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Old Yesterday, 09:27 PM
 
4,504 posts, read 4,092,775 times
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If this were the other way around, that a 4 yr old was spending half her time sleeping on a living room couch with her FATHER who is staying at his parents' crowded household, with people coming and going through the living room at all hours, and this was the indefinite arrangement, while that same 4 yr old had a bed and a bedroom at the mother's house, do you think that the court would give the father anything more than a Saturday night sleep over every other weekend, and dinner together every Wednesday night? NO, the court would not. They would advise the father to provide the child with a bed and a stable living situation, if he wanted more visitation.

The situation is not unsafe for the girl, because presumably the mother is with her in the living room. But it is far from ideal. Children her age need about 12 hours of sleep a night, which surely is not going to happen in the living room of a crowded household. And it's not as if she would be going into foster care or be in a homeless shelter if she weren't couch surfing with mom. She HAS her own bed and bedroom at her father's house.

I would ask your ex if there is anything that you can do to help her to get into her own apartment so that your child can have a bed in a bedroom. If she refuses, consult a child custody attorney in your area, and go for temporary full physical custody, with her at your house except for Saturday night sleepovers every other week, until mom is able to provide her with a bed in a bedroom.
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Old Yesterday, 10:32 PM
 
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
10,057 posts, read 8,937,007 times
Reputation: 22280
Jared, GET A LAWYER!!

GET A LAWYER!!

GET A LAWYER!!

GET A LAWYER!!

You need one to have a voice. A judge isn't going to let your ex sleep on a sofa if she can afford an apartment.
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Old Today, 04:29 AM
 
126 posts, read 40,914 times
Reputation: 269
You pay child support for her to sleep on the couch. Sounds like someone is using the child support money for something else.
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Old Today, 08:07 AM
 
Location: NJ
12,062 posts, read 22,230,358 times
Reputation: 10901
Quote:
Originally Posted by parentologist View Post
If this were the other way around, that a 4 yr old was spending half her time sleeping on a living room couch with her FATHER who is staying at his parents' crowded household, with people coming and going through the living room at all hours, and this was the indefinite arrangement, while that same 4 yr old had a bed and a bedroom at the mother's house, do you think that the court would give the father anything more than a Saturday night sleep over every other weekend, and dinner together every Wednesday night? NO, the court would not. They would advise the father to provide the child with a bed and a stable living situation, if he wanted more visitation.

The situation is not unsafe for the girl, because presumably the mother is with her in the living room. But it is far from ideal. Children her age need about 12 hours of sleep a night, which surely is not going to happen in the living room of a crowded household. And it's not as if she would be going into foster care or be in a homeless shelter if she weren't couch surfing with mom. She HAS her own bed and bedroom at her father's house.

I would ask your ex if there is anything that you can do to help her to get into her own apartment so that your child can have a bed in a bedroom. If she refuses, consult a child custody attorney in your area, and go for temporary full physical custody, with her at your house except for Saturday night sleepovers every other week, until mom is able to provide her with a bed in a bedroom.
I don't have experience with that but will say that my daughter was sleeping on the couch (with no one else in the room) at her fathers girlfriends when she was 12 or so; there was a teenage boy in the house that I was worried about for good reason. I went to court and won. He had his own place where she had her own room.
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Old Today, 08:18 AM
 
2,265 posts, read 2,669,821 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tamajane View Post
I don't know if acceptable living standards are just being lowered lately (I suspect so, along with the decline) but that just doesn't sound like a good set up for a child. It sounds like how homeless people and hippies couch surf. A sleeping room for a child should have a door, fine if it is shared with a parent or other children.
I wholeheartedly agree. Most folks on here think that as long as there are walls and a roof, she’s good. It’s actually pretty bizarre how folks on here are acting like a 4 year old living on the couch, in a high traffic common room, is completely acceptable.
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Old Today, 08:23 AM
 
2,265 posts, read 2,669,821 times
Reputation: 1851
Quote:
Originally Posted by parentologist View Post
If this were the other way around, that a 4 yr old was spending half her time sleeping on a living room couch with her FATHER who is staying at his parents' crowded household, with people coming and going through the living room at all hours, and this was the indefinite arrangement, while that same 4 yr old had a bed and a bedroom at the mother's house, do you think that the court would give the father anything more than a Saturday night sleep over every other weekend, and dinner together every Wednesday night? NO, the court would not. They would advise the father to provide the child with a bed and a stable living situation, if he wanted more visitation.

The situation is not unsafe for the girl, because presumably the mother is with her in the living room. But it is far from ideal. Children her age need about 12 hours of sleep a night, which surely is not going to happen in the living room of a crowded household. And it's not as if she would be going into foster care or be in a homeless shelter if she weren't couch surfing with mom. She HAS her own bed and bedroom at her father's house.

I would ask your ex if there is anything that you can do to help her to get into her own apartment so that your child can have a bed in a bedroom. If she refuses, consult a child custody attorney in your area, and go for temporary full physical custody, with her at your house except for Saturday night sleepovers every other week, until mom is able to provide her with a bed in a bedroom.
That’s a good idea. Also, you pointed out a huge double standard too. Imagine, had I been the mother, in this situation, asking if it is appropriate for a four year old to couch surf with her father in a similar household. Everyone would be up in arms and saying “that’s no way for a four year old to live, even temporarily!!”
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Old Today, 08:25 AM
 
2,265 posts, read 2,669,821 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germaine2626 View Post
In my area, there is a city occupancy rule that says that you are allowed two people per bedroom plus one extra (or eleven people in a five bedroom house).

In a five bedroom house I am surprised that they can't make arrangements to fit nine people in five bedrooms. Mom & Dad in one room, Sister and Boyfriend in another, and three more bedrooms for three adults and two young children.
Well, just about every adult has their own room, with the exception of the sister and her boyfriend. Yes, even the mother and father sleep in separate bedrooms.
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Old Today, 09:03 AM
 
1,268 posts, read 1,598,134 times
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So I guess the question becomes, are you willing to do anything about this? Because telling your ex you don't like what's going on is going to accomplish nothing. She has the means to get an apartment now. Or grandpa and grandma could be sharing a room. None of those things are happening.

I think you need a lawyer, and to get a formal custody agreement in place, addressing what both of you are okay with going forward regarding your daughter. A lawyer will know what issues need to be spelled out. This is not a time to try to do it yourself and hope for the best.

Also, you are unhappy with the fact that your ex has your daughter sleeping on a couch with no privacy. What happens when your ex begins to date? Are you okay with her having random men sleep over while your daughter is there on her custody week? If you don't have a formal custody agreement (through the courts) spelling out that there are to be no overnight guests while your daughter is there, then be prepared for anything goes. We've recently had a thread on here about another divorced dad who was super uncomfortable when his ex began almost immediately within a month or two of dating allowing the new boyfriend to spend time with his kid alone and take them places (without the mom there.) A formal custody arrangement can spell out things like no one except family is to care for your child alone without advance permission from the other parent. This is why you need to get a lawyer and get a formal agreement spelled out with your ex in writing through the courts. A verbal agree is worthless. That works both ways, but it's for the protection of your child and to make sure she's safe.

Last edited by kitkatbar; Today at 10:22 AM..
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Old Today, 09:08 AM
 
Location: Brentwood, Tennessee
46,523 posts, read 44,841,892 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kitkatbar View Post

So I guess the question becomes, are you willing to do anything about this? Because telling your ex you don't like what's going on is going to accomplish nothing. She has the means to get an apartment now. Or grandpa and grandma could be sharing a room. None of those things are happening.
Exactly.

Otherwise it's just going to be more years of venting but no real decisive action.
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Old Today, 09:13 AM
 
Location: Florida
11,904 posts, read 5,564,613 times
Reputation: 24564
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaredC View Post
I am angry at the fact that my daughter will not get a bedroom for privacy. People in that house come and go at all times of the day and night, which would mean she would probably be woken up 3am when one of her sisters go to the gym, or at midnight when her other sisters boyfriend comes home from work.
My son had to fight for visitation rights with his daughter, and at some point because of the mom's new BF's drug arrest, DCF got involved. They had to visit our home and my granddaughter's other grandparents home to see if they were "suitable" homes. At that time my granddaughter was sharing the room with her dad (she was 4) and DCF said she had to have her own bedroom. Unless you feel your daughter is in danger I would not get Child Protective Services involved.
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