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Old 06-26-2014, 12:51 AM
 
2,540 posts, read 3,300,645 times
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Actually the worst dressed women I was talking about have all been white, so they don't have that excuse
And in fact the black, Latina, and Asian girls I see all generally tend to dress up a lot more than white north american women.
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Old 06-26-2014, 06:43 AM
 
1,167 posts, read 1,039,011 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jade408 View Post
These weren't in dangerous areas! I am talking most recently in the financial district of San Francisco. I have also had bad experiences in white middle class suburbia. I grew up in middle class suburbia and live in a middle/upper middle class area of Oakland and spend most of my time in similar areas. I probably spend 30% of my time in "ok" areas where you run into harmless characters. I might go to a "dangerous" place 2 times a year. Maybe, that is likely an exaggeration. I don't go to the hood. I didn't grow up in the hood. I don't live in the hood now. And I don't have many relatives in the hood. Maybe a couple of distant cousins I have never visited. I have probably been to the hood and actually stopped and got out of the car 2-5 times ever.

It is very off topic for this thread but there big differences in the ways "white" women are street harassed vs "black" women are harassed. We get it much much worse, no matter what sort of neighborhood it is. The odds are you will never experience the extreme forms of street harassment that black women are (and darker latinas) because you are white. Meanwhile black girls who develop early are trained/taught that they are responsible for the attention and should dress accordingly.
I was wondering where the assumption that you were loitering in bad neighborhoods came from, as if that kind of BS never happens in the"good parts of town."
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Old 06-26-2014, 07:53 AM
 
14,648 posts, read 29,685,966 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jade408 View Post
These weren't in dangerous areas! I am talking most recently in the financial district of San Francisco. I have also had bad experiences in white middle class suburbia. I grew up in middle class suburbia and live in a middle/upper middle class area of Oakland and spend most of my time in similar areas. I probably spend 30% of my time in "ok" areas where you run into harmless characters. I might go to a "dangerous" place 2 times a year. Maybe, that is likely an exaggeration. I don't go to the hood. I didn't grow up in the hood. I don't live in the hood now. And I don't have many relatives in the hood. Maybe a couple of distant cousins I have never visited. I have probably been to the hood and actually stopped and got out of the car 2-5 times ever.

It is very off topic for this thread but there big differences in the ways "white" women are street harassed vs "black" women are harassed. We get it much much worse, no matter what sort of neighborhood it is. The odds are you will never experience the extreme forms of street harassment that black women are (and darker latinas) because you are white. Meanwhile black girls who develop early are trained/taught that they are responsible for the attention and should dress accordingly.
Jade, I do get what you are saying. I am Latina (although not a "darker" one) and I grew up in one of Florida's larger cities. I too, developed early, and tended to attract a LOT of unwelcome and vulgar attention. For a long time, I dressed to make sure I revealed NOTHING, not even a teeny bit of cleavage. It took me a long time to stop dressing that way. These days I am much older and feel freer and dress how I want, and fortunately live in a place where the men seem to behave. I am surprised to hear that you still get those kind of comments living in such a liberal area as San Francisco. That is a shame.
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Old 06-26-2014, 09:20 AM
 
4,279 posts, read 3,288,620 times
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Agreed. A woman's ability to dress well is really psychological. I became really interested in dressing up after watching and becoming, literally, addicted to a certain makeover show and after I tried to get a teaching job and realized no one was taking me seriously. I used to hate the idea of "dressing up," though, because I felt like it sent the wrong messages and put women into the category of "object." When I was a teen, I really had an issue with this, as my parents pushed modesty, and I tended to lump pretty things into the category of "inappropriate" or "inaccessible."

As an adult, though, I can't get enough of dressing well and want to learn everything I can about "dressing to impress." I tend to second guess myself a lot and usually think the women at work are much better dressed than me. I finally got a consultation and was told that I actually dress too "old." In a bid to look more professional, I donned suits and skirts that totally drowned me out. By dressing in something a seasoned and much older professional might wear and ignoring my body type, I actually managed to make myself look young, inexperienced, and unprofessional...the exact opposite of what I was going for!So, this "dress to impress" thing is harder than it looks and really requires you to have an accurate perception of yourself to begin with.

The United States, unfortunately, is infamous for making women feel like they need to fit a certain "mold" in order to be accepted. The messages in the media actually encourage women to adopt a distorted perception of their own bodies and what is "normal." Women who don't fit the mold sometimes become discouraged, decide they can't be beautiful, and stop trying.I remember that when I was a young teen, I knew that I wasn't a model, so I thought there was no reason to dress up. It was just putting new paint on an old barn; what good would that do? It was only later that I started to realize that dressing up wasn't just for models and that clothes could actually help a person's perception of herself and create a more positive perception of her for others. I still second-guess myself, though, and really think a less image conscious society might be the only cure for us women.

Last edited by krmb; 06-26-2014 at 09:35 AM..
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:41 AM
 
4,877 posts, read 4,562,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmb501 View Post
The United States, unfortunately, is infamous for making women feel like they need to fit a certain "mold" in order to be accepted. The messages in the media actually encourage women to adopt a distorted perception of their own bodies and what is "normal." I still second-guess myself, though, and really think a less image conscious society might be the only cure for us women.
Good post. But there will never be a cure because there is the greed factor = too much money is
being made, making women feel insecure.
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Old 06-26-2014, 11:07 AM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
26,864 posts, read 28,137,614 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gypsychic View Post
Jade, I do get what you are saying. I am Latina (although not a "darker" one) and I grew up in one of Florida's larger cities. I too, developed early, and tended to attract a LOT of unwelcome and vulgar attention. For a long time, I dressed to make sure I revealed NOTHING, not even a teeny bit of cleavage. It took me a long time to stop dressing that way. These days I am much older and feel freer and dress how I want, and fortunately live in a place where the men seem to behave. I am surprised to hear that you still get those kind of comments living in such a liberal area as San Francisco. That is a shame.
It definitely is less frequent in the Bay Area, but still happens. Not in equal ratios. But it is more likely to happen in denser areas with lots of foot traffic, vs places where everyone is driving and not on the sidewalk.

The other day I was walking to lunch with a few female coworkers...and we got the sketchy old guy comments in an unexpected place....our upper middle class work city. It was likely really odd to see 3 "brown" women together! My coworkers are Indian and Hawaiian. We started commiserating about those obnoxious sketchy guys out there!
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Old 06-26-2014, 11:10 AM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
26,864 posts, read 28,137,614 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmb501 View Post
The United States, unfortunately, is infamous for making women feel like they need to fit a certain "mold" in order to be accepted. The messages in the media actually encourage women to adopt a distorted perception of their own bodies and what is "normal." Women who don't fit the mold sometimes become discouraged, decide they can't be beautiful, and stop trying.I remember that when I was a young teen, I knew that I wasn't a model, so I thought there was no reason to dress up. It was just putting new paint on an old barn; what good would that do? It was only later that I started to realize that dressing up wasn't just for models and that clothes could actually help a person's perception of herself and create a more positive perception of her for others. I still second-guess myself, though, and really think a less image conscious society might be the only cure for us women.
Very true! Many types of women are completely invisible in the mainstream media!

Quote:
Originally Posted by baileyvpotter View Post
Good post. But there will never be a cure because there is the greed factor = too much money is
being made, making women feel insecure.
I don't think it has much to do with money at all. We tend to value women based on their appearance, and not accomplishments.
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Old 06-26-2014, 01:59 PM
 
4,877 posts, read 4,562,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jade408 View Post
Very true! Many types of women are completely invisible in the mainstream media!
I don't think it has much to do with money at all. We tend to value women based on their appearance, and not accomplishments.
If you really think about it, of course it does. Businesses that benefit from female insecurities;
Plastic Surgery, Cosmetics, Fashion, Diet/Weigh Loss, Lotions (skin products too many to mention),
botox, Salons (and not just for hair cuts)...

The Bioethics Project 2012 - The Medically Modified Human
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Old 06-26-2014, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Washington DC
241 posts, read 265,892 times
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To jade408: I would recommend carrying some pepper spry in your purse to make yourself feel safer. Annoying drunkards who make inappropriate comments towards me I have learned to ignore, I only react if they try/attempt to put a hand on me.

One thing I have to say is, as a straight women when I went to Moscow/St. Petersburg for the first time I was struck at how sexy/stylish a lot of the women were, especially at night. I was surprised because Russian women were known doing the cold war times as being ugly/manly(mostly due to propaganda though). A lot of the women were naturally beautiful, but the only thing that made more beautiful/attractive then women of other countries is that they utilized their features to the best of their ability. It is really the moment when it came to me that how attractive you can be, is more in our control then we think.

Last edited by MissLadyLexi25; 06-26-2014 at 07:49 PM..
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Old 06-26-2014, 07:14 PM
 
Location: Washington DC
241 posts, read 265,892 times
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For people to understand my point about dressing/styling, I am going to use people shopping at the grocery store as an example:























With perhaps the exception of the vintage photos, no one in the pics above are dressing up all fancy nor is supermodel beautiful. They are all attractive in my book because of how nice and put together a lot of them look. I don't think a lot of people realize how much dressing nicely and carrying yourself with dignity can add so much to your attractiveness.
I realize a lot of these pictures are probably of models, and are not the best example of my point. If anyone has a better example of what I mean, please post pictures.

Last edited by MissLadyLexi25; 06-26-2014 at 07:50 PM..
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