? I'm calling it like it is. I don't like the kneeling but it is their right to do it.
2) If you were lectured about the issue, would you listen to the message? I think many wouldn't.
I honestly think the Google, Facebook, YouTube, & Twitter crowd should be allowed to censor their material. You sign a usage agreement with a private company to use their service.
NOW, that said, there should be equal opportunity to start businesses that can compete with those services. One of the things to consider is the Internet is not made up of unlimited resources. The large companies compete (or pay for) premium bandwidth and server space. Little companies may have trouble competing against the Google, Facebook, YouTube, & Twitter monsters for service providers (or get completely priced out due to pressure.) If the Trump administration wants everyone to have an equal voice on the Internet, they may have to subsidize independent companies under a specific size.
No doubt this is an issue that also seriously divides America, with Trump in the mix in typical embarrassing fashion, and no doubt there have been more than a few prior threads about this as a result, but rather than let this get buried in one of those many prior threads, I think Kareem's recent insights about all this sports protest business are particularly worthy of consideration...
"Sports is one of the few areas in which Americans of all races can talk to each other. Right now, it may be the country’s best hope for meaningful dialogue"
If only Trump and more Americans would/could consider what they are so badly missing. Purposely or unwittingly, I'm really not sure...
So I got as far as when he said: "For people of color, professional sports has always been a mirror of America’s attitude toward race: as long as black players were restricted from taking the field, then the rest of black Americans would never truly be considered equal, meaning they would not be given equal educational or employment opportunities. Even after they were permitted to play, sports has been the public face of America, not what we sentimentally profess to believe when waving flags on the Fourth of July, but of our actual daily behavior."
I could apply the same reasoning to women. Women athletes restricted from taking the field/court, restricted in general from sports thus women throughout the US would never truly be considered equal, given equal educational or employment opportunities.
Sound kind of silly when you replace people of color with women doesn't it.
With this logic, a company should also be 100% free to do business with anyone for any reason. Don't you agree?
The fact of the matter the NFL isn't a 100% private corporation. It benefits from billions of dollars of taxpayers subsidies in the form of free stadiums, laws to protect its monopoly and forced fees from cable/satellite subscriptions. Let's cut all of that out first, and then we can talk about the rest.
No I don't agree. There's a difference between the general public who does business with a company and the employees of the company. If a business serves the public then they must provide equal access to that service for the public regardless of race, gender, sexual orientation, etc. If the business is paying someone to work for them then those First Amendment protections do not apply.
By the way, I don't agree with the social media companies banning conservatives unless it was because of something that was being said that might incite a danger to the public.
Right wing whiners always complain about the over sensitivity of the left.
Yet apparently, less than 1% of the people on a football field silently dropping to 1 knee or raising their hand is so offensive they can't bear to keep their tv on without being offended and wanting people fired, deported, or killed (Kapernick t-shirts with him in the crosshairs being sold outside some stadiums). Talk about your sensitive crybabies who have no understanding of freedom...
Meanwhile, for as long as the anthem has been played before games, plenty of people are zoned out, paying no attention, drinking beer, eating hot dogs, or taking the anthem time to go drop a deuce while the bathrooms are less busy. Never bothered them a bit, never a word about disrespect .
Only 6 players kneeled the week before the orange buffoon started attacking the NFL, the following week 200 players joined. Did they all suddenly hate America and the flag? Probably so if you ask right wingers, but its obvious they were standing up against a president demanding specific behavior from them like the wannabe dictator he is.
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