U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > New York > New York City
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-04-2019, 06:51 PM
 
3,321 posts, read 1,598,691 times
Reputation: 3629

Advertisements

All this over a misdomenor petty crime. He was no tabacco smuggler, big time tax Dodger, threat to society.

All about a few cents in taxes.lets do some math... a 65 cent loose cigarette?

Respect my authority is what this was all about. Self proclaimed heroes see no hatlrm in the dump they take.
Freaking tax collectors with guns.

Reap what you so does not pertain to this... he was not peddling baggies of heroin,coke,crack.

Or,the business owners were complaining.... how many businesses sell smokes ,1?

In the borough of staten island,where civil servants family get strung out on heroin, go figure?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-04-2019, 07:38 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,373 posts, read 23,847,742 times
Reputation: 11778
Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
You know, I see and respect your opinion. And its one that I have in general, both for private and public sector employment. Indeed, a cop who engages in on the job sex in the back of his police car or who is unnecessarily rude to a citizen hasn't committed any crimes, per se. But they behaved in a manner that is inconsistent with the trust given to police officers.

In this case, however, the officer was dealing with a lawful arrest of a large man who refused to comply. The take down move and subsequent lawful efforts to control the suspect, which is done countless times by law enforcement officers, sadly led to the suspect's death. But I don't see how the officer did anything wrong that would rationally violate the trust given to police officers and public sector employees in general.
This isn’t just inconsistency or rudeness—his training was to not use chokeholds. That was not supposed to be on the table anyhow especially against an unarmed suspect who was resisting arrest, but wasn’t posing a clear danger to anyone. I’m not sure what else there is to say about this—the guy had restrictions on what he can do in his job and he did them anyways and that resulted in someone’s death. That death was extremely disproportionate to the crime, but regardless, the chokehold was in violation of what he was trained to do.

If you have a job that tells you not to do something and training on not to do something, but you do it anyways and then someone’s dead because you lapsed in doing your job properly, then there should be some pretty out there extenuating and abnormal circumstances outside of the job you’ve been assigned to do. Otherwise, you messed up and should probably be fired. This isn’t some holistic, all-in Brothers Karamazov argument for termination—it is a straightforwardly something you are told not to do during your employment and you did it anyways.

Last edited by OyCrumbler; 08-04-2019 at 07:55 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2019, 07:51 PM
 
21,096 posts, read 13,965,529 times
Reputation: 14696
*Show of Support*!


https://www.silive.com/news/2019/08/...on-sunday.html
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2019, 08:17 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
8,837 posts, read 7,179,356 times
Reputation: 8370
Except it wasn’t a chokehold. Not even close. A simple google search will confirm that.
__________________
"No Copyrighted Material"

Need help? Click on this: >>> ToS, Mod List, Rules & FAQ's, Guide, CD Home page, How to Search
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2019, 08:28 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,373 posts, read 23,847,742 times
Reputation: 11778
Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
Except it wasn’t a chokehold. Not even close. A simple google search will confirm that.
Well, that’s weird because a simple google search was what confirmed it as a chokehold for me and the judge apparently agreed it was one as well.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2019, 08:36 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
8,837 posts, read 7,179,356 times
Reputation: 8370
The judge is biased.

Brazilian jujitsu experts. End of story. Prediction: you won’t watch it because it’s 40 min long.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Nql1xRtWKOU
__________________
"No Copyrighted Material"

Need help? Click on this: >>> ToS, Mod List, Rules & FAQ's, Guide, CD Home page, How to Search
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-04-2019, 09:36 PM
Status: "Proud American, Always and Forever" (set 2 days ago)
 
Location: DMV Area
11,967 posts, read 6,397,230 times
Reputation: 11751
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
This isn’t just inconsistency or rudeness—his training was to not use chokeholds. That was not supposed to be on the table anyhow especially against an unarmed suspect who was resisting arrest, but wasn’t posing a clear danger to anyone. I’m not sure what else there is to say about this—the guy had restrictions on what he can do in his job and he did them anyways and that resulted in someone’s death. That death was extremely disproportionate to the crime, but regardless, the chokehold was in violation of what he was trained to do.

If you have a job that tells you not to do something and training on not to do something, but you do it anyways and then someone’s dead because you lapsed in doing your job properly, then there should be some pretty out there extenuating and abnormal circumstances outside of the job you’ve been assigned to do. Otherwise, you messed up and should probably be fired. This isn’t some holistic, all-in Brothers Karamazov argument for termination—it is a straightforwardly something you are told not to do during your employment and you did it anyways.
It wasn't a choke hold. It was a standard take down move used by cops the world over.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 08:27 AM
 
Location: In the heights
22,373 posts, read 23,847,742 times
Reputation: 11778
Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
The judge is biased.

Brazilian jujitsu experts. End of story. Prediction: you won’t watch it because it’s 40 min long.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Nql1xRtWKOU
Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
It wasn't a choke hold. It was a standard take down move used by cops the world over.
Procedure 221-01 in the NYPD’s Patrol Guide states that a chokehold “shall include, but is not limited to, any pressure to the throat or windpipe, which may prevent or hinder breathing or reduce intake of air.” The medical examiner determined that neck compressions from the use of the maneuver lead to his death. The argument isn't about what a Brazilian jujitsu expert qualifies as a chokehold or what some other agency qualifies as a chokehold, but what his employer defines as a chokehold--i.e. it was a restriction placed on him by his job which is pretty much the argument for terminating his employment. You could have anyone call it any number of things, chokehold or not, but if it qualifies as a chokehold under the terms of his employment and he violated that term leading to someone's death, then it is grounds for termination.

Glad to know there are other Brazilian jujitsu fans on the board though! Community's really grown in the last several years!

Last edited by OyCrumbler; Yesterday at 08:41 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 09:16 AM
 
Location: Gods country
5,633 posts, read 4,389,875 times
Reputation: 7797
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post

I wish that were there! Thanks for posting this Bugsy!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 10:03 AM
 
1,264 posts, read 1,511,393 times
Reputation: 1998
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post



Like usual the Advance posts a story after the event happens with no promotion prior to it happening. Turn out would have been MUCH bigger if they did. Also amazing they didn't didn't block traffic or cause chaos. Hmmm I wonder why.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:




Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > New York > New York City
Similar Threads
View detailed profiles of:
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top