Gubernatorial Race 2018 (African American, accept, free)

[JPD]

Originally Posted by ronricks

Pretty sure I am one of the few people on here that is willing to look at both candidates and post their faults and not live in an echo chamber for one or the other. It isn't me you need to be asking that question to. This isn't much different than the last Presidential election where we were stuck with two bad candidates. Do you want me to lie? Pretend that Kemp is going to be some great Governor? Pretend that Abrams won't wreck the state economy with horrible unicorn policies that can't be financed? I guess what I am asking is do you want an eco chamber? Because if you do then I will just bow out and let you guys fawn all over the candidates and pretend that neither has any corruption (they both do) or faults (they both do)

You've spent a couple dozen words saying Kemp sucks, with no detail offered as to why you think that. But you've spent thousands of words going into specifics (true or not) about why you think Abrams sucks.

A little lopsided, wouldn't you say? You have an agenda. What is it?

Or are you just in love the sight of your own posts?

[jsvh]

Ron, why do you think Abrams' finances are more of a concern than Kemp's larger unpaid debt?

If you want to talk about policies already happening look at the attacks Kemp and the GOP is already waging against the largest private employer in the state, Delta Air Lines. Thankfully Atlanta had signed them to a decades long HQ extension before GOP started these games but don't think they will not be able to find greener pastures if they keep up the attacks. The state taking over control of ATL and / or building a second airport are both things Delta is opposed to but the GOP / Kemp keep pushing. Those steps harm O/D volume at ATL and will make it a less attractive option as the busiest hub in the world.

Maybe you got some die-hard social conservative beliefs like hating homosexuals that push you towards the GOP, but the economy is not a valid reason to back the GOP. Their record shows they cannot handle it.

[JPD]

The only sane choice in this election is a vote for Abrams, and the reason is that her governorship will result in a competition of ideas, which will require compromise and cooperation from both parties, and will keep the worst ideas from each party from going anywhere. Conversely, a Kemp governorship will be one party rule and will elevate all the worst, most backwards ideas of the republican party into law, while keeping the democrats from having any voice at all.

[ronricks]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Ron, why do you think Abrams' finances are more of a concern than Kemp's larger unpaid debt?

If you want to talk about policies already happening look at the attacks Kemp and the GOP is already waging against the largest private employer in the state, Delta Air Lines. Thankfully Atlanta had signed them to a decades long HQ extension before GOP started these games but don't think they will not be able to find greener pastures if they keep up the attacks. The state taking over control of ATL and / or building a second airport are both things Delta is opposed to but the GOP / Kemp keep pushing. Those steps harm O/D volume at ATL and will make it a less attractive option as the busiest hub in the world.

Maybe you got some die-hard social conservative beliefs like hating homosexuals that push you towards the GOP, but the economy is not a valid reason to back the GOP. Their record shows they cannot handle it.

Abrams' massive debt is a proven fact. Kemp's lawsuit hasn't progressed, and nothing has been proven. So we don't know if he is actually liable. That is one concern.


So there are two major difference worth covering on Kemp’s debt vs. Abrams’ debt.

The first is that Abrams’ debt is realized. She personally owes $227,000 and has a negative personal net worth. Kemp’s is not realized, and he still has a $3m personal net worth.

The second is the nature of the debt. Abrams’ is her personal debt. She took out a line of credit for school, failed to pay taxes, and has 9 forms of revolving credit. Kemp’s may or may not be personal. That is up to the court to decide. Since his debt is through an LLC that he is not personally operating, he may be protected as he hasn’t been in direct management of the company. I don’t know the exact specifics of the contract, but if everything is adequately insured through the company then the company’s assets and insurance pays the debt. He still may wind up paying the debt in the long-term, but even paying this debt will keep him in a personal positive net worth. Very big difference than the scenario Abrams is in.


Then we have to look at Abrams and her multiple non profits that she is ironically profiting greatly from and funneling money to herself so she can avoid even more tax debt. Clearly, she has the money to pay off the measly 50k. Why not just set a good example as an elected official and do it? Do you know the clouds that would take off her if she were to simply do that one thing? But she isn't because becoming Governor would allow her to personally enrich herself even more with more money that she will funnel and hide. If she is doing it already she will continue to do it when elected just on a higher scale because she will have access to even more money and contacts.



Don’t forget the 70k in high interest revolving credit. Who on earth keeps 70k in revolving credit? That’s 5x the national average.

The 100k I can understand if you go to grad school these days... but she accrued this student loan debt 20 years ago! How do you still owe 100k 20 years later? She isn’t even in the millennial generation that is paying out the nose for school.

And she says she is on a payment plan with the IRS but she makes bank between her nonprofit work and her writing.

This person can’t be trusted to manage her own finances... she is a statistical outlier of high debt... but we are supposed to trust her managing the state’s complicated financial situation?

[jsvh]

I have family that are great at accounting & running a business but do not manage their personal finances as well. They can run a lean budget in their business but can't resist the urge to splurge when they go shopping for themselves.

The business debt is more closely related to how they would manage the state finances than ones' personal finances, thus that is a greater concern in my eyes.

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by JPD

The only sane choice in this election is a vote for Abrams, and the reason is that her governorship will result in a competition of ideas, which will require compromise and cooperation from both parties, and will keep the worst ideas from each party from going anywhere. Conversely, a Kemp governorship will be one party rule and will elevate all the worst, most backwards ideas of the republican party into law, while keeping the democrats from having any voice at all.

Perfectly stated, JPD.

[jsvh]

Yep. As someone that is mostly against the two-party system and identifies more a libertarian than either party, I much prefer split-party rule.

It is also very concerning that despite not even having a plurality (let alone a majority) of votes or voters in any recent national election, the GOP controls all three branches of the federal government, including both houses of congress, and most state governments as well.

The preservation of the democratic system should take priority over any other "issue" and the GOP efforts to put their "finger on the scale" / gerrymander / tamper with the census / and disenfranchise voters should be everyone's top concern.

If you at all consider yourself a moderate, you should be voting almost entirely third-party or Dem this election cycle.

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by ronricks

Abrams' massive debt is a proven fact. Kemp's lawsuit hasn't progressed, and nothing has been proven. So we don't know if he is actually liable. That is one concern.

Some other things we know:

We know the reasons for her debt, which were largely related to a situation beyond her control.
We know that she has been completely forthcoming about this situation.
We know that she is addressing the debt through the legal framework offered to her.

We know that he has been less than tranparent regarding his reneging to honor a legal commitment that he made to another party, and we also know that failure to do so has resulted in litigation. It's not surprising that the suit hasn't progressed, and it likely won't until after the election.

And I don't find the personal guaranty controversy nearly as disturbing as the fact we have a sitting Secretary of State with election and voter registration oversight also running for Governor. Thus he finds himself embroiled in a debacle that has captured the attention of the national media.

Report: Brian Kemp Is Blocking 53K Georgian Voter Registrations | Time

At least Karen Handel felt morally obliged to resign the office before running for another.

"As secretary of state, Handel is the state's chief elections officer. Whether she could make any decisions that would appreciably impact the gubernatorial race in her favor is debatable, given the fish bowl in which she would be functioning. But she correctly noted that her job of overseeing elections, handling campaign complaints and certifying elections results could lead to the perception that some issue was handled unfairly.

"This was an extraordinarily difficult decision professionally and personally. However, I know that it is the right one for the office of the secretary of state, the team there, and the citizens of Georgia who have entrusted me with this important position, as well as for my campaign for governor," Handel said in making the announcement."

https://www.mdjonline.com/opinion/md...37cb6bf7d.html

[KingKanye]

Georgia just stopped a bus filled with elderly Black voters from reaching the polls.

This is just wrong.

https://washingtonpress.com/2018/10/...fd_IuvqLlaPt6E

[ronricks]

Originally Posted by Iconographer

Some other things we know:

We know the reasons for her debt, which were largely related to a situation beyond her control.
We know that she has been completely forthcoming about this situation.
We know that she is addressing the debt through the legal framework offered to her.

We know that he has been less than tranparent regarding his reneging to honor a legal commitment that he made to another party, and we also know that failure to do so has resulted in litigation. It's not surprising that the suit hasn't progressed, and it likely won't until after the election.

And I don't find the personal guaranty controversy nearly as disturbing as the fact we have a sitting Secretary of State with election and voter registration oversight also running for Governor. Thus he finds himself embroiled in a debacle that has captured the attention of the national media.

Report: Brian Kemp Is Blocking 53K Georgian Voter Registrations | Time

At least Karen Handel felt morally obliged to resign the office before running for another.

"As secretary of state, Handel is the state's chief elections officer. Whether she could make any decisions that would appreciably impact the gubernatorial race in her favor is debatable, given the fish bowl in which she would be functioning. But she correctly noted that her job of overseeing elections, handling campaign complaints and certifying elections results could lead to the perception that some issue was handled unfairly.

"This was an extraordinarily difficult decision professionally and personally. However, I know that it is the right one for the office of the secretary of state, the team there, and the citizens of Georgia who have entrusted me with this important position, as well as for my campaign for governor," Handel said in making the announcement."

https://www.mdjonline.com/opinion/md...37cb6bf7d.html

If she has been so open then why not answer about the multiple non profits that she is getting hundreds of thousands of dollars from? That got a "no comment" from her team. Wonder why?