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Old 03-09-2012, 11:40 AM
 
52,112 posts, read 41,953,123 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orangeish View Post
Weird, I don't miss any Bulls games and I rarely see him drive to the hoop. He will take a decent amount of shots that aren't threes, but they are almost always jumpers. Korver is the definition of a specialist type player, if he isn't making his shots, he is a huge detriment to the team, as he cannot play defense well (though he is slightly improved, still way below average).

Like most 3 point speacialists, he can either shoot them in, or out of a game. Last night was a clear example of the later.

Personally, I don't want to see him traded. The only player of value that I would be ok with them trading would be Asik who seems to have regressed bigtime the last 6 weeks or so. No coincidence, Noah has been playing very well in that stretch.

Overall, I still don't feel very good about the Bulls chance at a title with this group. They seem like one of those bridesmaid teams, like the old school Cavs/Portland teams, or a more recent example, the Suns. Not so much in playing style, but just that they will be extremely effective in the regular season, but will be outmatched by the very top teams in a playoff series. Obviously I hope I am wrong, but that is where I see them right now.
Agreed. I think the Bulls still need some seasoning. I'm not losing any sleep over the team though because of thier youth and having PILES of trade-bait if they need to make any moves.

We'll see how the playoffs go and if they need to make some off-season deals then they certainly have the ammunition to make it happen.

 
Old 03-09-2012, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Cook County
5,288 posts, read 6,376,095 times
Reputation: 3070
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Agreed. I think the Bulls still need some seasoning. I'm not losing any sleep over the team though because of thier youth and having PILES of trade-bait if they need to make any moves.

We'll see how the playoffs go and if they need to make some off-season deals then they certainly have the ammunition to make it happen.
Yeah, thats very true. For whatever reason I am a total prisoner of the moment with this team and I have a hard time looking down the road, but they should be good for years to come. Internally I am fretting like this is a do or die season for Rose and the Bulls, and it really should not be.

Man, with my downer outlook, you'd think I was a cubs fan or something.
 
Old 03-09-2012, 12:04 PM
FBJ
 
Location: Tall Building down by the river
39,615 posts, read 50,446,723 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orangeish View Post
Weird, I don't miss any Bulls games and I rarely see him drive to the hoop. He will take a decent amount of shots that aren't threes, but they are almost always jumpers. Korver is the definition of a specialist type player, if he isn't making his shots, he is a huge detriment to the team, as he cannot play defense well (though he is slightly improved, still way below average).

Like most 3 point speacialists, he can either shoot them in, or out of a game. Last night was a clear example of the later.

Personally, I don't want to see him traded. The only player of value that I would be ok with them trading would be Asik who seems to have regressed bigtime the last 6 weeks or so. No coincidence, Noah has been playing very well in that stretch.

Overall, I still don't feel very good about the Bulls chance at a title with this group. They seem like one of those bridesmaid teams, like the old school Cavs/Portland teams, or a more recent example, the Suns. Not so much in playing style, but just that they will be extremely effective in the regular season, but will be outmatched by the very top teams in a playoff series. Obviously I hope I am wrong, but that is where I see them right now.

I think the main problem with the Bulls is the fact they only have three players who can consistently score which is Rose, Deng, and Korver. Boozer and Noah are very inconsistent on top of the bench not being that strong. So if Rose and Korver or Deng is having a off night, there is no other player on the team to pick up the slack which may hurt them once they get deep in the playoffs. And with Rip Hamilton being out that puts more pressure on Rose, Deng, and korver to score or the other team will build a big lead and then the Bulls will have to depend on their defense to get them back in the game.
 
Old 03-09-2012, 12:16 PM
 
52,112 posts, read 41,953,123 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TVandSportsGuy View Post
I think the main problem with the Bulls is the fact they only have three players who can consistently score which is Rose, Deng, and Korver. Boozer and Noah are very inconsistent on top of the bench not being that strong. So if Rose and Korver or Deng is having a off night, there is no other player on the team to pick up the slack which may hurt them once they get deep in the playoffs. And with Rip Hamilton being out that puts more pressure on Rose, Deng, and korver to score or the other team will build a big lead and then the Bulls will have to depend on their defense to get them back in the game.
Chicago Bulls 2012 Statistics - Team and Player Stats - ESPN

Boozer is the Bulls 2nd highest ppg. and even Noah averages 10pts a game and his offense is much improved.

Korver only puts in about 7ppg.

I think we can all agree that it would be nice if the Bulls had a little more offense but I don't see them doing anything drastic with their current roster until the off-season.
 
Old 03-09-2012, 12:23 PM
FBJ
 
Location: Tall Building down by the river
39,615 posts, read 50,446,723 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Chicago Bulls 2012 Statistics - Team and Player Stats - ESPN

Boozer is the Bulls 2nd highest ppg. and even Noah averages 10pts a game and his offense is much improved.

Korver only puts in about 7ppg.

I think we can all agree that it would be nice if the Bulls had a little more offense but I don't see them doing anything drastic with their current roster until the off-season.

That's surprising because Deng seems like the 2nd option for scoring based on what I saw in the last few games. I mean if I';m a Bulls fan and a bucket is needed to take the lead in the 4th qtr I would prefer Deng over Boozer any day of the week. And Noah seems more like a bench player not really a starter so maybe he is out there because of what he does on the defensive end of the floor.
 
Old 03-09-2012, 12:24 PM
 
52,112 posts, read 41,953,123 times
Reputation: 32530
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orangeish View Post
Yeah, thats very true. For whatever reason I am a total prisoner of the moment with this team and I have a hard time looking down the road, but they should be good for years to come. Internally I am fretting like this is a do or die season for Rose and the Bulls, and it really should not be.

Man, with my downer outlook, you'd think I was a cubs fan or something.
HoopsHype - NBA Salaries - Chicago Bulls

The Bulls have IMO an almost picture perfect salary situation, an example of excellent roster management.

Notice Boozers contract ends in 3 more years about the time he will be getting a bit old?

Rip has only 1 more year that isn't optional and they can amnesty if he gets too hurt and they need the cap.

Brewer and Korver end in a year which means they have even more trade value next year because a team that is rebuilding actually can use expiring contracts like that to clear cap fast.

This is a young team that should be better the next 2 years even if they stand pat.

My guess is they push the Heat but lose in the ECF this year. They make some off-season moves that shortens thier bench but adds a more scoring capable 2 and then use Rip as a 6th man.
 
Old 03-09-2012, 12:49 PM
 
52,112 posts, read 41,953,123 times
Reputation: 32530
Quote:
Originally Posted by TVandSportsGuy View Post
That's surprising because Deng seems like the 2nd option for scoring based on what I saw in the last few games. I mean if I';m a Bulls fan and a bucket is needed to take the lead in the 4th qtr I would prefer Deng over Boozer any day of the week. And Noah seems more like a bench player not really a starter so maybe he is out there because of what he does on the defensive end of the floor.
Deng is more of a creator than Boozer who gets shots of opportunity.

Noah was 2nd team all-nba defense last season. His offense is improving.
After Dwight and Bynum I think he's as good as any center in the NBA.

Noah and many of the Bulls could have a lot gaudier stats but the Bulls have blown a number of teams out this season and also have a deep bench. Noah is averaging a double-double playing only 30mpg.
 
Old 03-09-2012, 02:27 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,218,416 times
Reputation: 1982
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
HoopsHype - NBA Salaries - Chicago Bulls

The Bulls have IMO an almost picture perfect salary situation, an example of excellent roster management.

Notice Boozers contract ends in 3 more years about the time he will be getting a bit old?

Rip has only 1 more year that isn't optional and they can amnesty if he gets too hurt and they need the cap.

Brewer and Korver end in a year which means they have even more trade value next year because a team that is rebuilding actually can use expiring contracts like that to clear cap fast.

This is a young team that should be better the next 2 years even if they stand pat.

My guess is they push the Heat but lose in the ECF this year. They make some off-season moves that shortens thier bench but adds a more scoring capable 2 and then use Rip as a 6th man.
the 2 things missing in this salary cap list, hoopshype doesnt show the MONSTER contract rose just signed. wasnt it like 18-20 mil a year? (via the "rose rule" in the new cba 94.8m over 5 years) and the other thing, rip will not be eligible to be amnestied because he was signed after the cba and teams can only amnesty players already signed. so no free agents, and no traded players. this is to limit teams from signing bad contracts then dumping them after the fact, and to eliminate teams from trading for bad contracts (walton?) and amnestying that player after the trade to clear more room.

all that said, tack on an additional 20mil to every year for the next 5 years to all of those numbers. that means the bulls are sitting on about 75-77 mil next year with 11 players under contract. then the next year after they are on 60-62m with 7 under contract if they pick up rip and buttlers options.

they are not looking as financially responsible as you might think.
 
Old 03-09-2012, 02:35 PM
 
52,112 posts, read 41,953,123 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rigas View Post
the 2 things missing in this salary cap list, hoopshype doesnt show the MONSTER contract rose just signed. wasnt it like 18-20 mil a year? (via the "rose rule" in the new cba 94.8m over 5 years) and the other thing, rip will not be eligible to be amnestied because he was signed after the cba and teams can only amnesty players already signed. so no free agents, and no traded players. this is to limit teams from signing bad contracts then dumping them after the fact, and to eliminate teams from trading for bad contracts (walton?) and amnestying that player after the trade to clear more room.

all that said, tack on an additional 20mil to every year for the next 5 years to all of those numbers. that means the bulls are sitting on about 75-77 mil next year with 11 players under contract. then the next year after they are on 60-62m with 7 under contract if they pick up rip and buttlers options.

they are not looking as financially responsible as you might think.
I knew about Rose, but he is worth the $$$.

I guess a cleaner way of me saying it is that:
1) they don't currently have much dead weight (ie. Walton)
2) They don't have any longterm contracts stretching into a guys much later age years. (ie. they didn't just sign boozer to a 7 year contract)
3) They still have their amnesty to use although you are correct that I had that wrong. (Thanks for the education!)

I'm curious that Orlando shows arenas listed as amnestied. Something I'm not understanding here.
 
Old 03-09-2012, 03:15 PM
 
Location: spring tx
7,912 posts, read 8,218,416 times
Reputation: 1982
what are you not understanding on gilbert?
he was part of a trade well before the lockout, then he was amnestied this season and is currently looking for a team. i expect he is signed by a contender by the end of the season. hoopshype shows him as amnestied because while it doesnt count toward the cap they still have to pay him and i believe the tax on him as well. in other words if amnesty gets the magic under the lux tax then they could have used a full midlevel exception.

the difference between this amnesty and the "finley rule" from the last CBA; that one the team paid your salary minus what ever another team paid you when you signed, this one that only works if you where signed in the 1st 5 days after amnesty. in other words finley was owed like 12 mil and the spurs paid him 3 so cuban paid finley 9 mil to eliminate the mavs and win a ring with the spurs. had he been amnestied this year the spurs would have to sign him in 5 days for the same thing, on day 6 finley would make his 12 from cuban AND 3 from the spurs.
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