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Old 06-07-2016, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
23,726 posts, read 24,882,415 times
Reputation: 5703
Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldm View Post
People are happy for another Waffle House downtown but are against a casino.

Btw I dont even gamble or drink but a casino would help the city
How would a casino; that is built like a fortress, has no street level activity, and is a super block going to help the city?
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Old 06-07-2016, 09:12 AM
 
561 posts, read 781,723 times
Reputation: 686
Quote:
Originally Posted by cqholt View Post
How would a casino; that is built like a fortress, has no street level activity, and is a super block going to help the city?
Who says that the hypothetical Atlanta casino HAS to be built in this manner?

Why can't we demand different?

Why do failures in other places have to automatically mean failure for Atlanta? The same thing goes for success, BTW.

People have proven they are going to gamble whether it's legal or not. Hence why all of these corner store and gas station slot machines illegally pop up at various locations in the city.

People have proven they are going to gamble whether it's located in Atlanta or not. Hence why people drive to neighboring states to gamble. Why not keep that business in Atlanta?

I mean, they sure as hell didn't hurt Detroit's downtown. In fact, the 3 casinos are a part of Detroit's thriving entertainment scene. The Greektown Casino is not a fortress at all and is well integrated with the rest of Greektown, which has endless entertainment and food options. Many people walk directly from Comerica Park and Ford Field after baseball/football games and go to the casino.

I'm not really a gambler, but I go to the MGM Grand Detroit for the night clubs inside of it and the great buffet. All without dropping a dime on gaming. Not to mention, the hotel rooms are awesome by themselves.

Besides, casino's can also help attract more convention business just like our strip club and party scene did/does.

When Detroit was in bankruptcy, the casinos were the source of tax revenue that the creditors lusted over the most because of how steady it is. How does steady tax revenue hurt a city or a downtown?

If certain folks don't like casinos then fine, don't go. But don't they shouldn't be selfish and try to make that choice for others based on their own biases and misinformation. Give people the option to choose how to blow their money (or not blow it).

At the end of the day, it's all entertainment. Some people spend entertainment money on Hawks/Falcons games. Some go to the movies. Some go to concerts. Some like to bet at a crap table or pull the slot machine handle. That's what makes America great. The right to choose.

The Greektown "fortress"


It also has a transit stop.

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Old 06-07-2016, 09:30 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
23,726 posts, read 24,882,415 times
Reputation: 5703
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mossberg View Post
Who says that the hypothetical Atlanta casino HAS to be built in this manner?

Why can't we demand different?

Why do failures in other places have to automatically mean failure for Atlanta? The same thing goes for success, BTW.

People have proven they are going to gamble whether it's legal or not. Hence why all of these corner store and gas station slot machines illegally pop up at various locations in the city.

People have proven they are going to gamble whether it's located in Atlanta or not. Hence why people drive to neighboring states to gamble. Why not keep that business in Atlanta?

I mean, they sure as hell didn't hurt Detroit's downtown. In fact, the 3 casinos are a part of Detroit's thriving entertainment scene. The Greektown Casino is not a fortress at all and is well integrated with the rest of Greektown, which has endless entertainment and food options. Many people walk directly from Comerica Park and Ford Field after baseball/football games and go to the casino.

I'm not really a gambler, but I go to the MGM Grand Detroit for the night clubs inside of it and the great buffet. All without dropping a dime on gaming. Not to mention, the hotel rooms are awesome by themselves.

Besides, casino's can also help attract more convention business just like our strip club and party scene did/does.

When Detroit was in bankruptcy, the casinos were the source of tax revenue that the creditors lusted over the most because of how steady it is. How does steady tax revenue hurt a city or a downtown?

If certain folks don't like casinos then fine, don't go. But don't they shouldn't be selfish and try to make that choice for others based on their own biases and misinformation. Give people the option to choose how to blow their money (or not blow it).

At the end of the day, it's all entertainment. Some people spend entertainment money on Hawks/Falcons games. Some go to the movies. Some go to concerts. Some like to bet at a crap table or pull the slot machine handle. That's what makes America great. The right to choose.

The Greektown "fortress"


It also has a transit stop.
So now we are resorting to using Detroit as an example?
This is proposed by MGM Grand and touted as being a Vegas-level casino, but the casinos in Vegas are built to lure you in and then make it difficult to get out, like a jail or fortress. Casinos do not make money when people people visit a shop on the exterior, facing the sidewalk. Even the Greektown Casino has blank walls and adds nothing to the street-level activity.
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3352...2!8i6656?hl=en
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3347...2!8i6656?hl=en
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3343...2!8i6656?hl=en
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Old 06-07-2016, 09:32 AM
 
Location: Orange Blossom Trail
6,420 posts, read 6,530,835 times
Reputation: 2673
Quote:
Originally Posted by cqholt View Post
How would a casino; that is built like a fortress, has no street level activity, and is a super block going to help the city?
What sort of street level activity?
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Old 06-07-2016, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
23,726 posts, read 24,882,415 times
Reputation: 5703
Quote:
Originally Posted by 0nyxStation View Post
What sort of street level activity?
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Old 06-07-2016, 10:21 AM
 
Location: Prescott, AZ
5,559 posts, read 4,697,514 times
Reputation: 2284
Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldm View Post
Anyone against this casino is not Pro- Atlanta. This isn't going to be some section 8 casino. This would be a world class casino like in Vegas will several world class restaurants, shows, hotel, nightclubs plus $$$ for hope scholarships. If you are against that I cant really say anything else on this topic.

//www.city-data.com/forum/atlan...l-atlanta.html


This was said about the ferris wheel in 2010....
And, as I said, the Ferris wheel is on such a different level, that it is impossible to compare the two. I had no issue with the Ferris wheel, and have no issue with other attractions of its scale coming in.

I take great issue with your idea that 'Anyone against this casino is not Pro-Atlanta', seeing as now you're just drawing up battle lines that have not sense in existing. You've immediately jumped to the 'Us vs. Them' mentality and declared any who disagree with you, no matter the reason, to be your enemy.

As the article said, the study, of which there will be more of independent analysis, found that the casino would add little to nothing to the tourism industry here. In fact, it would likely take away from existing businesses by adding more rooms to the market than the market can grow.

As for HOPE. I take GREAT issue with the idea that we should fund our education off the back of gamblers. Even more so when you consider that the majority of those people gambling would be Georgians. Why don't we just set up a tax and be done with it? Why go through a casino at all?

If that's your justification, then it's a rather narrow-minded one.


Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldm View Post
So bad to have 1 square mile dedicated to tourist out of the 137 square miles in the city of Atlanta? Atlanta will never be a real city with that type of thinking
I have no issue with museums and such being downtown. We already HAVE that though. We already HAVE a full square mile, probably more, dedicated to hotels and museums and stadiums and attractions and parks.

You know what people also like, in addition to all the tourist stuff? They like places that seem like people live there. When there's vibrancy and a neighborhood feel to an area, it also creates a sense of safety, it gives a certain level of appeal to the shops and restaurants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fieldm View Post
People are happy for another Waffle House downtown but are against a casino.

Btw I dont even gamble or drink but a casino would help the city
Again, they are completely incomparable. A Waffle House interacts with the street, and adds another open late food place in a part of town that is rather lacking in restaurants open after standard business hours.
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Old 06-07-2016, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Prescott, AZ
5,559 posts, read 4,697,514 times
Reputation: 2284
Quote:
Originally Posted by cqholt View Post
So now we are resorting to using Detroit as an example?
This is proposed by MGM Grand and touted as being a Vegas-level casino, but the casinos in Vegas are built to lure you in and then make it difficult to get out, like a jail or fortress. Casinos do not make money when people people visit a shop on the exterior, facing the sidewalk. Even the Greektown Casino has blank walls and adds nothing to the street-level activity.
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3352...2!8i6656?hl=en
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3347...2!8i6656?hl=en
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3343...2!8i6656?hl=en
Exactly. Vegas casinos look great from the outside, when on the strip, but EVERYTHING is on the inside. The food, the bars, the gambling, the shops. They're all self-contained and held within the buildings. The stuff on the outside are just facades meant to draw the eye. Once you're inside, it's in the casinos' best interest to keep you there.

The moment you step off the strip - go one or two full blocks down - it all goes away. Parking lots, empty lots, boarded up buildings, decaying apartments that look like they aught to be abandoned. Massive boulevards with almost nothing on them.

The Casino walls do nothing for the street, and their parking lots do even less.

I would much rather see any area in downtown big enough for a casino (*cough* Gulch *cough*) used for grander plans than that.
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Old 06-07-2016, 10:37 AM
Status: "Pickleball-Free American" (set 7 days ago)
 
Location: St Simons Island, GA
23,467 posts, read 44,121,361 times
Reputation: 16866
I don't know where that picture above was taken or what it's meant to represent, but l can tell you that you won't see sketchy activity around Harrah's in New Orleans (the closest comparison l can think of to this proposal). It simply isn't tolerated. Crime in that area of the city dropped precipitously after the casino was built. It also sparked a flurry of upscale hotel development in the immediate area. So l can't buy into the argument that a downtown casino would necessarily draw a bad element to downtown.
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Old 06-07-2016, 10:49 AM
 
Location: Ono Island, Orange Beach, AL
10,743 posts, read 13,396,965 times
Reputation: 7183
Quote:
Originally Posted by 0nyxStation View Post
What sort of street level activity?
Hookers, drunks, criminals, vagrants...
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Old 06-07-2016, 11:47 AM
 
989 posts, read 1,743,491 times
Reputation: 690
Quote:
Originally Posted by LovinDecatur View Post
I don't know where that picture above was taken or what it's meant to represent, but l can tell you that you won't see sketchy activity around Harrah's in New Orleans (the closest comparison l can think of to this proposal). It simply isn't tolerated. Crime in that area of the city dropped precipitously after the casino was built. It also sparked a flurry of upscale hotel development in the immediate area. So l can't buy into the argument that a downtown casino would necessarily draw a bad element to downtown.
New Orleans is a unique destination for 24 hour partying, it's one of the few places in the world that can deliver that experience. The entire area is designed for debauchery and they excel it. We do not share the same culture as New Orleans. We had our version of bourbon street in Buckhead and we demolished it for a shopping mall. Our city is not set up for 24 hour entertainment, we rolled our bar hours back, we moved nightclubs to the suburbs, etc...


I'm not oppose to a casino downtown, I think it should be the very last piece. 10k more residents, shopping district, entertainment district, MMPT, renovate Philips arena, Underground redevelopment, GSU fully expanded, and then I'll entertain the place of a casino. Let's not put the cart before the horse here.
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