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When I was in high school, some kid sucker punched me. He mistook me for someone else he believed to be talking "smack" about him. I punched him back and whatnot, in self defense. Long story short, the entire event was recorded on camera and the school suspended both of us for 30 days. My parents actually did end up filing a civil suit in court against the school district and within a day of me being suspended, I was back in school as if nothing happened. The principal stated that since we were both involved, we both deserved equal punishment. My dad told the principal that his logic is flawed and that my kid didn't do anything but defend himself.
I think that's probably true. I wonder if the administrators are effectively being bullied by the bullies' parents, and so they take the path of least resistance and punish the person who is likely to just accept it and not fight back against it.
Essentially the school tells the parents that they need to "separate" the bullies from the victim, and that "separating" a group is a lot harder than "separating" one person.
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Originally Posted by dazzleman
That is something that never happened to me, but it would have made me very angry. I spent a very healthy number of hours serving detention after school in high school, but it was pretty much my own doing and I knew I deserved it, so it didn't really bother me. But to be punished for doing nothing wrong, while the perpetrator is not punished, is a whole different story.
The sense of injustice was quite real. The administrators jsut didn't care. If I were a gambling man I'd bet that despite anti-bullying rhetoric it's little or no better than in days gone by. I'm repping this post if I can.
When I was in high school, some kid sucker punched me. He mistook me for someone else he believed to be talking "smack" about him. I punched him back and whatnot, in self defense. Long story short, the entire event was recorded on camera and the school suspended both of us for 30 days. My parents actually did end up filing a civil suit in court against the school district and within a day of me being suspended, I was back in school as if nothing happened. The principal stated that since we were both involved, we both deserved equal punishment. My dad told the principal that his logic is flawed and that my kid didn't do anything but defend himself.
I had a somewhat similar incident. A kid named Charlie told me, "if I touch him he'll puke all over me." Intrigued by this novel threat I reached to shake his hand. Instead of vomiting, he chased me down two flights of stairs and through much of the school, whirling a bicycle chain. I wound up being able to hold a set of doors against him. When authorities arrived, Charlie told them that I had just bitten a dog outside the school's front door. My parents were "recommended" to find a private school for me. My mother favored this approach, my father not as much.
During the summer I indicated that I would not cooperate in the process given the obvious injustice. Literally during the first week of school, Charlie yanked a high stool out from under me in the school's weather center. It was lucky I wasn't badly hurt. Given my near-expulsion from school the previous June, I wasn't about to take this one up with the school.
My father came home early from work that day, feeling the early stages of the cancer remission that would kill him almost four months later to the day. My father got on the phone with Charlie's father. I didn't get to hear the conversation but I heard not a word from Charlie from that September day in 1972 until his unlamented (by me) death 40 years later. Parental involvement has a part if the school won't help.
I think in these situations unfortunately the parent has to advocate for the kid or noone will.
School yard bully was considered a difficult personality that needed understanding. I understood that he needed to be hurt or he would not stop. I hurt him. I got detention, he got broken ribs.
I think the entire idea of not fighting back is wrong. It part of the entire let the authorities protect you but of course they never will.
In my experience, a bully who gets his comeuppance usually never goes back for more, i had at least 3 situations growing up where i stood up to the bully and the bully left me alone, in one instance, i stood up to a bully and we actually became friends, i think the bully was bullying because he had no friends and wanted to make life miserable for those who were more popular, but this one bully was probably in that boat, he was crying out for help.
I think in these situations unfortunately the parent has to advocate for the kid or noone will.
Unfortunately, as I keep saying, that is true. Again, I appreciate the fact that my parents wanted to teach me a life lesson that life isn't fair, and that in the real world, they won't be able to fight my battles. But, unfortunately, that attitude is exactly what allowed the bullying to occur. They needed to find some balance between advocating for me vs. teaching me a life lesson.
I still ask: what advice do you have for kids whose parents won't stand up to the school when they are bullied?
Unfortunately, as I keep saying, that is true. Again, I appreciate the fact that my parents wanted to teach me a life lesson that life isn't fair, and that in the real world, they won't be able to fight my battles. But, unfortunately, that attitude is exactly what allowed the bullying to occur. They needed to find some balance between advocating for me vs. teaching me a life lesson.
The response that I would give to parents is that when children become adults, they use lawyers to fight their battles when they themselves cannot. That is what lawyers are for; the civilized resolution of disputes.I cannot tell you how many times I run into clients where the other side is simply a bully.
Early in my law practice career, I represented two clients who were sales people for textile house. They got behind on their commissions versus their draw. Obviously they were in a bad way economically. Their boss, the textile house, sued both of them, assuming that they could not afford counsel. My office took the matter on for little or no money. On the first trial, the judge went along with the bullying. In other words my client lost. The next trial was scheduled for the second salesman in late January 1987. Both the boss and the salesman lived in Somerset County, New Jersey. That area got 20 inches of snow in a storm where New York City only got about 10 inches. My client called me at 5:30 in the morning asking whether or not the trial was going to go ahead. Acting on pure instinct, I instructed the client to get himself to New York City. The other side did not show up. The lawyer for the other side told the court official that the company president was snowed in. Ip pointed out that my client lived right next-door to the company president, and presumably had roughly the same amount of snow in his driveway. The lawsuit against my client was dismissed. Shortly there after, the textile company that was suing them itself went bankrupt and the trustee ultimately settled the first matter for a minuscule amount. The second action of course was dismissed. Such is comeuppance.
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Originally Posted by mitsguy2001
I still ask: what advice do you have for kids whose parents won't stand up to the school when they are bullied?
This advice would work only for children say age 12 and up. My advice would be to put the bullying complaint in writing and email the complaint to the school. If that is not possible, handing it in on a piece of paper in wordprocessed paper would work just fine. Schools tend to respond when things are in writing because they realize that the issue could be a monumental headache later.
In other words, the schools would understand that the "go along to get along" posture will blow up in their face. I strongly suggest that any child planning on doing this should advise their parents that they are about to complain in writing and this may change the parents'attitude on not advocating for their children. The blowback will come to the parents.
Unfortunately, as I keep saying, that is true. Again, I appreciate the fact that my parents wanted to teach me a life lesson that life isn't fair, and that in the real world, they won't be able to fight my battles. But, unfortunately, that attitude is exactly what allowed the bullying to occur. They needed to find some balance between advocating for me vs. teaching me a life lesson.
I still ask: what advice do you have for kids whose parents won't stand up to the school when they are bullied?
Nowadays, most schools have a bullying policy. Often kids can report bullying online. The policy should also be in the student handbook. Now, if a student is too young, they may have problems reporting, but even at 8 or 9, they should be able to find out what to do - a councilor at their school can help if their teacher can't.
Nowadays, most schools have a bullying policy. Often kids can report bullying online. The policy should also be in the student handbook. Now, if a student is too young, they may have problems reporting, but even at 8 or 9, they should be able to find out what to do - a councilor at their school can help if their teacher can't.
Bullying policies mean nothing. They are just there to give the appearance of fighting back against bullying, but without actually doing anything. If I would tell my guidance counselor about bullying, he/she would just say that there is nothing that he/she can do about it.
The response that I would give to parents is that when children become adults, they use lawyers to fight their battles when they themselves cannot. That is what lawyers are for; the civilized resolution of disputes.I cannot tell you how many times I run into clients where the other side is simply a bully.
That is very true. But unfortunately, the cost of hiring a lawyer seriously limits the situations where you can realistically a hire a lawyer to fight your battles.
Quote:
This advice would work only for children say age 12 and up. My advice would be to put the bullying complaint in writing and email the complaint to the school. If that is not possible, handing it in on a piece of paper in wordprocessed paper would work just fine. Schools tend to respond when things are in writing because they realize that the issue could be a monumental headache later.
In other words, the schools would understand that the "go along to get along" posture will blow up in their face. I strongly suggest that any child planning on doing this should advise their parents that they are about to complain in writing and this may change the parents'attitude on not advocating for their children. The blowback will come to the parents.
Unfortunately, a school can just avoid the monumental headache by destroying the letter and/or deleting the e-mail. I also wouldn't be surprised if my school would have considered that to be insubordination.
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