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Old 07-13-2016, 12:17 PM
 
4,231 posts, read 3,558,959 times
Reputation: 2207

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
How can you say that the US pays the bill when France, Britain and Germany are in the top 10 military speders globally?

Your figures are wrong BTW too.
Compared to their GDP they're spending way less and we're spending way more.

And i'm sure whoever wins the election the outcome is the same.

We're not gonna spend more

So you guys better start spending some real money.
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Old 07-13-2016, 12:21 PM
 
Location: Finland
24,128 posts, read 24,813,132 times
Reputation: 11103
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Thomas View Post
Compared to their GDP they're spending way less and we're spending way more.

And i'm sure whoever wins the election the outcome is the same.

We're not gonna spend more

So you guys better start spending some real money.
Against whom? Russia? Those countries put more money and will spend combined more than 4 times Russia will. If you want to spend 280 times more as Russia, it's your choice, but I'll rather use it on healthcare and education.
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Old 07-13-2016, 12:27 PM
 
4,231 posts, read 3,558,959 times
Reputation: 2207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
Against whom? Russia? Those countries put more money and will spend combined more than 4 times Russia will. If you want to spend 280 times more as Russia, it's your choice, but I'll rather use it on healthcare and education.
Hey btw healthcare in Sweden was horrible

I heard from friends hospitals are not able to cope with patients!!

How is it in Finland?
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Old 07-13-2016, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Finland
24,128 posts, read 24,813,132 times
Reputation: 11103
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Thomas View Post
How is it in Finland?
Largest field artillery in Western Europe.

Victory trough superiour firepower.
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Old 07-13-2016, 12:46 PM
 
10,275 posts, read 10,343,474 times
Reputation: 10644
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
If NATO wouldn't serve US interests, it would've been dissolved in 1990. But it didn't, and all member states are happy to be there. Including the US.
I never claimed that NATO wasn't in the U.S.' interests. Obviously the U.S. benefits from a stable, safe and vibrant Europe.
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Old 07-13-2016, 12:56 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,320 posts, read 4,207,988 times
Reputation: 2822
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
...European countries are eager to be part of NATO, and in fact NATO is far more important for Europe's strategic defense than that of the U.S.
That's very true. As Rob702 mentioned Article 5, which says "any attack on one member state, is an attack on entire block, and entire block will fight back" -- this is because European countries pushed hard for during the meetings, while America was disagreeing. America just wasn't sure to commit like that. In the end, America agreed to it, but it does not change the historical fact that the European countries begged, pleaded, cried until they got Article 5.
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Old 07-13-2016, 12:59 PM
 
10,275 posts, read 10,343,474 times
Reputation: 10644
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
That's very true. As Rob702 mentioned Article 5, which says "any attack on one member state, is an attack on entire block, and entire block will fight back" -- this is because European countries pushed hard for during the meetings, while America was disagreeing. America just wasn't sure to commit like that. In the end, America agreed to it, but it does not change the historical fact that the European countries begged, pleaded, cried until they got Article 5.
Definitely. Article 5 makes NATO far more important to Europe than to the U.S.

Does the U.S. need Albania and Latvia to ensure its domestic security? Obviously no. Do Albania and Latvia need the U.S. to ensure their domestic security? Obviously yes.
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Old 07-13-2016, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,320 posts, read 4,207,988 times
Reputation: 2822
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
Definitely. Article 5 makes NATO far more important to Europe than to the U.S.

Does the U.S. need Albania and Latvia to ensure its domestic security? Obviously no. Do Albania and Latvia need the U.S. to ensure their domestic security? Obviously yes.

IIRC when NATO invoked Article 5 in 2001, Latvia sent 55 soldiers to Iraq, and Albania 80 poor souls on AK47 borrowed from the National Museum. Of course, they turned the course of the war...

(Sorry, this is the banter we play with our Albanian friends in NYC).
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Old 07-20-2016, 02:25 PM
 
4,031 posts, read 4,466,933 times
Reputation: 1886
What next? Could France be facing a civil war?
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Old 07-20-2016, 02:48 PM
 
5,214 posts, read 4,022,912 times
Reputation: 3468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Coe View Post
Well it can't and it shouldn't/wouldn't.

Because everyone knows, even in France, that the terrorists are 100% French and/or already integrated heavily in the culture. Starting a war against them is basically admitting your own culture s*cks.

If the terrorists were really outsiders and unrelated to the culture of France it would've been easier.
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