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Old 10-21-2014, 09:23 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
5,746 posts, read 3,213,924 times
Reputation: 7205

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
"America deals with their racism openly"......say what?

Aside from over a hundred years of historical proof to the contrary with events that curdle the blood and prosecution of guilty parties taking decades to engineer carefully lest you upset the established hierarchy as witnessed in getting a KKKlucker to stand trial for a black church bombing and bringing to trial those who murdered three civil rights workers.

I guess that's why in a very short span of time you've seen suppressed anger bubble up like a giant case of hear-burn at the shooting deaths of two young blacks by police forces.

Justified shootings or not; it sure speaks about all that "openness" and "forthrightness" that the result is a huge release of frustration in the form of violence seemingly simmering just under the surface waiting for a trigger to be pulled.

Were racism indeed being dealt with in the U.S as openly as opined on here, it could be reasonably assumed it would take more than a single event to build that kind of anger.

Let's invite Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton to discuss how openly they think Racism is being handled in the U.S. shall we? They are making a great living off of servicing the exact opposite perception among African Americans.

The NAACP got it's genesis from over fifty years of lynchings in the U.S. and Ida Wells along with other prominent blacks saying enough is enough. Some would have us believe racism in Halifax is a comparator?

Sandman, Fusion; don't waste any more time on this stupid thread. Reality will not be served by preaching reason to those entrenched in the numero-uno agenda.


I think a couple of hours have passed. Is it safe to come back yet?

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: Your choice to FREAK OUT out at the slightest thing is exhausting. It also makes coming on these threads a thoroughly unpleasant experience (you'll be happy to hear that, no doubt).

Nowhere in any of my posts have I ever denied that the US has a racist past or ongoing problems with racism. Do you think I'm so freaking stupid that I would? Where in my post did I say that Halifax is comparable to a city like Detroit? Do you think that I'm so freaking dumb that I would suggest that? (notice that I'm being a good girl, today: I'm not cussing. I really do feel like using real cuss words right now, but I'm not gonna do it).

And, you know, you're right. You've made me see the light, BruSan. The United States is evil. It is the most vile, corrupt, violent, racist, stupid, despicable wasteland in modern history. This is why I think Canadians should boycott EVERYTHING American. ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING.

And that includes your annual 6 months in Florida, BruSan. I'm going to ask you again: Why on earth do you want to support what, in your view, continues to be a horribly racist country AND does little to nothing to rectify its racism? Why? And Florida of all places; my goodness! You're willing to look past all that violence and simmering anger in that cesspool of racism just for those cheap green fees? How could you? What do you think that says about you?
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Old 10-22-2014, 06:17 AM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
5,746 posts, read 3,213,924 times
Reputation: 7205
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandman249 View Post
I have never thought about racial segregation in Toronto because I don't even think that it is an issue. Has Toronto passed laws to stop and frisk minorities and check their immigration status? Is school segregation a big issue in Toronto? Does Toronto or Canada (in general) disproportionately lock up immigrants? What am I missing? I am asking this question with all sincerity ...
The reason that segregation may not be an "issue" in Toronto, comes down to numbers. Period.

And that's the point edward and I were trying to make. If the black population is no more than 10% of the population - as it is in Canada's largest city - then segregation isn't likely to exist, at least not to the same extent. How could it? But if Toronto's black population became more than 80% of the city's population - as it is in Detroit, or even 50%+ of the population, as it is in some Detroit suburbs - then do you honestly believe that (self) segregation wouldn't exist?

It's all about demographics. It's not because Canadians are less racist. If you believe otherwise, you are delusional.

And this applies to your other example of "frisking" minorities to check their immigration status. I don't agree with that practice, but once again, it's all about numbers. Canada doesn't share a border with much poorer country from where people desperate to escape poverty/violence or to join family members in the rich country next door, can easily walk across the border to do so. It doesn't provide relatively easy access to people in other poor countries adjacent to that poor next door neighbor.

The illegal immigrant population in the US is now estimated to be more than 10 million people, and that's a conservative estimate. If Canada were dealing with more than 10 million - and growing - illegal immigrants, would Canadians be happy about that? Indifferent to it? Would everything be sunshine and roses? How, I wonder, would Canadians and Canadian authorities deal with that? Would they warmly welcome the thousands of people attempting to illegally enter the country every month? Would Canada offer citizenship to the millions of others already in Canada illegally? Do you and your brethren deal with that "issue" where you live, as do residents in parts of Texas, Arizona, California, just to name a few?

See, once again, it's easy for Canadians to sit back and cluck indignantly about issues they know nothing about because they've never dealt with them in their own country.
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Old 10-22-2014, 07:18 AM
 
18,321 posts, read 10,398,747 times
Reputation: 13386
Quote:
Originally Posted by newdixiegirl View Post


I think a couple of hours have passed. Is it safe to come back yet?

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: Your choice to FREAK OUT out at the slightest thing is exhausting. It also makes coming on these threads a thoroughly unpleasant experience (you'll be happy to hear that, no doubt).

Nowhere in any of my posts have I ever denied that the US has a racist past or ongoing problems with racism. Do you think I'm so freaking stupid that I would? Where in my post did I say that Halifax is comparable to a city like Detroit? Do you think that I'm so freaking dumb that I would suggest that? (notice that I'm being a good girl, today: I'm not cussing. I really do feel like using real cuss words right now, but I'm not gonna do it).

And, you know, you're right. You've made me see the light, BruSan. The United States is evil. It is the most vile, corrupt, violent, racist, stupid, despicable wasteland in modern history. This is why I think Canadians should boycott EVERYTHING American. ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING.

And that includes your annual 6 months in Florida, BruSan. I'm going to ask you again: Why on earth do you want to support what, in your view, continues to be a horribly racist country AND does little to nothing to rectify its racism? Why? And Florida of all places; my goodness! You're willing to look past all that violence and simmering anger in that cesspool of racism just for those cheap green fees? How could you? What do you think that says about you?



Making this a little personal now aren't you? Okie-dokie, I'll play along while you're enjoying your little tantrum.

You can feel free to use cuss words; I've heard 'em all and already been called worse by much better.

Did I actually quote your post; as I thought I had deliberately avoided doing just that by picking that one sentence only? You were not the poster who mentioned Halifax, nor was a comparison to Detroit mentioned. Stating the U.S. is "more open" in dealing with racism is utter nonsense. They're only open in the context they have no other choice due to the issue being featured prominently on major media OFTEN.

Sorta like the snake living under the front porch that chooses to sun itself daily on the front walk where everyone wishes it would stay under the damn porch instead of showing itself to the neighbours.

I suppose for ease of understanding I should have piecemealed and been more particular using multiple quotes and responses but, I don't have the patience for that, given the nonsense posted over the two countries and their relative racial dynamics.

Racism exists in both of our countries and will continue to until hell freezes over. Racism exists within continents occupied by ALL one racial identifier between neighbouring tribes less than ten miles apart for heaven's sake. It doesn't have to be home grown ....they can, and do, bring 'some' of it with them!

To assume it can be eradicated with nothing more than touchy-feely platitudes is simply silly.

Now as to your VERY personal addressing me with YOUR freak-out: I have not attributed any of those descriptors you've chosen to the U.S., either by implication or direct reference. Responding to individual nutz on here does not, nor is it intended to indict a country. I'm not the one, once again, throwing countries into the blender and attempting to then identify the "superior" one.

Justifying to you my chosen winter vacation has gotten old. I've done that more than once for you already. I don't give a rat's patoot what you might think that says about me.

We good?
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Old 10-22-2014, 07:23 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,013,882 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
And what in the blue blazes may I ask, has that got to do with racism in either country?
A community of people forcing their way into society and carving out a piece of it for themselves despite disenfranchisement and not being included in the process for decades has everything to do about racism. How does it not?
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Old 10-22-2014, 07:27 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,013,882 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
Cripes ED you generalize way too much! I'm white and it has never caught me off guard when blacks have indicated a preference for America over Canada. The ones I've worked with have been very forthcoming with the reasons and racism was not the biggy.
We do nothing but generalize on this site, guilty of it myself from time to time obviously. I am glad we are on the same page though. Maybe it is a generational issue, because folks in my age group are often confused as to why a black person who has the option to live in Canada, would choose to leave for its significantly more racist neighbor. I have had these conversations....time and time again.....even had one in September when I was last in the GTA.
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Old 10-22-2014, 07:47 AM
 
18,321 posts, read 10,398,747 times
Reputation: 13386
Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardsyzzurphands View Post
A community of people forcing their way into society and carving out a piece of it for themselves despite disenfranchisement and not being included in the process for decades has everything to do about racism. How does it not?
Except when referenced they are choosing one locale over the other ONLY due to racism.

You're talking about their environment after arrival whereas I'm talking about why they may have moved in the first place.
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Old 10-22-2014, 08:10 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,013,882 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
Except when referenced they are choosing one locale over the other ONLY due to racism.

You're talking about their environment after arrival whereas I'm talking about why they may have moved in the first place.
I think it is pretty safe to assume, no one is fleeing either the US or Canada solely due to racism these days. They are still two of the best places to live on this planet, no matter what colour you are.
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Old 10-22-2014, 08:11 AM
 
18,321 posts, read 10,398,747 times
Reputation: 13386
Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardsyzzurphands View Post
We do nothing but generalize on this site, guilty of it myself from time to time obviously. I am glad we are on the same page though. Maybe it is a generational issue, because folks in my age group are often confused as to why a black person who has the option to live in Canada, would choose to leave for its significantly more racist neighbor. I have had these conversations....time and time again.....even had one in September when I was last in the GTA.
Generalization point taken.

I've spent a lifetime of working with any number of minority members, firstly in the armed forces, and later as both on site and overseas consultant in a team environment in the designing, installing and development of preventative maintenance schedules for all types of high speed production equipment.

As you can imagine I've been present and contributed to any number of discussions and queries from interested parties towards my minority confreres as to why they chose Canada, would they do so again, why did they leave the U.S. and yes, of course, also the vice-versa to all.

Canadian racism is as pervasive as can be seen anywhere. A lifetime has taught me that we are not unique nor will we ever be free of this UNTIL the problem is addressed world wide.

I have personally talked a Somali into not following through on his threat to skin a Nigerian alive over a "racial" slight. He was quite serious and not easily convinced as the Nigerian persisted with his characterization of all Somali's as the scum of Africa.

When a larger demographic "perceives" itself having to make accommodations to a smaller or simply more vocal identified group in whatever category of daily life, sparks will fly. The trick to all of this is how to bring all parties to the table with equal intent and an identifiable goal.

How do you remove the perception from historical narrative that it is "our country" and you must fit in? Easy answer; you cannot. Only time and generational changes in demographic profile will do that.

Convincing group "A" there's even a problem needing address is tantamount to bringing the mountain to Mohammad.

This is not something that plagues Canada singularly; it is endemic worldwide.
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Old 10-22-2014, 08:12 AM
 
18,321 posts, read 10,398,747 times
Reputation: 13386
Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardsyzzurphands View Post
I think it is pretty safe to assume, no one is fleeing either the US or Canada solely due to racism these days. They are still two of the best places to live on this planet, no matter what colour you are.
Agreed upon wholeheartedly.
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Old 10-22-2014, 08:43 AM
 
Location: London, UK
3,458 posts, read 4,013,882 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
Generalization point taken.

I've spent a lifetime of working with any number of minority members, firstly in the armed forces, and later as both on site and overseas consultant in a team environment in the designing, installing and development of preventative maintenance schedules for all types of high speed production equipment.

As you can imagine I've been present and contributed to any number of discussions and queries from interested parties towards my minority confreres as to why they chose Canada, would they do so again, why did they leave the U.S. and yes, of course, also the vice-versa to all.

Canadian racism is as pervasive as can be seen anywhere. A lifetime has taught me that we are not unique nor will we ever be free of this UNTIL the problem is addressed world wide.

I have personally talked a Somali into not following through on his threat to skin a Nigerian alive over a "racial" slight. He was quite serious and not easily convinced as the Nigerian persisted with his characterization of all Somali's as the scum of Africa.

When a larger demographic "perceives" itself having to make accommodations to a smaller or simply more vocal identified group in whatever category of daily life, sparks will fly. The trick to all of this is how to bring all parties to the table with equal intent and an identifiable goal.

How do you remove the perception from historical narrative that it is "our country" and you must fit in? Easy answer; you cannot. Only time and generational changes in demographic profile will do that.

Convincing group "A" there's even a problem needing address is tantamount to bringing the mountain to Mohammad.

This is not something that plagues Canada singularly; it is endemic worldwide.
Very well said, I enjoyed reading that.
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