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When the Church was founded in 1830, there were just six members.
Did the church finally start getting it right 1830 years after Christ? I do not think so. God has a divine plan in place and have been continuously working independent of these man made institutions.
Did the church finally start getting it right 1830 years after Christ?
Actually, it was "right" for a time after Christ's death. But, as Paul predicted, a "falling away" (an "apostasia") took place in the years shortly following his (Paul's) death. If you believe the Church Christ established never ceased to exist, you would have to be either a Roman Catholic or Eastern Orthodox Christian (which I'm pretty sure you are not). I suspect you would agree that there was an apostasy somewhere along the way. You probably just think it happened a lot later than we Mormons do.
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I do not think so.
I know you don't. I do.
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God has a divine plan in place and have been continuously working independent of these man made institutions.
Why would Jesus Christ have bothered establishing His Church if He had intended to fulfill His plan independently of it?
I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions
I had some spare time and decided to review the many posts submitted here on this subject. It's a hot one and frankly not very productive in my opinion. I can just imagine standing in front of the Lord being questioned as to why we spent so much time opposing the Mormons, when he during his ministry was confronted by Greeks, Romans, Arabian, the many sects in Israel, barbarians and more, but did not exercise his total God-given authority and power in the Spirit over them.
As a reasonably submissive born again charismatic Christian, I am astonished by the fact that Christians are not speaking the same language as our Mormon friends, or really trying to understand where they are coming from. Albeit we do have some serious issues regarding the 13 Mormon articles and interpretation of the Holy Bible, but even Jesus allowed some leeway. Mark 9:40 - "For whoever is not against us is for us..." or in modern day speak: "Back off, and let me worry about the understanding of that person."
I suspect many of the Christians that have submitted posts and others who have viewed, whether as questions or to be more informed, would never consider by any stretch of the imagination crossing over to Mormonism or vice versa. And why would that be I wonder? Simple really, because the main angst is about Mormon and Christian differences of beliefs and not the correct interpretation of the Holy Scriptures and together seeking out the holy truth. The same problem that faced the Sadducees and Pharisees over 2000 years ago.
Both sides have a common understanding that we have one chance down here to get it right. So why don't we just work together and stop all this nonsense, and let God do the necessary sorting out on both sides.
Therefore I would admonish all of you with the following words from Isaiah, and can any one of you match up to him, even though you seem to speak as the oracles of God?
- You are my witnesses, says the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen: that you may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me, there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I am the Lord; beside me there is no saviour. I have declared, and have saved, and I have shown, when there was no strange god among you: therefore you are my witnesses, saith the Lord, that I am God. Yes, before the day was I am he; and there is none that can deliver out of my hand: I will work, and who shall let it? Isaiah 43 v 10-13
P.S. A note to all Christians wanting to convert or witness to the Mormon community. You had better know your Holy Bible and what you believe, because they do and in great detail. They will trash you! OK, now bring on the righteous anger...
Last edited by NickyQuen; 08-06-2012 at 07:22 AM..
Both sides have a common understanding that we have one chance down here to get it right. So why don't we just work together and stop all this nonsense, and let God do the necessary sorting out on both sides.
That sounds like an excellent idea, NickyQuen. I'm all for it!
I had some spare time and decided to review the many posts submitted here on this subject. It's a hot one and frankly not very productive in my opinion. I can just imagine standing in front of the Lord being questioned as to why we spent so much time opposing the Mormons, when he during his ministry was confronted by Greeks, Romans, Arabian, the many sects in Israel, barbarians and more, but did not exercise his total God-given authority and power in the Spirit over them.
As a reasonably submissive born again charismatic Christian, I am astonished by the fact that Christians are not speaking the same language as our Mormon friends, or really trying to understand where they are coming from. Albeit we do have some serious issues regarding the 13 Mormon articles and interpretation of the Holy Bible, but even Jesus allowed some leeway. Mark 9:40 - "For whoever is not against us is for us..." or in modern day speak: "Back off, and let me worry about the understanding of that person."
I suspect many of the Christians that have submitted posts and others who have viewed, whether as questions or to be more informed, would never consider by any stretch of the imagination crossing over to Mormonism or vice versa. And why would that be I wonder? Simple really, because the main angst is about Mormon and Christian differences of beliefs and not the correct interpretation of the Holy Scriptures and together seeking out the holy truth. The same problem that faced the Sadducees and Pharisees over 2000 years ago.
Both sides have a common understanding that we have one chance down here to get it right. So why don't we just work together and stop all this nonsense, and let God do the necessary sorting out on both sides.
Therefore I would admonish all of you with the following words from Isaiah, and can any one of you match up to him, even though you seem to speak as the oracles of God?
- You are my witnesses, says the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen: that you may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me, there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I am the Lord; beside me there is no saviour. I have declared, and have saved, and I have shown, when there was no strange god among you: therefore you are my witnesses, saith the Lord, that I am God. Yes, before the day was I am he; and there is none that can deliver out of my hand: I will work, and who shall let it? Isaiah 43 v 10-13
P.S. A note to all Christians wanting to convert or witness to the Mormon community. You had better know your Holy Bible and what you believe, because they do and in great detail. They will trash you! OK, now bring on the righteous anger...
No anger here. I like what you have written.
I would disagree with you about one thing. Mormons are Christians.
Just as I think you are a Christian although your denomination is Charismatic and speaks in tongues, which mine does not.
I believe Roman Catholics are Christians, although they worship Mary and use Rosary Beads to pray and my Church does not.
I believe that any denomination who worships Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior is Christian.
I do not care if they have any extra books or creeds are special equipment in their worship. Many religions have other books written by their founders.
That is not my business. Scripture tells us not to judge least we be Judged.
My business is my faith and living it as I understand it. Not in taking the inventory of others. denominations
No anger here. I like what you have written. I would disagree with you about one thing. Mormons are Christians.
Appreciate your candour....but
I quote from the Mormon organisation of beliefs:
- Jesus Christ is the literal Son of God. His birth, life, death, and resurrection fulfilled the many prophecies contained in the scriptures concerning the coming of a Savior. He was the Creator, He is our Savior, and He will be our Judge.
- Through His Resurrection, Jesus Christ saved us from death. Because He overcame death, we will all be given the gift of resurrection, that is to say our spirits will be eternally re-united with our bodies (Acts 24:15; 1 Corinthians 15:22). When life on this earth is over, Jesus Christ will be the final Judge.
Putting all other documents and ideology aside, how close to not being a Christian can you get if people sincerely believe the above?
---
Many, many years ago I was part of Opus Dei in London. It was one part of my continuous journey towards the Lord. They tried their best but I was too far working for the other side. When my demonic supernaturality met their religion it became a cauldron of deception and fanaticism of belief and behaviour. That ideology was as far away from the Christian faith as one could get, and it took a little group of believers working in an outreach centre on the outskirts of the red light district in Amsterdam to put me back on the right path.
After everything that has happened in my life, natural and supernatural, I would be more than happy to stand side-by-side with many Latter Day Saints and call them brothers and friends without violating the truths held in the Gospels and Christian Faith.
As I quoted before, Jesus's words "He who was not against us is for us" works for both sides, Nazarite and Mormon, and I view myself symbolically more a Nazarite than a Christian - Consecrated, Holy unto the Lord. The more I hear the word Christian nowadays, the more I hate its connotations and superiority that many Christian circles and churches have fallen into. And even within this Christian forum, I sense persecution, prejudice, bigotry and hypocrisy between the lines of many submitted texts. Albeit and thankfully not all, as there are some very committed and faithful believers here also.
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The bottom line is not what you or I believe, but what God knows. God is not stupid. He will separate both false Christians and Mormons alike in his time. We need to make sure that we are not on his list.
All who call on God in true faith, earnestly from the heart, will certainly be heard, and will receive what they have asked and desired. - Martin Luther King
P.S. As a Charismatic (so called), I just swapped my power-base from Satan to the Lord God. In terms of the early Christian Church I simple became part of the family of Believers or Saints. The former was by demonic power and the latter by the Holy Spirit of God. Nothing more and nothing less, and you are still searching...
Last edited by NickyQuen; 08-08-2012 at 07:03 AM..
Well as an X Mormon I can assure you they are not Christians. They try very hard to make the world think they are just another Christian denom but they believe (and this is a core belief) that faithful Mormon men can become gods just as the god they follow was once a man and became a god. They teach that there are millions of gods and they get to populate planets like their god did here on earth. They get to have sex with their many wives and create spirit babies that they send to their planet to get a body like their god did here on Earth. This is the reason the Temple is so important to Mormons. One must have been through the temple to receive there temple endowments in order to reach this highest level of heaven and become a god. One cannot be a good Mormon in good standing if they deny this basic teaching.
Keep that in mind when you talk to a Mormon. If they are Mormon they accept this.
Well as an X Mormon I can assure you they are not Christians. They try very hard to make the world think they are just another Christian denom but they believe (and this is a core belief) that faithful Mormon men can become gods just as the god they follow was once a man and became a god. They teach that there are millions of gods and they get to populate planets like their god did here on earth. They get to have sex with their many wives and create spirit babies that they send to their planet to get a body like their god did here on Earth. This is the reason the Temple is so important to Mormons. One must have been through the temple to receive there temple endowments in order to reach this highest level of heaven and become a god. One cannot be a good Mormon in good standing if they deny this basic teaching.
Keep that in mind when you talk to a Mormon. If they are Mormon they accept this.
Thanks, I was aware of this. But the Latter Day Saints around here are more Gospel tuned.
NQ
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I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions
