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Then you proved my point that PIV was what sealed the deal for you and the other stuff did not matter.
To the other poster - having PIV and not connecting means you were just not interested in sex in the first place and it was thrust upon you (no pun intended). After all, prostitutes have PIV with their clients and are not bonding with them. In this case it's just a physical exercise without any meaning. But my case is that if you ARE attracted to the other person then PIV is what creates the bond.
Fine. State that case for you. You can't possibly know or make assumptions about other people's view of this intimate and complex bond. You don't get a say in that for other people. You just don't. Full stop.
Then you proved my point that PIV was what sealed the deal for you and the other stuff did not matter.
To the other poster - having PIV and not connecting means you were just not interested in sex in the first place and it was thrust upon you (no pun intended). After all, prostitutes have PIV with their clients and are not bonding with them. In this case it's just a physical exercise without any meaning. But my case is that if you ARE attracted to the other person then PIV is what creates the bond.
I don't know if PIV creates a bond or not since I haven't done it. I just know that when it comes to heterosexual relationships, many people think that only PIV is real sex and aren't satisfied if the relationship doesn't include it. If other intimate activities counted as sex, I wouldn't be told that I need therapy since I don't like the idea of PIV. Sure, it's necessary if you want to conceive children but if not, why can't other intimate activities suffice?
Then you proved my point that PIV was what sealed the deal for you and the other stuff did not matter.
To the other poster - having PIV and not connecting means you were just not interested in sex in the first place and it was thrust upon you (no pun intended). After all, prostitutes have PIV with their clients and are not bonding with them. In this case it's just a physical exercise without any meaning. But my case is that if you ARE attracted to the other person then PIV is what creates the bond.
No. Just, no. I was VERY interested in the sex. And I did have a bond of sorts with my ex, at least insofar as I came to view him as a very annoying relative that I had to put up with and kind of cared and hoped he didn't suffer in life. But at first, I pursued him for sex mostly. He was the one who glommed on for a serious relationship. Eventually I came to have a lot of contempt and no respect for him, which destroyed my desire to have sex with him...but I still, though we haven't had sex since like March or early April of last year, care about him as a person.
My lover who has ED issues sometimes, PIV is very difficult for him and just usually doesn't work out very well. He is an older man, and has a lot of psychological baggage as well that may contribute to all of this. He uses other means to stimulate me and some of those things feel WAY better than PIV ever did. (Any of you ladies have a Hitachi? Amirite??) And more importantly there's a lot of connection between us in mental and emotional areas. I really think we are both in love, and that is rare for me...usually one person is in love, and the other isn't.
I have four lovers right now. The other two men have better ability to do the PIV thing...and I don't love them more, nor am I more bonded to them, than the other. I love all four of my polyamorous configuration the same amount, if not for the same reasons or in the same exact ways.
Really bottom line, you just don't get to speak for other people, how we feel, or why we feel what we do. You can state these things as facts for YOU, but you're not the Feels Police. Some of us have enough experience to know of what we speak, for ourselves, thankyouverymuch.
I may not be the "Feels police" as you say but I am just going on what is considered the consensus by the vast majority. You may be an outlier in this regard. What I am saying is that the mainstream view is that if it ain't PIV it ain't sex... and good or great sex requires PIV. Other forms of sex are auxillary to PIV because PIV is the final resulting act of lovemaking. You're right that each person defines this for themselves but I am talking about views as discussed by the majority.
Many people consider a relationship to be "sexless" even if there are other types of sex but PIV is absent. A relationship without PIV is just nothing more than a platonic roommate type situation.
I may not be the "Feels police" as you say but I am just going on what is considered the consensus by the vast majority. You may be an outlier in this regard. What I am saying is that the mainstream view is that if it ain't PIV it ain't sex... and good or great sex requires PIV. Other forms of sex are auxillary to PIV because PIV is the final resulting act of lovemaking. You're right that each person defines this for themselves but I am talking about views as discussed by the majority.
Many people consider a relationship to be "sexless" even if there are other types of sex but PIV is absent.
Yes, I definitely agree.
Quote:
A relationship without PIV is just nothing more than a platonic roommate type situation.
This I don't personally agree with since I wouldn't touch a platonic friend at all outside of a hug or something, but sure, some others may feel this way.
I may not be the "Feels police" as you say but I am just going on what is considered the consensus by the vast majority. You may be an outlier in this regard. What I am saying is that the mainstream view is that if it ain't PIV it ain't sex... and good or great sex requires PIV. Other forms of sex are auxillary to PIV because PIV is the final resulting act of lovemaking. You're right that each person defines this for themselves but I am talking about views as discussed by the majority.
Where are you getting this "vast majority" from?
I'm chuckling at the idea that the "vast majority" would have considered what Monica did to Bill as not sexual. Everyone I knew at the time, and have spoken about it with since then, have been of the mindset that he did in fact have "sexual relations with that woman". Guess all of these folks are "outliers" too?
A relationship without PIV is just nothing more than a platonic roommate type situation.
So, any other manual manipulation, oral, or any other type of penetration is not sex? You have a far more liberal view of the definition of "platonic" than I do.
And, I really, really don't think that's the view of the "vast majority" of people.
I'm chuckling at the idea that the "vast majority" would have considered what Monica did to Bill as not sexual. Everyone I knew at the time, and have spoken about it with since then, have been of the mindset that he did in fact have "sexual relations with that woman". Guess all of these folks are "outliers" too?
Hell, I remember a lot of people saying that lewinskying is more intimate than PIV sex.
Hell, I remember a lot of people saying that lewinskying is more intimate than PIV sex.
The oral or using your intern as a cigar humidor?
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