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Old 06-01-2016, 10:23 AM
 
Location: Free State of Texas
20,438 posts, read 12,775,263 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
People around the world are converting to religions you would consider to be false: Islam, Mormonism, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Scientology, and so forth. And yet you do not see those conversions as evidence for the validity of those religions. Why not?
Because Christianty is the only religion where God reaches out to man.
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Old 06-01-2016, 10:27 AM
 
Location: USA
18,489 posts, read 9,151,071 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
Because Christianty is the only religion where God reaches out to man.
If so, then why are people converting to non-Christian religions?
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Old 06-01-2016, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Free State of Texas
20,438 posts, read 12,775,263 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
If so, then why are people converting to non-Christian religions?
Because it's the natural inclination to try to earn the praise of our god.
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Old 06-01-2016, 10:42 AM
 
Location: USA
18,489 posts, read 9,151,071 times
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Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
Because it's the natural inclination to try to earn the praise of our god.
I don't understand what you are saying here.
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Old 06-01-2016, 10:45 AM
 
Location: Free State of Texas
20,438 posts, read 12,775,263 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
If so, then why are people converting to non-Christian religions?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
Because it's the natural inclination to try to earn the praise of our god.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
I don't understand what you are saying here.
It the natural inclination to reach out to the gods. Man has been searching for its creator from the beginning of time.
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Old 06-01-2016, 10:53 AM
 
Location: Northeastern US
19,956 posts, read 13,450,937 times
Reputation: 9910
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
Because Christianty is the only religion where God reaches out to man.
This is something I was told when I was a fundamentalist, too, but when I started to actually study other belief systems as to what they actually believe, rather than listen solely to what critics and opponents of those religions claim they believe, I was quickly disabused of that notion.

Usually the claim you are making is associated with (or really used as an illustration for) the claim that Christianity is "not a religion" which is defined as "man trying to please god". By contrast, supposedly, Christianity is supposed to be about god taking the initiative to save man, which man could not do for himself.

The actual truth is that "man trying to please god" is a contrived definition for religion, the actual definition of which is "A belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially one or more personal gods" or "a particular system of faith and worship". Or metaphorically, "a pursuit or interest to which one ascribes supreme importance". Since I suspect you believe in and worship a superhuman controlling power (the Christian god), subscribe to a particular system of faith and worship (Fundamentalist Christianity) and consider your participation in that belief system to be of supreme importance, then for any commonly understood and used definition of "religion", you are part of one.

So setting aside the contrived definition, we can see that most religions have a deity and that deity "reaches out to" man, communicating with him via seers or holy books, issuing instructions, threats, and so on, just as your god is said to do. No other religion has precisely the same concept of grace and forgiveness, but that's a circular argument: if Christianity had precisely the same dogma as another religion, it would BE that other religion, or that other religion would BE Christianity.

Even Christians who are not particularly Calvinist and believe they are saved by grace and "not of yourselves", and "once saved always saved", believe also in sin and punishment for sin and things such as "the unpardonable sin". So I see the offer of grace, mercy and forgiveness as largely an affectation than a reality. You have to accept the grace and mercy "or else", and then you're expected to "be perfect, as your father in heaven is perfect" anyway as evidence of the free gift, so it's a distinction without a difference when you actually get down to it.
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Old 06-01-2016, 11:27 AM
 
17,966 posts, read 15,959,911 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
This is something I was told when I was a fundamentalist, too, but when I started to actually study other belief systems as to what they actually believe, rather than listen solely to what critics and opponents of those religions claim they believe, I was quickly disabused of that notion.

Usually the claim you are making is associated with (or really used as an illustration for) the claim that Christianity is "not a religion" which is defined as "man trying to please god". By contrast, supposedly, Christianity is supposed to be about god taking the initiative to save man, which man could not do for himself.

The actual truth is that "man trying to please god" is a contrived definition for religion, the actual definition of which is "A belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially one or more personal gods" or "a particular system of faith and worship". Or metaphorically, "a pursuit or interest to which one ascribes supreme importance". Since I suspect you believe in and worship a superhuman controlling power (the Christian god), subscribe to a particular system of faith and worship (Fundamentalist Christianity) and consider your participation in that belief system to be of supreme importance, then for any commonly understood and used definition of "religion", you are part of one.

So setting aside the contrived definition, we can see that most religions have a deity and that deity "reaches out to" man, communicating with him via seers or holy books, issuing instructions, threats, and so on, just as your god is said to do. No other religion has precisely the same concept of grace and forgiveness, but that's a circular argument: if Christianity had precisely the same dogma as another religion, it would BE that other religion, or that other religion would BE Christianity.

Even Christians who are not particularly Calvinist and believe they are saved by grace and "not of yourselves", and "once saved always saved", believe also in sin and punishment for sin and things such as "the unpardonable sin". So I see the offer of grace, mercy and forgiveness as largely an affectation than a reality. You have to accept the grace and mercy "or else", and then you're expected to "be perfect, as your father in heaven is perfect" anyway as evidence of the free gift, so it's a distinction without a difference when you actually get down to it.
The difference between Christianity and all other religions is Christ Jesus is the promised Messiah and He died for all mankind. The result of His death, entombment and resurrection will be the undoing of all we get from Adam's one unjust act. No other religion has this.

Also, the "you shall be perfect even as your heavenly Father is" is prophetic. Once those Jews are filled with God's spirit and He writes His laws on their hearts and they walk righteously and in love, then they will be perfect even as their Heavenly Father is.
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Old 06-01-2016, 11:35 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,016,467 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
Because Christianty is the only religion where God reaches out to man.
Ah...Perfect reason to switch over, even if it is a relatively new car...
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Old 06-01-2016, 11:36 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,016,467 times
Reputation: 2227
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
Because it's the natural inclination to try to earn the praise of our god.
I thought it was man's natural inclination to sin?...
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Old 06-01-2016, 12:13 PM
 
5,187 posts, read 6,937,844 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Freak80 View Post
People around the world are converting to religions you would consider to be false: Islam, Mormonism, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Scientology, and so forth. And yet you do not see those conversions as evidence for the validity of those religions. Why not?

Because God through His Son Jesus Christ is the only path to Heaven.
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