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I don't know, when you consider the flood of immigrants coming from Mexico, Central and South America that land in California and few of them have been vaccinated against anything I think a parent would be foolish not to immunize their kid against a disease.
Of course making it law will upset people just like Obama care did. No one likes to be told what to do.
Does anyone take Jim Carrey seriously? He seems like he is "out there".
The ACA, which I don't really like, is only forced insurance. You are not being forced to USE medical care if you do not want it. That is the difference. Mandatory vaccinations are forced medical care.
Nobody is coercing anything into anybody.... If parents choose not to follow scientific evidence and vaccinate their children, they are free to homeschool.... they are NOT free to allow their special little snowflakes to run around spreading PREVENTABLE communicable diseases to the public at large.....
what CCT fails to realize is that vaccination rates in Latin American countries are higher than they are here in 'Murica....
Once again, you cannot see the forest for the trees. Unvaccinated homeschooled children will be banned from Disney around your little snowflakes?
Yes, that is my objection also. Not so much the science. Plus, if they can mandate vaccinations (medical treatment) on society for the greater good, it opens the door for other mandatory medical treatments for the greater good of society.
"If we can prevent ONE DEATH" mindset. Medical professionals think that is their duty, but if a adult's death can be prevented with chemo, should that be mandated too?
No choice.
Glad to see you accept immunization science.
Slippery Slope is a logical fallacy.
Mandatory immunizations for school entry does not mean the diet police are coming, or that anything else is going to happen. It has nothing to do with adults refusing chemo or any other treatment. Each issue should be taken on its own, not in the context of "if 'they' do this, then 'that' will happen next".
Yes, that is my objection also. Not so much the science. Plus, if they can mandate vaccinations (medical treatment) on society for the greater good, it opens the door for other mandatory medical treatments for the greater good of society.
"If we can prevent ONE DEATH" mindset. Medical professionals think that is their duty, but if a adult's death can be prevented with chemo, should that be mandated too?
No choice.
The difference is who "that one death" involves. In the case of chemo, "that one death" is the person who chose to forgo the treatment. In the case of vaccines, "that one death" might not be the person who chose to forgo the treatment because their body recovered, but it was a person who caught it from them who already had health problems enough that they couldn't choose to have the vaccine. It really is a matter of who is impacted. You want to roll the dice and risk your own health/life? Fine. But if your choice risks someone else's health/life that is a totally different story.
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The difference is who "that one death" involves. In the case of chemo, "that one death" is the person who chose to forgo the treatment. In the case of vaccines, "that one death" might not be the person who chose to forgo the treatment because their body recovered, but it was a person who caught it from them who already had health problems enough that they couldn't choose to have the vaccine. It really is a matter of who is impacted. You want to roll the dice and risk your own health/life? Fine. But if your choice risks someone else's health/life that is a totally different story.
Amen! The measles patient in Washington state who died was infected by a measles patient who lived! Ditto, the little boy in Germany this winter, and also the boy who died of diphtheria just a week or so ago in Spain.
I don't have a dog in the fight since I am an old guy with no kids. However I think childhood vaccinations should be left strictly to the parents. I think vaccinations are important and if schools want to provide low cost vaccination programs that is fine but these vaccinations should NOT be mandatory. Who will suffer if the schools back off? Not the kids that have been vaccinated (unless it really is a fascist conspiracy).
I am old also. When you were a child, were people terrified of MEASLES? Ok, maybe polio, but certainly not things like measles, mumps, or chicken pox.
I do not remember any signs on doors: Warning! Quarantine. MEASLES! CHICKEN POX! We had Pox Parties and Measles Parties so other kids could catch these disease while still young.
Today those parents would be arrested for doing that. Younger generation seems to think people thought of measles as the same way as SMALL POX. Geesch.
Mandatory immunizations for school entry does not mean the diet police are coming, or that anything else is going to happen. It has nothing to do with adults refusing chemo or any other treatment. Each issue should be taken on its own, not in the context of "if 'they' do this, then 'that' will happen next".
Not recognizing that events do not occur in a vacuum and failure to notice that one thing often leads to another is a logical fallacy.
Great points again. I'm of the same mind on the concept of individual free choice and that each person is responsible for their own outcomes based on those decisions. I think your 1st sentence can certainly apply to more than a few people I've met/known in this world, that's for sure. The other thing I was thinking that perhaps some who favor such laws do so because they don't want to take the responsibility of making their own decisions in life on certain topics as if the outcome is negative, they will be held responsible for their choice and that's a heavy thing for many to deal with if they make the "wrong" choice. Put it on gov to make the choice for them and hey, if things go wrong, "it ain't my fault/my decision!....I was just doing what I was told." And lets face it, I think some people are just out and out control freaks! And so it is. Given we live in a country where more and more laws don't seem to apply to some with loopholes galore or some just feel they are above the law(insert numerous excuses), well, perhaps this vaccine mandate CA law will just be like many others and end up being a paper tiger.
Thanks for all your comments and for your insight. People like yourself give me some hope that independent thought still exists, even misguided people like us on this whole vaccine thing who are "wrong".
I very much agree with your perspective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dizzybint
Its forced medication on the masses.
Exactly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48
Yes, that is my objection also. Not so much the science. Plus, if they can mandate vaccinations (medical treatment) on society for the greater good, it opens the door for other mandatory medical treatments for the greater good of society.
"If we can prevent ONE DEATH" mindset. Medical professionals think that is their duty, but if a adult's death can be prevented with chemo, should that be mandated too?
I am old also. When you were a child, were people terrified of MEASLES? Ok, maybe polio, but certainly not things like measles, mumps, or chicken pox.
I do not remember any signs on doors: Warning! Quarantine. MEASLES! CHICKEN POX! We had Pox Parties and Measles Parties so other kids could catch these disease while still young.
Today those parents would be arrested for doing that. Younger generation seems to think people thought of measles as the same way as SMALL POX. Geesch.
When words don't work... I like the graphic at the bottom, I wish "choice" worked, but in California it hasn't so they need mandates. Other jurisdictions are likely to follow and I certainly hope so.
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And lets face it, I think some people are just out and out control freaks!
And so it is. Given we live in a country where more and more laws don't seem to apply to some with loopholes galore or some just feel they are above the law(insert numerous excuses), well, perhaps this vaccine mandate CA law will just be like many others and end up being a paper tiger. 
Lets try pictures
