Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
So already we have gone from 1,799,000,000 Muslims confirming that to zero Muslims confirming that
they confirm the true thing and reject the not true
it is true he subsequently flew off up into the sky
and one day Allah would send Christ, son of Mary, and he will descend at the white minaret in the eastern side of Damascus wearing two garments lightly dyed with saffron and placing his hands on the wings of two Angels.
and it is not true Jesus was resurrected from the dead .
he did not die yet and never died.
Quote:
Where did Muhammad get his information from that he wrote into the Quran? Was it not from the gospels and the legends that were circulating at the time?
he got it from angel Gabriel and Gabriel got it from Allah.
Last edited by truth_teller; 08-01-2017 at 09:14 AM..
if there is something in the Bible made you say such thing then that in the Bible is not correct or you misunderstand it.
There is plenty in the Bible that I consider frankly silly. The Qur'an as well. But I am referring here to a statement YOU made.
"Jesus was not resurrected from the dead because he did not die and he was not crucified but it was appeared to them that he was crucified"
According to the NT Jesus appeared to his followers after his death. He walked and talked with them, and convinced them of his resurrection. If what you are contending is true, then Jesus lied to them all.
So already we have gone from 1,799,000,000 Muslims confirming that to zero Muslims confirming that simply because there were no Muslims around at the time. Right?
In fact, by your own admission, the Quran was not written for more than another 500 years. At least the Gospels, as inaccurate and unreliable as they are, were written some 40 years after the alleged events (and doctored and embellished from time to time thereafter). At least the writers of the gospels could claim they knew someone who knew Jesus or someone who did know him.
Where did Muhammad get his information from that he wrote into the Quran? Was it not from the gospels and the legends that were circulating at the time?
In my opinion, Islam is the result of sibling rivalry. The successful spread of Christianity based on the line of Abraham through Isaac is probably what motivated Mohammed to produce one based on the line of Abraham through Ishmael. I could be wrong.
According to the NT Jesus appeared to his followers after his death. He walked and talked with them, and convinced them of his resurrection. If what you are contending is true, then Jesus lied to them all.
not every thing in the NT is correct ,
and What happened after the so-called crucifixion?
Mark and Matthew and Luke and John say every one said some different than the other
Matthew said many of the saints rose from their graves
Mark said the veil of the Temple was torn
Luke said the sun turned dark
John said nothing
Some of us think the crucifixion might have taken place but that it was final. Although there is the swoon theory and a possible scenario has been suggested for an actual survival. I used to like the idea that the man (and he was just a man and no more) planned his own crucifixion out of some crazy zeal and actually managed to pull it off (although I doubt he realized just how bad the experience was going to be). However, the likelihood of that being realistic is questionable. For starters, we don't even know for sure whether the man actually existed.
The four Gospels represent the ONLY information on the life Jesus that anyone supposes has any connection to valid history. And a good deal of what is contained in the NT strains credulity. In fact, it is flatly unbelievable. Here is a short amended version of events that closely follows the accepted story, but which does not require any recourse to any supernatural occurrences. I am not claiming that this is what actually occurred, simply that it explains the events without recourse to supernatural claims.
Matthew 27:
[62] Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate,
[63] Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again.
[64] Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first.
[65] Pilate said unto them, Ye have a watch: go your way, make it as sure as ye can.
[66] So they went, and made the sepulchre sure, sealing the stone, and setting a watch.
The day after the crucifixion chief priests went out to Joseph's tomb, and finding it covered with a large stone, and owing to the nature of the day (the Sabbath and Passover) did not open and search it, but instead secured what was an already empty tomb! Why was the tomb already empty? Because Joseph of Arimathea, who was a disciple of Jesus, never intended that his brand new family crypt should be the final resting place for Jesus, but only used it as a convenient place to wash and prepare the body. Because the day was late and his tomb was "nigh at hand" (John 19:42) to the place where Jesus had been crucified. The next day when the priests secured Joseph's tomb, the body of Jesus was already being relocated to it's actual intended final resting place by his disciples.
And so exactly what the priests feared the disciples intended to do is EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED. Joseph's tomb proved to be empty. Six weeks later the disciples returned to Jerusalem and began to circulate the rumor that Jesus had "risen" from the dead. Something only they witnessed, according to them.
So where would that final resting place have been? It was a strong custom among the Jews to bury their dead with family members. Any family of any substance had a personal family crypt where family members were interred together. Rich folks like Joseph could afford hand cut family crypts to be constructed. Folks of lesser means tended to use natural caves and caverns, usually with the family named carved at the entrance. If Joseph the rich man truly wanted to honor Jesus, he would have had the body transported home to be buried with is own family, not inter him with Joseph's family. Home to his family in Galilee, about 65 miles to the north east of Jerusalem. All down hill.
Matthew 28:
[16] Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.
The remaining apostles all journeyed to Galilee after the crucifixion!
The only thing I am assuming is that Joseph of Arimethea never intended to use his tomb as the final resting place for Jesus, only used it as a convenient place to wash and prepare the body, and had the body shipped home to be buried by Jesus' own family members.
So, is this they way things actually played out? There is no way to know just how much of the story is valid. This particular accounting makes perfect sense however. It DOES NOT lead to supposing that a corpse came back to life and subsequently flew away I am afraid.
...
So, is this they way things actually played out? There is no way to know just how much of the story is valid. This particular accounting makes perfect sense however. It DOES NOT lead to supposing that a corpse came back to life and subsequently flew away I am afraid.
The account makes so much more sense than the gospels as they are written. It leaves little room to question or doubt. It sounds realistic - believable.
The miracles in the gospels are obvious clues that the stories are made up. Water into wine? Feeding five thousand after the sermon on the mount. Five thousand listening to a sermon with no sound system? The feeding them with two fish and five loaves was the easy part. It didn't happen.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
