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Every person has a different temperature that they prefer.
Correct. I prefer a blowtorch flame temperature, which is 2372 ° Farenheit, and the runner up is −459.67° Fahrenheit, or absolute zero. But unfortunately I haven't been able to find any place on here earth that offers what I'm looking for. So I'm building a space ship.
yes...it is a lot worse. Of course, it took me to my breaking point and now I wouldn't even want winter in Chicago. Like I'm done with winter...forever.
i can imagine...how could you even bare to live there in january...like theres sun for what 3 hours? and the extreme cold....
I'll take an old rustbelt city like Milwaukee, Cleveland, or Buffalo over a sprawling desert sunbelt city any day. At least the old industrial cities of the north have character and amenities from their glory days. The new growth down south seems to mostly be subdivisions and strip malls.
Sadly, I've been to Cleveland several times, and I am completely in awe by how much infrastructure and "amenities" they have downtown that are just "sitting there" empty with so much potential. I've also taken the train several times from the airport to downtown, and I was not impressed by the "character" of parts of the city and its burbs, yet I like other parts of the city. In addition, for a city that has such close access to a waterfront, it's severely lacking in creativity; however; I'm still holding out hope. I did notice that there is a strong Indian presence downtown (probably due to the healthcare industry there).
In all fairness, many sunbelt cities are putting forth efforts to improve their downtowns and get people there. For other rustbelt cities, their building "stock" is there, but I am surprised that there aren't business and people filling all of these empty buildings.
Sadly, I've been to Cleveland several times, and I am completely in awe by how much infrastructure and "amenities" they have downtown that are just "sitting there" empty with so much potential. I've also taken the train several times from the airport to downtown, and I was not impressed by the "character" of parts of the city and its burbs. In addition, for a city that has such close access to a waterfront, it's severely lacking in creativity; however; I'm still holding out hope. I did notice that there is a strong Indian presence downtown (probably due to the healthcare industry there).
At least some of the sunbelt cities are putting forth some efforts to improve their downtowns and get people there. For other rustbelt cities, their building "stock" is there, but why aren't the businesses, people?
Hey never said Cleveland was the greatest place in the world, it certainly has its issues with run down areas and grit. To address some of your comments:
1. There are very few empty buildings left in Downtown Cleveland. Most have been rehabbed into residential units over the past decade or are in the process of being rehabbed. New construction of several new buildings was slated to start right before the economy tanked, so these have been put on hold. There are two nightlife districts downtown that are successful, the Warehouse District and Gateway. The Gateway District has really just popped up over the last 5 years and has totally transformed the area around the basketball and baseball arenas. Cleveland has the 13th largest downtown workforce, which is not bad considering the tough economic times the region has gone through. Downtown Cleveland also has three pro sports facilities, the rock hall, great lakes science center, a mall (although it sucks), a historic shopping arcade, and a rail transit hub all downtown. Not bad for a city its size. I will say that it is far from perfect, and Cleveland needs to continue to attract more residents and get better shopping downtown.
2. The train from the airport goes through an old industrial rail right-of-way and is not exactly the best way to see the city. At least you can take the train from the airport to downtown. Few cities have this option.
3. You say you were not impressed by the character of the neighborhoods/suburbs? Maybe because you just saw from the airport to downtown? Not sure where you went but if you find yourself there again and want to explore check out Lakewood, Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, Rocky River, Tremont, Ohio City, Little Italy, or University circle. If someone does not find those areas attractive I would have to question their taste in "character." There are also plenty of newly developed suburban areas further from the city if that is your thing.
4. Cleveland has a big medical presence in the University Circle area (where the Cleveland Clinic is located). This is also where most of Cleveland's cultural institutions and museums are located. A brand new bus rapid transit line was just built to better connect downtown with University Circle, although the areas in between are pretty rough.
5. You are 100% correct about the lakefront - it sucks. It does get nice as you move away from the city core though. You will find some pleasant lake front areas in the suburbs. There are plans to improve it, but it will take decades as they will have to move existing industrial operations. I think more people in the area do their outdoor recreation in the Cuyahoga Valley National Park, located south of the city.
Hey never said Cleveland was the greatest place in the world, it certainly has its issues with run down areas and grit. To address some of your comments:
1. There are very few empty buildings left in Downtown Cleveland. Most have been rehabbed into residential units over the past decade or are in the process of being rehabbed. New construction of several new buildings was slated to start right before the economy tanked, so these have been put on hold. There are two nightlife districts downtown that are successful, the Warehouse District and Gateway. The Gateway District has really just popped up over the last 5 years and has totally transformed the area around the basketball and baseball arenas. Cleveland has the 13th largest downtown workforce, which is not bad considering the tough economic times the region has gone through. Downtown Cleveland also has three pro sports facilities, the rock hall, great lakes science center, a mall (although it sucks), a historic shopping arcade, and a rail transit hub all downtown. Not bad for a city its size. I will say that it is far from perfect, and Cleveland needs to continue to attract more residents and get better shopping downtown.
2. The train from the airport goes through an old industrial rail right-of-way and is not exactly the best way to see the city. At least you can take the train from the airport to downtown. Few cities have this option.
3. You say you were not impressed by the character of the neighborhoods/suburbs? Maybe because you just saw from the airport to downtown? Not sure where you went but if you find yourself there again and want to explore check out Lakewood, Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, Rocky River, Tremont, Ohio City, Little Italy, or University circle. If someone does not find those areas attractive I would have to question their taste in "character." There are also plenty of newly developed suburban areas further from the city if that is your thing.
4. Cleveland has a big medical presence in the University Circle area (where the Cleveland Clinic is located). This is also where most of Cleveland's cultural institutions and museums are located. A brand new bus rapid transit line was just built to better connect downtown with University Circle, although the areas in between are pretty rough.
5. You are 100% correct about the lakefront - it sucks. It does get nice as you move away from the city core though. You will find some pleasant lake front areas in the suburbs. There are plans to improve it, but it will take decades as they will have to move existing industrial operations. I think more people in the area do their outdoor recreation in the Cuyahoga Valley National Park, located south of the city.
In reference to some of those building being rehabbed, there are more than a few, and since I've been traveling to Cleveland often over the past couple of years, I haven't seem much progress. I stay at my friend's place downtown when I visit, and I do tend to get around the area. Again, I like the infrastructure in place downtown, but I would like to see more residents downtown, and I'm a little surprised that more people haven't moved into downtown with the tax initiative in place. In reference to the train from the airport to downtown, I am not impressed - with the exception of the first view you have going into downtown, and then being downtown. You are correct though that at least there is a direct connect from the airport to downtown. The train station is nice. I have been to many of the other parts of the city and other burbs, and I do like some. I really enjoyed the South Side restaurant in Tremont (the Chicken Waffles, and the Salmon w/ Lobster risotto were to die for). I have a friend who lives in the Warehouse District downtown, and I like that area.
In reference to some of those building being rehabbed, there are more than a few, and since I've been traveling to Cleveland often over the past couple of years, I haven't seem much progress. I stay at my friend's place downtown when I visit, and I do tend to get around the area. Again, I like the infrastructure in place downtown, but I would like to see more residents downtown, and I'm a little surprised that more people haven't moved into downtown with the tax initiative in place. In reference to the train from the airport to downtown, I am not impressed - with the exception of the first view you have going into downtown, and then being downtown. You are correct though that at least there is a direct connect from the airport to downtown. The train station is nice. I have been to many of the other parts of the city and other burbs, and I do like some. I really enjoyed the South Side restaurant in Tremont (the Chicken Waffles, and the Salmon w/ Lobster risotto were to die for). I have a friend who lives in the Warehouse District downtown, and I like that area.
Hey, I would also like to see more residents downtown. Cleveland certainly has a ways to go. Like I said the economy put several projects on hold. Most of the downtown buildings that could be rehabbed have been. It's actually tough to find apartments downtown, so there is a demand. The local government is also pretty backwards about encouraging these things, but is finally starting to see the light.
If you are seeing neglected buildings downtown I would have to think it has something to do with the Euclid Corridor Project construction over the last couple years. This has really put a hurting on building rehabs on the southeast section of downtown due to major street construction. I will agree this area looks bad, but I know there are plans to make improvements to these buildings. I did not think about this in my prior post.
Also, I agreed with you that the train ride from the airport is ugly - It runs through a former industrial rail right-of-way. What do you expect anyway? The ride from the Chicago airports or NYC airports to downtown is also ugly except for the skyline views.
I can't believe for the life of me why people would want to live in the north. IE Twin Cities, Milwaukee, Detroit, Cleveland and so on. NY and CHI are such nice cities that winter doesn't matter or that you have so much going on in NYC, and Chicago that you just put up with the weather. I love Milwaukee more than any other city I have been to. Winter is terrible I can't believe people actually like shoveling a foot of snow every two weeks and the cold and dark days, you might as well live in Alaska. Why not live somewhere where people go on vacation, family you ask what are you going to cry every minute you can't see your aunts and uncles and parents. I hate winter and I know I'm just whining but when people tell me they like winter I also think they would like sleeping on a bed of nails too. I can't comprehend that when people tell me they like snow and cold and dark days and change of seasons. For me it's like trying to understand a Korean math problem. Nobody in there right mind I believe enjoys bad weather, these must be the people who love to be miserable. I'm moving to SD or Miami when the wife graduates grad school. Winter is the devils summer. I just don't believe you when you say I enjoy winter! yeah and I enjoy a hammer hitting my toes!!!
Personally I have lived down south. I cannot stand the heat, humidity and most of all I hate to sweat. That said, I don't like it below 20 either, but anything from 30-60 deg is my perfect temperature. With the exception of a few days here and there we have had blue skies almost everyday with cool weather. Dec-Jan we had alot of snow, but overall we only had three months of snow on the ground.
What I don't understand is why people have to live in a tropical paradise to go outside? What is it about 50 deg that you cannot go outside? Does your grill not work, will your car not run, you can't sit on the porch with a cup of coffee, the sidewalks are too long, the park is just to far? What?
I think people do like to be miserable, they would rather watch tv all winter than put a hat on and walk the dog. Its all what you make of it. Theres my rant.
Personally I have lived down south. I cannot stand the heat, humidity and most of all I hate to sweat. That said, I don't like it below 20 either, but anything from 30-60 deg is my perfect temperature. With the exception of a few days here and there we have had blue skies almost everyday with cool weather. Dec-Jan we had alot of snow, but overall we only had three months of snow on the ground.
What I don't understand is why people have to live in a tropical paradise to go outside? What is it about 50 deg that you cannot go outside? Does your grill not work, will your car not run, you can't sit on the porch with a cup of coffee, the sidewalks are too long, the park is just to far? What?
I think people do like to be miserable, they would rather watch tv all winter than put a hat on and walk the dog. Its all what you make of it. Theres my rant.
People question places they are not familiar with. People who live in tropical areas perhaps like the fact that they can go to the beach, depending on the tropical place, go hiking, etc. They may like the year-round warm weather. For the same reason you like the colder weather, others may like the warm weather.
What do you mean, can't see the sky in NYC? lol. And I actually have no problem finding parking spaces in my neighborhood You can't generalize all of NYC by just Manhattan. Like I said before, I bet nearly everyone on this forum who has been to NYC, has probably never set foot in the outer-boroughs.
Girlfriend, I have been.
That's still too cramped and squished for me. To each their own.
MilwaukeeCity is suffering from Cabin Fever. This happens up North every Spring after the temperatures get close to 70 degrees, then gets cold again. Hang in there MC, it will get warm soon!
Last edited by scoop89; 04-01-2009 at 11:02 PM..
Reason: corrected
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You can't generalize all of NYC by just Manhattan. Like I said before, I bet nearly everyone on this forum who has been to NYC, has probably never set foot in the outer-boroughs.
It's OK
