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So, is there such a thing as 'light' fraud?
What would that be?
Just taking ONE person's social security number and identity instead of taking TEN?
Do tell..
Exactly, this isn't Burger King. We either obey all of the laws or none of them. Illegals all have at least one crime on their list, most have more than one.
People who don't drive, let alone drive DUI.
People who don't get involved with the drug trade.
People who don't try to commit heavy fraud
From what I've read the U.S. Federal government focuses on deporting the "bad" illegals. Any other illegals caught in the attempt to get targeted illegals are "collaterals."
There is no such thing as a good illegal alien. Less bad perhaps but never good.
Why? Because good people do not knowingly break multiple laws.
Good people do not knowingly cheat as a way of life.
Good illegals might be the ones who self deport.
Exactly, this isn't Burger King. We either obey all of the laws or none of them. Illegals all have at least one crime on their list, most have more than one.
Rofl it kills me when the pro-illegals try to equate what illegals do to say accidentally going over the speed limit or rolling a stop sign.
The better analogy would be: People who enter anothers home without permission. Or maybe : People who take money from your wallet without permission. Or: People who lie about their identity to evade the law.
Oh wait these are all things that common criminals do. No wonder why the pro-illegals choose not to use those analogies.
So, is there such a thing as 'light' fraud?
What would that be?
Just taking ONE person's social security number and identity instead of taking TEN?
Do tell..
Or maybe only using the social security number to get a job while not using it in a manner that would actually affect the person holding the SSN (or preferably using the SSN of a dead person or a nonexistent SSN). But employers tend to pay illegals under the table, so they don't always need an SSN.
If an illegal knowingly uses an SSN in a manner that could jeopardize a living person's finances, health, or safety, then that is very bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01
There is no such thing as a good illegal alien. Less bad perhaps but never good.
Why? Because good people do not knowingly break multiple laws.
Good people do not knowingly cheat as a way of life.
Good illegals might be the ones who self deport.
Tinman, most illegals are desperate to make more money and make better lives for themselves. If one has to choose between making a better life for one's family (which would be moral to them) versus breaking some immigration laws (to them, has no morality judgment), they will take the family option every time. To help their family is moral.
Richard Geib, a former inner city school teacher, said here: Propositions 209 and 187 and a Public School Teacher " However, most immigrants I met came to the United States because they were poor, desperate, and wanted a better life for themselves and their children than what their own countries offered them. And who can blame them? "
As you can read from the essay, Geib treated this issue in a fair-minded manner, as he also criticizes Latino activists who are in favor of ignoring illegal immigration issues, because he feels that they overlook the negative effects of too many poor people coming into the United States.
But it is a disservice to label most illegal immigrants as being immoral people.
Or maybe only using the social security number to get a job while not using it in a manner that would actually affect the person holding the SSN (or preferably using the SSN of a dead person or a nonexistent SSN). But employers tend to pay illegals under the table, so they don't always need an SSN.
If an illegal knowingly uses an SSN in a manner that could jeopardize a living person's finances, health, or safety, then that is very bad.
Tinman, most illegals are desperate to make more money and make better lives for themselves. If one has to choose between making a better life for one's family (which would be moral to them) versus breaking some immigration laws (to them, has no morality judgment), they will take the family option every time. To help their family is moral.
Richard Geib, a former inner city school teacher, said here: Propositions 209 and 187 and a Public School Teacher " However, most immigrants I met came to the United States because they were poor, desperate, and wanted a better life for themselves and their children than what their own countries offered them. And who can blame them? "
As you can read from the essay, Geib treated this issue in a fair-minded manner, as he also criticizes Latino activists who are in favor of ignoring illegal immigration issues, because he feels that they overlook the negative effects of too many poor people coming into the United States.
But it is a disservice to label most illegal immigrants as being immoral people.
Vicman 100% of all illegals are criminals. It really is that simple.
They wanted a better life? Don't we all? Including the many thousands if not millions of US citizens and legal residents that have been harmed by illegals who just wanted a better life.
At what price? These moral people have no problem low balling wages and putting legals out of work. They have no problem evading taxes, committing fraud, defaulting on debts and abusing our medical system.
When you tie all of the crimes they commit on a daily basis it becomes hard to accurately describe them as moral.
I know the old excuse. If we would provide them an easy path to citizenship then they wouldn't have to commit all these crimes.
How about they go home, apply to enter legally and wait their turn?
Isn't that what a moral person would do?
My wife is a legal resident. She bent no rules, cheated no systems. We are no applying to bring her 22 yr old daughter over. No we won't cheat if we are told no. But if we are, a big part of the no is due to to many illegals.
They are a burden plain and simple nothing more nothing less.
Core values? One can argue that they have the core values shared by most criminals.
Why do people rob banks? They wanted a better life? Its easier than actually earning it?
Why do illegals cheat the system? They wanted a better life?Its easier than doing it the right way?
In the end it boild down to the same mentality.
Illegally being in the United States is a civil law, and penalty is deportation
Illegally crossing the border is a criminal violation, but it is difficult to prosecute such cases unless one is caught red handed crossing the border. About 40-50% of illegal immigrants legally came to the U.S. but are now illegal (i.e. overstayed visas).
But I was also talking about morality, which is distinct from the law. It is possible to be law abiding and immoral, and vice versa. Also morality depends on what one's intention is and what one knows about his or her actions.
Illegal immigrants tend to have a lack of education; they don't understand economic systems. Try to go to Oaxaca, Michoacan, and El Salvador and ask potential illegal immigrants what their role would be, in detail, in the U.S. economy. They don't understand how X people lose their jobs if they take work in the U.S. They want their families to prosper. The people who absolutely understand how this works would be the people who hire them.
"I know the old excuse. If we would provide them an easy path to citizenship then they wouldn't have to commit all these crimes." - Why would the people who hire them want that? The illegal status is what makes illegal immigrants attractive to employers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01
Vicman 100% of all illegals are criminals. It really is that simple.
They wanted a better life? Don't we all? Including the many thousands if not millions of US citizens and legal residents that have been harmed by illegals who just wanted a better life.
At what price? These moral people have no problem low balling wages and putting legals out of work. They have no problem evading taxes, committing fraud, defaulting on debts and abusing our medical system.
When you tie all of the crimes they commit on a daily basis it becomes hard to accurately describe them as moral.
I know the old excuse. If we would provide them an easy path to citizenship then they wouldn't have to commit all these crimes.
How about they go home, apply to enter legally and wait their turn?
Isn't that what a moral person would do?
My wife is a legal resident. She bent no rules, cheated no systems. We are no applying to bring her 22 yr old daughter over. No we won't cheat if we are told no. But if we are, a big part of the no is due to to many illegals.
They are a burden plain and simple nothing more nothing less.
Core values? One can argue that they have the core values shared by most criminals.
Why do people rob banks? They wanted a better life? Its easier than actually earning it?
Why do illegals cheat the system? They wanted a better life?Its easier than doing it the right way?
In the end it boild down to the same mentality.
Illegally being in the United States is a civil law, and penalty is deportation
Illegally crossing the border is a criminal violation, but it is difficult to prosecute such cases unless one is caught red handed crossing the border. About 40-50% of illegal immigrants legally came to the U.S. but are now illegal (i.e. overstayed visas).
Is anyone ok with civil laws being broken? I'm not. A law is a law. These people know they aren't supposed to be here. What's moral about breaking a law, any law?
I understand why they do it but to say they still have morals is wrong. They do not. Stealing from your neighbors if you are starving is still wrong even if it keeps you full. Let's just get that out of the way. They are taking care of their family but they know (as you and I do too) that it is a wrong.
Enough with the attempt to paint a picture it is not. If these people had "morals" they would not be on the public dole. Billions of dollars are wasted each year on these "moral" people.
1AngryTaxpayer: Geib explained in his essay that most illegal immigrants he encountered in LA wanted to work for more money to provide for their families, not to get freebies from the government. The attitude that one ought to get freebies might take hold later if one becomes Americanized, though.
But as long as that Americanization doesn't take place, I don't see how the illegal would understand how and why he/she would be "stealing."
Whether immigrants, legal and illegal, receive more funds than they generate is disputed; economist Donald Huddle argued that immigrants receive more than they generate, while the Urban Institute and a UC Davis article say the opposite: snopes.com: Just One State - Cost of Illegals in Los Angeles
1AngryTaxpayer: Geib explained in his essay that most illegal immigrants he encountered in LA wanted to work for more money to provide for their families, not to get freebies from the government. The attitude that one ought to get freebies might take hold later if one becomes Americanized, though.
But as long as that Americanization doesn't take place, I don't see how the illegal would understand how and why he/she would be "stealing."
Whether immigrants, legal and illegal, receive more funds than they generate is disputed; economist Donald Huddle argued that immigrants receive more than they generate, while the Urban Institute and a UC Davis article say the opposite: snopes.com: Just One State - Cost of Illegals in Los Angeles
Irrelevant: ignorance of the law is no excuse.
Let an American try that crap in Mexico.................
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