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Nebraskans are the best football fans in the country. They don't hate anybody. After the UT screwed up the SWC, Osborn let them come into an expanded Big 8, where UT tried to run roughshod over everyone. It was like letting a struggling person into your home only to watch him take over. NU won out and ended up in the Big 10, a superior conference in every way. UT was left begging for someone to take them. No one wants to be in their conference. West Coasters would have been happy to take OU but OU is not up to PAC 10 academic standards. But bring UT in? No way in hell.
I agree with you that Nebraskans are great fans. I know that, in general, most Sooner fans have a lot of respect for the Big Red (and its fans) from up North. I actually hated to see them go as it really lowers the overall championships tradition/football pedigree of the Big 12.
Looked like the PAC 10 was ready to take the the entire Big 12 South (minus Baylor unfortunately for the Bears) last summer. So I'm gonna have to disagree with your academic standards argument. I wouldn't call the Arizona schools, Oregon schools, nor the Washington schools the pinnacle of education.
Nebraskans are the best football fans in the country. They don't hate anybody. After the UT screwed up the SWC, Osborn let them come into an expanded Big 8, where UT tried to run roughshod over everyone. It was like letting a struggling person into your home only to watch him take over. NU won out and ended up in the Big 10, a superior conference in every way. UT was left begging for someone to take them. No one wants to be in their conference. West Coasters would have been happy to take OU but OU is not up to PAC 10 academic standards. But bring UT in? No way in hell.
UT came to take over? Explain how. UT tried to run roughshod over the old big 8? Explain how. Contrary to popular belief, Larry Scott still covets Texas. And how the hell did UT ruin the SWC? The constant cheating in the conference plus terrible market is what killed the SWC and it would have hurt the big 8 if they never expanded. UT was begging nobody to enter its conference and West Coaster would bring in Texas. One only neesa to visit rivals to aee that.
I agree with you that Nebraskans are great fans. I know that, in general, most Sooner fans have a lot of respect for the Big Red (and its fans) from up North. I actually hated to see them go as it really lowers the overall championships tradition/football pedigree of the Big 12.
Looked like the PAC 10 was ready to take the the entire Big 12 South (minus Baylor unfortunately for the Bears) last summer. So I'm gonna have to disagree with your academic standards argument. I wouldn't call the Arizona schools, Oregon schools, nor the Washington schools the pinnacle of education.
Washington is actually a pretty highly rated schools. Your point still stands.
Nebraskans are the best football fans in the country. They don't hate anybody. After the UT screwed up the SWC, Osborn let them come into an expanded Big 8, where UT tried to run roughshod over everyone. It was like letting a struggling person into your home only to watch him take over. NU won out and ended up in the Big 10, a superior conference in every way. UT was left begging for someone to take them. No one wants to be in their conference. West Coasters would have been happy to take OU but OU is not up to PAC 10 academic standards. But bring UT in? No way in hell.
1. Nebraska has good fans, but so does UT. I disagree about them not "hating" anybody... a lot of the games I've been to between UT and Nebraska you will see quite a few drunk Nebraska fans screaming obscenities at UT fans (sometimes ones with families there). But you get people like this in every fan base. As a whole, Nebraska travels well-- but so does UT. I've never understood the whole "Nebraska fans are the best" attitude... what exactly makes them the best?
2. The Big 10 is definitely not superior in every way to the other conferences. It is at the same level as the Big 12 and Pac-10. I'd say as far as football goes, the SEC is superior.
3. UT would never "beg" for anyone to take them. It was more like conferences were "begging" to take UT. UT is a national brand-- similar to the Yankees, you will see UT gear in almost every sports store across the country. I was in Los Angeles recently and they had UT gear in their walmart for peaks sake-- right next to their UCLA and USC gear. Everyone wants UT in their conference because of the combination of excellent academics they bring, their massive fanbase of support (which literally towers above any other fanbase), and their excellent football team (10 win seasons in the last 10 years-- minus one year, but one year does not make a bad football team).
Now I'm sure some sooners will come on and try to discredit UT's "superiority," and yes-- the Sooners have won more Big 12 championships and NC games than UT. But who has their own TV network now? Which team pulls in more money? Do you see OU gear in Los Angeles at the local walmarts? Which team has more fans?
I agree with you that Nebraskans are great fans. I know that, in general, most Sooner fans have a lot of respect for the Big Red (and its fans) from up North. I actually hated to see them go as it really lowers the overall championships tradition/football pedigree of the Big 12.
Looked like the PAC 10 was ready to take the the entire Big 12 South (minus Baylor unfortunately for the Bears) last summer. So I'm gonna have to disagree with your academic standards argument. I wouldn't call the Arizona schools, Oregon schools, nor the Washington schools the pinnacle of education.
Larry Scott definitely has wonderful insight into the future. He realizes that superconferences are on the horizon and I agree academics took more of a backseat when expansion talks took place.
The Pac-10 will take OU, OSU, TT, and KU with glee. All 4 of those schools are good schools. I would bet they have some very solid programs. What people do not realize with the Pac-10 is that every university in the Pac-10 has nation leading programs that have produced massive amounts of educational research- massive amounts of leading edge research in specific programs. Of course Stanford, Cal, USC, UCLA, UW get most of the accolades, but the other universities often outrank them in other areas of research. Your assertion of the aforementioned schools not being the pinnacle of education is a little naive. UW, as much as I hate to say it, is a top 25 school and considered a public Ivy. Arizona has one of the best Astronomy, Pharmacy and Geosciences schools, ASU has an excellent Business school, Oregon State is huge into forestry, Wazzu is all over Plant Sciences and Animal Sciences, and Oregon- well, Architecture, Education, Journalism, and Sports Marketing are all top 5 programs.
However, from an outsider, I would agree they look like average schools and some programs certainly are. I know a lot of stoner kids go to Oregon. But, yes, the Pac-10 would take those schools in a heartbeat. I still think Scott goes after Tech if OU bolts to the SEC as it gets us into Texas.
Larry Scott definitely has wonderful insight into the future. He realizes that superconferences are on the horizon and I agree academics took more of a backseat when expansion talks took place.
The Pac-10 will take OU, OSU, TT, and KU with glee. All 4 of those schools are good schools. I would bet they have some very solid programs. What people do not realize with the Pac-10 is that every university in the Pac-10 has nation leading programs that have produced massive amounts of educational research- massive amounts of leading edge research in specific programs. Of course Stanford, Cal, USC, UCLA, UW get most of the accolades, but the other universities often outrank them in other areas of research. Your assertion of the aforementioned schools not being the pinnacle of education is a little naive. UW, as much as I hate to say it, is a top 25 school and considered a public Ivy. Arizona has one of the best Astronomy, Pharmacy and Geosciences schools, ASU has an excellent Business school, Oregon State is huge into forestry, Wazzu is all over Plant Sciences and Animal Sciences, and Oregon- well, Architecture, Education, Journalism, and Sports Marketing are all top 5 programs.
However, from an outsider, I would agree they look like average schools and some programs certainly are. I know a lot of stoner kids go to Oregon. But, yes, the Pac-10 would take those schools in a heartbeat. I still think Scott goes after Tech if OU bolts to the SEC as it gets us into Texas.
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However, from an outsider, I would agree they look like average schools and some programs certainly are.
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^^^
THIS was what I was hinting at. Stanford/USC/UCLA/Cal-Berkeley definitely carry more weight academically when it comes to national perception (right or wrong). The pinnacle comment centered more around what is perceived as an academic institution by non-regional folks outside of the PAC 10.
Many of the Big 12 South schools have their own programs of excellence. A&M = engineering. Oklahoma State = agriculture/animal sciences. OU/Tech = energy sector/business.
Unlike the Big 10, inclusion and invitation into the PAC 10 does not hinge on higher academic pedigree. At least that's the perception as proposed by the media. Not trying to start a pissing match between the Big 10/PAC 10 academics.....I could care less. I'm here to talk about some college football.
1. Nebraska has good fans, but so does UT. I disagree about them not "hating" anybody... a lot of the games I've been to between UT and Nebraska you will see quite a few drunk Nebraska fans screaming obscenities at UT fans (sometimes ones with families there). But you get people like this in every fan base. As a whole, Nebraska travels well-- but so does UT. I've never understood the whole "Nebraska fans are the best" attitude... what exactly makes them the best?
2. The Big 10 is definitely not superior in every way to the other conferences. It is at the same level as the Big 12 and Pac-10. I'd say as far as football goes, the SEC is superior.
3. UT would never "beg" for anyone to take them. It was more like conferences were "begging" to take UT. UT is a national brand-- similar to the Yankees, you will see UT gear in almost every sports store across the country. I was in Los Angeles recently and they had UT gear in their walmart for peaks sake-- right next to their UCLA and USC gear. Everyone wants UT in their conference because of the combination of excellent academics they bring, their massive fanbase of support (which literally towers above any other fanbase), and their excellent football team (10 win seasons in the last 10 years-- minus one year, but one year does not make a bad football team).
Now I'm sure some sooners will come on and try to discredit UT's "superiority," and yes-- the Sooners have won more Big 12 championships and NC games than UT. But who has their own TV network now? Which team pulls in more money? Do you see OU gear in Los Angeles at the local walmarts? Which team has more fans?
The Sooners are obviously superior when it comes to straight-up accolades/championships/winning tradition. 7 NC and 7 Big 12 Titles prove that beyond a shadow of a doubt.
However, the Horns are obviously the superior "media" and "marketing" giant. No arguing that one.
You keep the corner on marketing/media and we'll keep whooping that tail in the Red River Shootout! I like that arrangement.
Plus, a Yankee Californian wearing Horn Burnt Orange? = You've just met a bandwagon fan.
>>>>>
However, from an outsider, I would agree they look like average schools and some programs certainly are.
<<<<<
^^^
THIS was what I was hinting at. Stanford/USC/UCLA/Cal-Berkeley definitely carry more weight academically when it comes to national perception (right or wrong). The pinnacle comment centered more around what is perceived as an academic institution by non-regional folks outside of the PAC 10.
Many of the Big 12 South schools have their own programs of excellence. A&M = engineering. Oklahoma State = agriculture/animal sciences. OU/Tech = energy sector/business.
Unlike the Big 10, inclusion and invitation into the PAC 10 does not hinge on higher academic pedigree. At least that's the perception as proposed by the media. Not trying to start a pissing match between the Big 10/PAC 10 academics.....I could care less. I'm here to talk about some college football.
I hear you. However, I will just add that the Pac-10 has always resisted expansion due in a large part to academics. Only until the recent super-conference discussion did the Pac-10 even consider expanding to schools they felt are beneath them not only academically, but more importantly, in research productivity (what many Pac-10 schools beleive). I can tell you, other than UT and A&M, most of the other schools the Pac-10 presidents feel are beneath them- with Stanford and Cal leading the way of course. In the past, the conference looked into what added to the academics of the Pac. Other than UT and A&M, the other schools really do not add anything academically that another Pac-10 doesn't already have a leading research program.
Silly, in my opinion. Rather silly. It is better to add another great program IMO.
I still think ultimately the Pac-10 will take OU, OSU (both if they do not end up going to the SEC), TT, and KU. However, Scott has said he is not in a need to expand with the mega TV deal set to begin in 2012.
Pac-10 #5 - Stanford
#22 - Cal
#23 - USC
#25 - UCLA
#41 - Washington
#86 - Colorado (now Pac-10)
#111 - Oregon
#111 - Washington State
#120 - Arizona
#129 - Utah (now Pac-10)
#139 - Oregon State
#143 - Arizona State
Big-12 #45 - UT
#63 - Texas A&M
#79 - Baylor
#94 - Iowa State
#94 - Missouri
#104 - Kansas
#111 - OU
#132 - Kansas State
#132 - Oklahoma State
#159 - Texas Tech
From this it seems to me any of the Big 12 schools could fit nicely into the Pac-10 academically.
I mean obviously the Pac-10 looks better academically with Stanford, Cal, UCLA, and USC... but they also have schools that rank in the Big 12 range of academics. It is interesting that none of the schools in either conference is "unranked" academically.
The Sooners are obviously superior when it comes to straight-up accolades/championships/winning tradition. 7 NC and 7 Big 12 Titles prove that beyond a shadow of a doubt.
However, the Horns are obviously the superior "media" and "marketing" giant. No arguing that one.
You keep the corner on marketing/media and we'll keep whooping that tail in the Red River Shootout! I like that arrangement.
Plus, a Yankee Californian wearing Horn Burnt Orange? = You've just met a bandwagon fan.
Let's not act like you routinely beat Texas all the time. You're 8-7 against them since the big 12 started. That's pretty even. Texas problem is finishing. But yes, off the field, Texas easily tops OU due to a major advantage. Multiple major advantages.
What does the pac 10 get by adding only Texas Tech? You may get DFW and thats a huge maybe as they are behind Texas, A&M and OU. But with Texas, you get DFW, Houston, SA, and Austin. I still think Texas humbles itself and on the next line of realignment, they head west with OU, OSU, and Tech. Texas is finding it hard for anyone to carry the LHN. Larry Scott still covets Texas. KU brings you only KC and outside of basketball, they really don't give you much on athletics as well.
Last edited by Spade; 07-28-2011 at 09:21 PM..
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