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View Poll Results: Who do you support?
Palestine 55 28.80%
Israel 136 71.20%
Voters: 191. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-18-2023, 10:18 PM
 
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It’s a very difficult subject, that doesn’t have an easy solution. I fully support the 2 state solution model, and would approach it as follows:

- A return to the 1967 borders, where Palestine gets the full West Bank and Gaza. No more Israeli settlements in the West Bank
- Palestine fully recognizes the existence of Israel
- Jerusalem becomes capital of both Israel and Palestine (West and East)
- The 4 quarters of the Old City of Jerusalem ( Jewish, Christian, Muslim and Armenian) are administered by an international peacekeeping force
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Old 06-18-2023, 10:47 PM
 
Location: Taipei
8,866 posts, read 8,327,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008 View Post
Too bad you cant read.
Pakistan isn't a democracy either. All Muslims democracies are in SE Asia (Indonesia and Malaysia) and they are all very weak democracies. Tunisia was a democracy for like a second, and now that's pretty much over.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Milky Way Resident View Post
It’s a very difficult subject, that doesn’t have an easy solution. I fully support the 2 state solution model, and would approach it as follows:
Palestine categorically rejects the 2 state solution. Israeli politics is horrible but they are the relatively reasonable party in this conflict.

And Israel would never accept further dividing Jerusalem. This isn't 1948. Jerusalem is today the capital of a developed country.
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Old 06-19-2023, 08:46 AM
 
15,790 posts, read 6,843,880 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Pakistan isn't a democracy either. All Muslims democracies are in SE Asia (Indonesia and Malaysia) and they are all very weak democracies. Tunisia was a democracy for like a second, and now that's pretty much over.
In spite of your false opinions it is very much a democracy, runs elections, has parliamentary government. Bangladesh is also a Democracy. Google is your friend.
Israel is a Jewish state, with Judaism privileged. Neither secular nor a Democracy.
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Old 06-19-2023, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Taipei
8,866 posts, read 8,327,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008 View Post
In spite of your false opinions it is very much a democracy, runs elections, has parliamentary government. Bangladesh is also a Democracy. Google is your friend.
Having elections does not equate a functioning democracy. Pakistan and Palestine are both ranked below 100th in the Democracy Index. Israel is ranked 29th, which is bad but is above the US, Belgium, and Italy. Pakistan and Palestine are also ranked incredibly low in the Freedom House Index. Israel's ranking is awful too (77/100) but it's not nearly as dire (Pakistan and Palestine are like 20/100 or even lower).

https://freedomhouse.org/countries/f...20and%20Status

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ec...emocracy_Index

Quote:
Israel is a Jewish state, with Judaism privileged. Neither secular nor a Democracy.
Christianity is privileged to a degree in almost all Western democracies too. Some even still have it as a state religion (England, Denmark etc.), and it has nothing to do with how democratic a country is. There are probably more religious nutjobs in Israel, but it is still a functioning democracy, which is far more than you can say about ANY Islamic states.
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Old 06-19-2023, 02:33 PM
 
15,790 posts, read 6,843,880 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Having elections does not equate a functioning democracy. Pakistan and Palestine are both ranked below 100th in the Democracy Index. Israel is ranked 29th, which is bad but is above the US, Belgium, and Italy. Pakistan and Palestine are also ranked incredibly low in the Freedom House Index. Israel's ranking is awful too (77/100) but it's not nearly as dire (Pakistan and Palestine are like 20/100 or even lower).

https://freedomhouse.org/countries/f...20and%20Status

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ec...emocracy_Index


Christianity is privileged to a degree in almost all Western democracies too. Some even still have it as a state religion (England, Denmark etc.), and it has nothing to do with how democratic a country is. There are probably more religious nutjobs in Israel, but it is still a functioning democracy, which is far more than you can say about ANY Islamic states.
Christian majority does not mean the country is not secular. Israel is not secular and is a Jewish state, a theocracy. Theocracy cannot be a Democracy.
All of them will function as well if they get the money and military support Israel gets from the US.
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Old 06-20-2023, 01:06 AM
 
Location: Taipei
8,866 posts, read 8,327,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008 View Post
Christian majority does not mean the country is not secular. Israel is not secular and is a Jewish state, a theocracy. Theocracy cannot be a Democracy.
All of them will function as well if they get the money and military support Israel gets from the US.
Iran is a theocracy. Israel isn't. Get over yourself.

And Israel receives only $3 billion aid from the US annually, which would be barely 0.5% of Israel's overall annual economic output. Please be more informed.
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Old 06-20-2023, 12:23 PM
 
43,287 posts, read 43,928,568 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post

And Israel receives only $3 billion aid from the US annually, which would be barely 0.5% of Israel's overall annual economic output. Please be more informed.
Both Egypt and Israel get financial aid from the USA as per the 1979 Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty.
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Old 06-20-2023, 06:21 PM
 
15,790 posts, read 6,843,880 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chava61 View Post
Both Egypt and Israel get financial aid from the USA as per the 1979 Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty.
Lots of countries get funds from US.

https://www.bbc.com/news/57170576
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Old 06-20-2023, 09:10 PM
 
Location: Taipei
8,866 posts, read 8,327,089 times
Reputation: 7375
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chava61 View Post
Both Egypt and Israel get financial aid from the USA as per the 1979 Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty.
Yeah, 3 billion/year. That’s nothing. With barely 10 million inhabitants Israel’s GDP is 500 billion+. Egypt though is not even 400 billion, and it’s got more than 100 million inhabitants. It’s pretty clear which side is a complete failure and which side is a success story.
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Old 06-21-2023, 03:47 AM
 
Location: Honolulu/DMV Area/NYC
30,438 posts, read 17,848,476 times
Reputation: 34132
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008 View Post
In spite of your false opinions it is very much a democracy, runs elections, has parliamentary government. Bangladesh is also a Democracy. Google is your friend.
Israel is a Jewish state, with Judaism privileged. Neither secular nor a Democracy.
Yes, Pakistan and Bangladesh are absolutely democracies. Some people conflate democracy with freedom, but the two concepts are not one in the same. In a democracy, the people have ultimately power, either directly or via their elected representatives. The people, either directly or through their representatives, can choose to limit everyday freedoms and that still be wholly in line with democracy. It's just not in line with what western democracies--which tend to value individual liberties and protection of minority rights--are all about.

On this note, the only reason why a country like Iran isn't a true democracy is that the people don't have ultimate control over the system. But, interestingly enough, the current Iranian regime post Islamic Revolution was instituted via democratic means through a universal vote. But since voters cannot dismantle the Iranian constitution even if they wanted to, the people cannot be said to rule.

Now, Israel is a democracy as well. Israel is a democracy as the people still rule via their elected representatives. That the majority chooses to privilege Judaism doesn't change that.

Democracy =/= freedom.
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