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Question; was Yanukovich "thrown out power by his own cabinet" BEFORE thugs from the fascist Right Sector with pots and pans on their heads organized an armed attack in Kiev. The answer is not. So when thugs organized the armed attack, "the majority of Ukrainian people" didn't participate in it; neither did they participate in anti-government
Comrade Erasure, you seems to be very knowledgeable on the issue, I wonder if you counted all the clubs and baseball bats "fascist" Pravii Sector deployed in its vicious armed attack that overwhelmed government of Yanukovich? Were those magic bats, or it could have been a new secret weapon Americans deployed to undermine the glory of Russia. It is pity none was captured for further research. It is an extraterrestial technology with little doubt.
Last edited by RememberMee; 01-26-2016 at 11:42 PM..
Comrade Erasure, you seems to be very knowledgeable on the issue, I wonder if you counted all the clubs and baseball bats "fascist" Pravii Sector deployed in its vicious armed attack that overwhelmed government of Yanukovich? Were those magic bats, or it could have been a new secret weapon Americans deployed to undermine the glory of Russia. It is pity none was captured for further research. It is an extraterrestial technology with little doubt.
Nah, there was nothing "extra-terrestrial" about the Praviy sector monkeys.
And there was no "secret weapons deployed by Americans."
That's what it was;
Nah, there was nothing "extra-terrestrial" about the Praviy sector monkeys.
And there was no "secret weapons deployed by Americans."
How many baseball bats did you spot in those videos?
I wonder why bat wielding pravii sector tripped some circuits in Yanukovich' brain causing him to abandon his office for no apparent compelling reason. At the same time, comrade Putin invested thousand upon thousands tons of shells and ammo, not speaking of other things, and yet Poroshenko doesnt flee (yet) or comes to terms. I tell you CIA messed with those baseball bats and helmets, they were charged with zero energy Americans acquired at the Roswell alien crash site.
Putin studied and lived here in Turku in the early 90's, and the former Arch Bishop of Finland broke Putin's collarbone during a football match. Not so tough, eh?
How many baseball bats did you spot in those videos?
I wonder why bat wielding pravii sector tripped some circuits in Yanukovich' brain causing him to abandon his office for no apparent compelling reason. At the same time, comrade Putin invested thousand upon thousands tons of shells and ammo, not speaking of other things, and yet Poroshenko doesnt flee (yet) or comes to terms. I tell you CIA messed with those baseball bats and helmets, they were charged with zero energy Americans acquired at the Roswell alien crash site.
There was a direct threat to Yanukovich's life in the first case.
In the second case - "the thousands tons of ammo" are shipped exclusively to Donbass/Lugansk region.
Neither Donbass nor Lugansk have any interest to claim Kiev or to bomb any other territories.
They defend what's rightfully theirs and don't give a damn what the rest of Ukraine wants (other than other adjacent Eastern provinces of course.) That's why Poroshenko can sit in Kiev and do whatever he wants ( for now.)
You really don't understand simple things or just pretending to not to understand them?
Last edited by Rozenn; 01-31-2016 at 07:39 AM..
Reason: Bickering
Whose land is that? Greek, Tartar, Italian, German, Turk'?. How much historical perspective we are talking about?
Of course, this is Slavic lands, because Slavs lived there for last few centuries. But this is not Ukrainian lands. Crimea, Odessa and Black Sea coast - is the result of Russian-Turkish war, and it is merit of Catherine the Great. Population of Kharkov 100 years ago: Russians (Velikorosy) 109 914 (63.2%), Ukrainians (Malorosy) 45.092 (25.9%). Population of Donetsk 100 years ago: Russian 59.518, Ukrainians 27.582. It's Russian lands. And one day they will say that they want back to Russia, as the Crimea, if you do not change your attitude towards them. And if Putin will say "OK", then nothing can stop them.
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Originally Posted by RememberMee
In not so distant historical perspective Moscovy occupied less than 1% of the landmass Russian Federation claims today. Also, what other countries can engage in proactive revisions of "historical perspectives".
Moscow principality did not call themselves "Muscovy". Moscow called themselves Rus' (later "Russia" in Greek style). And Moscow was not only option for unification of Russian lands. Tver, Novgorod or Kiev (Duchy of Lithuania) could also unite the Russian lands. And in any case, this country had name "Russia".
Last edited by Maksim_Frolov; 01-27-2016 at 07:00 AM..
Of course, this is Slavic lands, because Slavs lived there for last few centuries.
Using your reasoning, predominantly Ukrainians lived there for the last few centuries, Ukrainian SSR and Ukraine owned that land for the past 90 years. Of course it is Ukrainian land.
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But this is not Ukrainian lands.
Yes, it is Ukrainian lands now. And that is all that should matter in 21st century.
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Crimea, Odessa and Black Sea coast - is the result of Russian-Turkish war, and it is merit of Catherine the Great.
Wrong. Russian Empire wars. Ukrainians were a major part of those wars, a key part. Russian ethnicity, Russian state cannot just privatize legacy of the Russian Empire because of universal adjective Russian (Muscovites stole and privatized it too).
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Population of Kharkov 100 years ago: Russians (Velikorosy) 109 914 (63.2%), Ukrainians (Malorosy) 45.092 (25.9%). Population of Donetsk 100 years ago: Russian 59.518, Ukrainians 27.582.
Comrade Frolov, why dont you dig out population numbers for the lands surrounding Kharkiv etc.? Russians as many other colonizers preferred to colonize cities to control and assimilate coutryside from there (owerhelmingly Ukrainian countryside). This colonial legacy is alive and well in independent Ukraine. What does it prove? Colonizers have more historical rights than the colonized? You bringing up data for the boom industrial towns is especially manipulative. Also, you forget that Ukrainians settled huge chunks of Russian Federation proper. Sustained policies of ethnocide and lingocide russified and wiped Russian Ukrainians as a self aware group, turning descendants into mankurts. It is sad to see how many Russian nazi volunteers from Russia have Ukrainian family names. Imperial subjugation 101. Unfortunately, Ukrainians provided so much of biomaterial to Empire, there is no way Russian Empire could have happened without Ukrainian biomaterial.
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It's Russian lands.
Nope, Russian Federation is limited to its 1991 borders, unless the world is willing to open another bloody chapter of wars and annexations.
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And one day they will say that they want back to Russia, as the Crimea,
That is not how Russian and Russified mentality works. Even pathological Russian nazis need very specific and straightforward orders from Miscow authority to act like that. Neither Crimea nor Donetsk collaborants did anything on their own, hatred and Russian nazism need a central authority trigger to strike.
There was a direct threat to Yanukovich's life in the first case.
You mean that guy in video swang the bat way too hard? I thought so. I wonder why Yanukovich couldnt take some power clinging classes from Putin' pal Assad. Yanukovich has suprisingly weak guts as for a post soviet mafioso, and yet circumstantial evidence points to Putin making him an offer to flee, or at least doing everything possible to overwhelm Yanukovich' fragile psyche. This 2004 video shows Yanukovich fainting after somebody in the crowd threw an egg at him. It didnt take much to overwhelm him in 2014, it could be very well that guy with a bat was the last straw. https://youtu.be/fP0vWkqOQT8
Last edited by Rozenn; 01-31-2016 at 07:40 AM..
Reason: Bickering
RememberMee, I give the facts, figures, names and years. You give only emotions.
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Originally Posted by RememberMee
Comrade Frolov, why dont you dig out population numbers for the lands surrounding Kharkiv etc.? Russians as many other colonizers preferred to colonize cities to control and assimilate coutryside from there (owerhelmingly Ukrainian countryside). This colonial legacy is alive and well in independent Ukraine. What does it prove? Colonizers have more historical rights than the colonized?
You are wrong. It was not a colony. Kharkov is Russian frontier fortress. Kharkov region was populated by Ukrainians, who fled from Poland. This explains the large percentage of Ukrainian rural population.
Современный город возник на возвышенном платоводораздела рек Харьков и Лопань на месте разрушенного древнерусского городища окружностью не менее 530 саженей[16], со множеством подземных ходов — сначала как небольшая крепость Московского государства на территории Белгородского воеводства для защиты границ от набегов кочевников.
I think you are mistaken when you curse Russians. When you accuse them of repression. You're wrong when you building your policy on hatred for Russians. I think it will destroy Ukraine.
You post a video featuring a well known war criminal, mass murderer, torturer, sick to the bone psychopath as a fine example of Donbass people? Perhaps. Nevermind he was smart enough not to never work in mines. I was amazed, I simply couldn't believe how nonchalant Russian nazi scum and collaborants are about posting videos of torture, humiliation and war crimes. And if that is not enough, comments of the rabidly jubilant Russian citizenry just top it off, you just want to forget Russian language those rabid human like creatures use, not to have anything in common with two legged animals in comments overdosed on famous Russian "spirituality". If this guy will not be captured, tried, or eliminated in any other way, if Ukrainian state will make any deal with Russia allowing this guy to walk, there is no point for such a state. At the very least GRU death squads must get rid of him the way they got rid of other notorious collaborants and Russian nazi volunteers.
You are talking about Givi?
Yeah, he is pretty cool guy and he is doing a fine job on the battlefield from what I know.
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Yes, it does apply to ethnic Russians of Donbass, this term applies to the rest: mankurt, except there was not fight, they turned without fight. Remember good chunk of Donbass people are descendants of the "vicious" Banderovets.
Banderovets? Donbass? Nah, you are getting all confused as usual. Bandera - that's mostly Western Ukraine, with all their SS divisions, cute German uniforms, and Nazi insignia. Eastern Ukraine has totally different history, during the WWII including.
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Chinghiz Aitmatov draws in his book, The Day Lasts More Than a Hundred Years heavily on the tradition of the mankurts.
The legend is about a Turkmenian who defends his homeland from invasion. He is captured, tortured, and brainwashed into serving his homeland's conquerors. He is so completely turned that he kills his mother when she attempts to rescue him from captivity.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mankurt
The term mankurt means not just an assimilated person, it's an assimilated person wishing and/or working to destroy (unwanted) mother culture, language, identity. Since you are a russified minority yourself, are you a mankurt wishing the death to your mother' identity, culture and language just like many Donbass people of Ukrainian origin do?
I didn't know you are a fan of Asian culture and their legends, such as this one; "According to Chinghiz Aitmatov, there was a Kyrgyz legend, according to which mankurts were prisoners of war who were turned into slaves by having their heads wrapped in camel skin."
Me personally - I don't care much for them, considering them backwards, and basically with no future. I mean they have right to exist, but these cultures are definitely not something to look up to. That's why their most advanced representatives were grateful to Russians, that they were giving them an opportunity to channel their abilities into the modernity, escaping the medieval-like stage of their own society. They were originally nomads after all.
As for me being a "russified minority" - nah, not really.
It just happened to be so, that I have more than just ethnic Russians in my family, so it gave me a possibility to have a glimpse into the life of minorities in Russia and to compare a thing or two.
And as for Donbass and its inhabitants - they are no "mankurts" either, as much as they were not "Banderovets."
This is their historic background - they were one and the same with Southern Russia; the region that has been known in history as the "Don Cossacks host."
Last edited by Rozenn; 01-31-2016 at 07:40 AM..
Reason: Bickering
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