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Make the Palestinians citizens and allow them to vote for the Knesset. If they must be under the control of Israel, then give them a voice in government.
If they're going to vote as Israelis in Israel's interests, fine. If they're going to vote to undermine and destroy their host country not so much.
Make the Palestinians citizens and allow them to vote for the Knesset. If they must be under the control of Israel, then give them a voice in government.
You mean the Palestinians who elected leaders with the sworn goal to destroy Israel? You really think a country should give voting rights to foreigners who would like to see it weakened?
Liberals sure are willing to throw Israel to the wolves.
If they're going to vote as Israelis in Israel's interests, fine. If they're going to vote to undermine and destroy their host country not so much.
If they gain citizenship and the vote, you can’t restrict their voting choices. That’s why it’s such a poor idea in the first place.
Exactly.
Voting rights are an important right of society, but creation of a civil society must precede that. That is why "mock elections" such as those held in Gaza in either 2006 or 2007, or those held in Bush II-controlled Iraq during the opening years of the 2000s (I'm still not sure what to call the period 2000-9), or even Pakistan's series of electoral attempts over the years have not produced democracy. There is no commitment to moving resolution of disagreement from the streets and battlefields to the halls of Parliament.
The institutions that need to exist are civic organizations, a functioning press (who knows what form that takes in a digital age) and the like. The need, then, is a commitment that disagreeing parties are committed to each others' survival.
The more I read from liberals who are willing to see Israel destroyed - suggestions have ranged from relocating the Israeli Jews to New Jersey (and turning Israel over to the Palestinians) to giving the Palestinians, who despise Israel, the right to vote to help destroy it, the more I think Israel should stop playing nice and instead expel the foreigners in the West Bank and Gaza back to Jordan and Egypt.
After all. The Arab countries had no qualms expelling nearly a million Jews. Why can’t the Jews expel the Arabs?
You mean the Palestinians who elected leaders with the sworn goal to destroy Israel? You really think a country should give voting rights to foreigners who would like to see it weakened?
Liberals sure are willing to throw Israel to the wolves.
I’m a center-left liberal, and I don’t think you could fairly characterize me as anti-Israel. They have an absolute right to exist.
But they are not doing themselves any favors by continuing to gaslight the Palestinians in the West Bank by continuing “settlements” and occupying the remainder. The offer should be 100 percent of unannexed land and no fragmentation of contiguous territory (e.g. Golan is off the table, Israel did annex it). Abandon the settlements that force fragmentation, and annex what Israel won’t give up. That offer should be written and public, with ALL provisions listed. If Israeli settlers insist on staying on unannexed land, cool, Palestine must offer them citizenship or permanent residency similar to what Israel did with the Golan.
If a two-state solution is the answer, it must be two STATES and not one fully independent (Israel) with a sort-of, restricted state on the other.
Unlike the 2000 offer, if it’s public-somewhat more difficult not to be serious about it, for either side.
The more I read from liberals who are willing to see Israel destroyed - suggestions have ranged from relocating the Israeli Jews to New Jersey (and turning Israel over to the Palestinians) to giving the Palestinians, who despise Israel, the right to vote to help destroy it, the more I think Israel should stop playing nice and instead expel the foreigners in the West Bank and Gaza back to Jordan and Egypt.
After all. The Arab countries had no qualms expelling nearly a million Jews. Why can’t the Jews expel the Arabs?
I believe there are too many settlements to allow a viable Palestinian state and at this point the Palestinians should abandon a separate state and fight for citizenship and voting rights.
There are already 1.8 million Palestinians living in Israel peacefully and apprising 20% of the population.
Arguing that Palestinians should be denied citizenship simply because they are Muslims is ethnic hatred.
In 1960 the USA was 89% Caucasian and is now 69% and by 2050 will be 49%. Should Asians ,Hispanics and blacks be expelled or denied citizenship to maintain whites as the majority? the USA was founded and maintained as a majority white country for hundreds of years. Your argument against Palestinian citizenship is the same as expelling minorities to keep America majority white. In a minority majority America it will be repugnant and the erosion of support for Israel will continue amongst minorities and progressives.
The world will be a different place if the USA stops supporting Israel in the UN,
It's beyond me that you can write this sentence: There are already 1.8 million Palestinians living in Israel peacefully and apprising 20% of the population. followed immediately by this one: Arguing that Palestinians should be denied citizenship simply because they are Muslims is ethnic hatred. and not see the massive inconsistency.
As for your suggestion that the Palestinians should abandon a separate state and fight for Israeli citizenship and voting rights, I have a feeling you wouldn't last long as an advisor to the P leadership.
If a two-state solution is the answer, it must be two STATES and not one fully independent (Israel) with a sort-of, restricted state on the other.
Why?
Harmless Canada's independence was phased; first, "responsible government" in the 1850's, meaning basically home rule, then "Dominion" status on July 1, 1867, then the vice-regal head of state being a Canadian, in the 1920's or 1930's, then control of foreign policy starting in 1931, then it's own embassies, I think in 1944 and at some point during WW II, command over its fighting troops. Why should an entity whose sworn aim is the destruction of its neighbor be given the keys to the legitimate use of military force and violence right away?
I’m a center-left liberal, and I don’t think you could fairly characterize me as anti-Israel. They have an absolute right to exist.
But they are not doing themselves any favors by continuing to gaslight the Palestinians in the West Bank by continuing “settlements” and occupying the remainder. The offer should be 100 percent of unannexed land and no fragmentation of contiguous territory (e.g. Golan is off the table, Israel did annex it). Abandon the settlements that force fragmentation, and annex what Israel won’t give up. That offer should be written and public, with ALL provisions listed. If Israeli settlers insist on staying on unannexed land, cool, Palestine must offer them citizenship or permanent residency similar to what Israel did with the Golan.
If a two-state solution is the answer, it must be two STATES and not one fully independent (Israel) with a sort-of, restricted state on the other.
Unlike the 2000 offer, if it’s public-somewhat more difficult not to be serious about it, for either side.
It has to start with the Palestinians electing leaders who want peace with Israel. Electing Hamas terrorists, who refuse any offer short of Israel’s destruction, makes any two-state solution a non-starter.
Also, WHY does it have to be two states? Why can’t the Arabs just go to Jordan and Egypt? After all, it was THEIR countries that attacked Israel, and lost their land in the process.
P.S. Up until recently, like last week, I was in favor of a two-state solution. But with the liberals spewing their hate against Israel, and the U.N. continuing to operate under a pronounced anti-Israel bias, I think it’s time to consider Israel’s taking a harsher approach.
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