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Glad you brought up the above passage of scripture, urbanlemur. It's one that is most favored by the 'anti-gay brigade' and one that they have no clue as to its meaning.
that was my mistake in not including the two verses prior to where i began. actually, we Christians do understand the meaning. if you refer back to verse 19 and 20 of Chapter 1: for the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men (Greek: anthropos), who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. this word "anthropos" means either individual but in this case, mankind in general. in addition, His attributes are manifest (Greek: phaneros) meaning publicly or outwardly shown to all. therefore, mankind is born with an inherent knowledge of God and all of creation stands as a testimony to His works. creation demands a Creator and design a Designer. His works are available for all to see. so what did mankind do? they (all men and women) suppressed that knowledge and gave themselves over to manmade philosophies and speculations regarding the existence of man. so it's not just those who once thought they followed God and left the faith; it's all of mankind that has basically denied the existence of God and are held accountable for it in light of all the evidence we have that God does indeed exist and is.
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They are serving and worshiping 'the creature' rather than the Creator who they once worshiped and served.
see previous paragraph
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We need to understand here that Paul was NOT writing his letters to we of today in the year 2018 but to a specific early Christian Church, the recipients of whom would have understood what Paul is writing about.
so you're saying that this part of Scripture and others like it are irrelevant for today and have no meaning for us? nothing could be further from the truth. ALL of Scripture is still just as applicable to day to us as it has been throughout history. what you present is merely a cop-out attitude in order to justify and entitle people today to do whatever they please with complete disregard for anything that is in the Bible. so i have to ask this question: if you start throwing out verses like these, what else are you going to eliminate? why not start with the rest of the book of Romans? why not the rest of Paul's writings? why don't we just throw out the life of Jesus and that way you make the OT null and void? see where i'm going? you either accept ALL of Scripture or you don't. you do not have the authority to pick and choose the parts of Scripture you want to allow and discard everything else. it's all or nothing.
Paul personally met with Jesus on the road to Damascus, went there and was baptized and thereafter, spent about 3 years in the wilderness. he returned to begin his ministry and traveled far and wide to share the same Gospel of Jesus Christ he persecuted Christians over prior to his conversion. to suggest that Paul had no clue as to what he was writing about is to question and/or deny the very power and ability that God gave him to preach Jesus with. i have full confidence that ALL of Scripture was inspired by God for men to write and that the words in the Bible are just as relevant today as they always have been and always will be. why? because God was, is and always will be God and He never changes or makes a mistake. mankind cannot make the same declaration.
Last edited by mensaguy; 11-21-2018 at 07:40 AM..
Reason: Read the rules. Don't use red text.
That's the danger of liberal anti-Bible Christianity. They can make up whatever they want. I'm surprised he hasn't claimed that Jesus was gay since He only had male disciples.
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Originally Posted by Wardendresden
Yes, gay or not God loved them, just as straight or not God loves you. Equality under God Almighty!! Isn’t that a surprise!
So who is on the roster of those whose moral track record has been compromised by the imaginations of some around here?
All of the eunuchs
Jonathan
David
Ruth
Naomi
Maybe you can throw in Moses as well since he saw the Lord's hind side...
That's what you and jeffbase are, judgmental hypocrites. And you will be judged by God in the exact same manner as you judge others for their sins.
hypocrite: "a person who condems others actions then turns around and conducts themselves in the same manner."
or "a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, especially a person whose actions belie stated beliefs"
the ony reason you call us hypocritical is because we disagree with homosexuality, despite efforts to "meet in the middle", so to speak, and that makes you so angry at us so you have to resort to name calling to vent your frustrations. i get it. however, truly loving another person doesn't mean you have to accept "everything" about them but you try your best to live with them as best you can. is there someone in your life you love and you don't "like" everything about them but you get along anyway? the stumbling block between Christians and gays is that a lot of gay people want complete acceptance of their life and how they live, period and nothing else....no compromise. however, if anyone disagrees with them, they in turn hate you. so what happened to the old adage of "agreeing to disagree"? i guess that's something that was long ago but not for today.
now regarding judgment, you failed to recognize John 7:20 where Jesus states: "do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.” we're not supposed to judge someone by their looks but by their actions and words.
so if you want to hate me, go ahead...i've incurred worse. that being said, i will never stop sharing the Gospel of Jesus Christ and i will never stop praying for people to repent of their sins and receive Jesus as Savior and Lord. you can count on it...
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And you will be judged by God in the exact same manner as you judge others for their sins.
and who are you to say how God is going to judge us? according to what is in Scripture, i know how God is going to judge the unrighteous and those who deny God but as for Christians, i would never overstep that line and assume to know how God will judge any of us. that's treading in dangerous territory.
That's not what a lot of Jewish scholars think about David and Jonathan---and there are significant hints in Scripture itself that there is more to that relationship
i don't care what Jewish scholars believe....according to Scripture, it says they had a love for each other such as very close friends, almost like brothers and nothing more. to insinuate something else is repulsive and totally wrong. i also know that the Jewish people, in general, don't have a problem with homosexuality so this provides nothing more than a means of justification and entitlement to those who want to use Scripture to make sin more acceptable. one can make a case for anything in the Bible as being acceptable by God if one wishes to twist a jot here and move a tittle there in order to do so.
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It is highly probable that the two men were lovers. Jonathan, I think was gay. David was bi. And God loved both of them.
another modern day fable....another case of twisting Scripture in order to negate the seriousness of certain sins.
i don't care what Jewish scholars believe....according to Scripture, it says they had a love for each other such as very close friends, almost like brothers and nothing more. to insinuate something else is repulsive and totally wrong. i also know that the Jewish people, in general, don't have a problem with homosexuality so this provides nothing more than a means of justification and entitlement to those who want to use Scripture to make sin more acceptable. one can make a case for anything in the Bible as being acceptable by God if one wishes to twist a jot here and move a tittle there in order to do so.
another modern day fable....another case of twisting Scripture in order to negate the seriousness of certain sins.
It's obviously important for the self-righteous to cling to their sanctimony and bigotry.
It's part of what makes fundie Christians so despicable.
the ony reason you call us hypocritical is because we disagree with homosexuality, despite efforts to "meet in the middle", so to speak.
Okay, honest question here Urban.... What is your idea of "meeting in the middle"??? Because I have seen exactly ZERO fundamentalists that are trying to "meet in the middle". I have seen many trying to keep gay people from being married, and trying to keep from having to serve gay people, treating gay people as 2nd class citizens (I could go on, but you can get the gist, surely), but no "meeting in the middle". So please, can you explain what you mean by that?
So who is on the roster of those whose moral track record has been compromised by the imaginations of some around here?
All of the eunuchs (just those born so from birth)
Jonathan (gay)
David (bi)
Ruth (a strong heterosexual woman)
Naomi (a strong mother-in-law)
Maybe you can throw in Moses as well since he saw the Lord's hind side...
Read your Bible and THINK. All you and others have done is follow corrupted thinking with regard to people.
Your love of "sinners" is remarkably love-deficient, and your moral high-ground just self-righteous.
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