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My point was your were negating jluke's facts with a CD poll? If you read the post, there many people that are posting opinions based on some very miss informed facts about Atlanta, Charlotte, New Orleans, and Houston/Dallas in particular (although maybe it's just easier for me to pick those errors out because I live here).
I voted for Austin because I said this poll is basically more of a popularity contest and Austin is my favorite city in The South.
Jluke's "facts" were merely this: "Outside of oil, Houston has the ports, NASA, TMC, international airport, Rice, and more. If anything, ATL is trailing behind Houston." Hardly an encyclopedia here. The sentence in bold is pure opinion. There have been "facts" posted for both cities but you seem to only regard some as true.
Again, you're a Houston resident. You have a horse in the race while I don't. I'd be pleased to move to either city if given a nice job
At the risk of this thread degenerating into another Atlanta vs Houston, TX
thread I'd like to make some comments.
First of all I like your analysis on the transportation issues and I agree that the Houston's port helps make up for the relatively "backwater" status of its airport compared to Atlanta's. Yet you conveniently forgot to mention rail transportation. Not mass transit, I mean freight. Atlanta is the railroad hub of the South. And, let's take a look at major interstates: Atlanta has I-75, I-20, and I-85 passing through. Houston really only has interstate 10. Someho I-45 counts as an interstate also but it only connects Houston with Dallas! So Atlanta wins easily in the logistics/transportation.
That said, you can't compare the city of Houston with the city of Atlanta. One one hand you're comparing fortune 500 companies in the two cities and then your complaining that metro Atlanta has greatly benefited from not having another large city to compete with. You complain that Houston shares Texas with Dallas, Austin, and San Antonio but there are vast distances between them. Just from looking at a map (all that I have time for) I can see that Charlotte and Birmingham, AL are at similar distances away as Austin and SA are from Houston. Who cares that they share the same state? I'm willing to bet Atlanta puts a lot more money into the GA economy than it takes out. As far as Dallas goes-what a joke its 300-400 miles away! Texas is much larger than Georgia so the advantage Atlanta has of GA companies' HQs holds little water.
Houston wins (partially due to it's over-reliance on the energy sector) this. Yall love this Fortune 500 stat but if you look at Houston's 9 companies in the fortune 200, a full 7 of them are in the energy industry! Take a look at Atlanta's and you'll see a more diversified economy. They have 6 in the top 200 and represent energy, food/bev, consumer discretionary, logistics, and an airline. I'm betting on Atlanta on the long run-what will Houston do when the volatile energy sector has problems?
Culture: Atlanta has museums and classical music also. But if you consider pop culture, Atlanta blows Houston out of the water as far as importance to the South.
Not to mention Atlanta is obviously more important historically. Factoring in this, it's superior higher education options, it's more relevant (for good or bad lol) pop culture, the diversity of its economy, the Olympics, and its central position in the South, Atlanta deserves the #1 Southern city ranking.
1. Atlanta
2. Houston (just behind)
3. Dallas-Ft Worth (very diverse economy with lots of F500s)
4. Miami
5. 3-way tie between Charlotte, Norfolk-VA Beach, and New Orleans but if I had to rank them:
a) Charlotte
b) Hampton Roads
c) N O
P.S.- As a Houston resident can you really judge this without bias? I've never lived in GA or TX.
"Carpet Capital of the World" lol! that's interesting. I've never heard that before.
I was surprised you didn't mention Athens. I've always thought it was an important Georgia city. Oh and to add to Savanna, they also have the Savanna College of Art and Design (SCAD) one of the top art and design schools in the country. I'm sure you already knew that, but I just wanted name drop SCAD.
And to answer your question about San Antonio, at one time it was much larger than Houston or Dallas but the city is also much older than both cities. It was founded by the Spanish Conquistadors during the 1600 or 1700's. It's the oldest city in Texas and even predates some cities on the east coast. But I'm not quite sure when or why Houston and Dallas passed San Antonio. I know that Fort Worth and Dallas where (and still are) big in the cattle and cotton industry which where also a large part of the regions development.
Dalton is suffering REALLY bad due to the housing industry.A lot of rich people are there,but its really a crappy old town with a serious "good ole boy issue".Marla Maples(Donald Trumps ex)and Deboirah Norville(Inside Edition) are from there.The unemployment rate I think is at 13%(the Highest in the state)
Athens really is just UGA.Thats about it.But it is for the most part doing well.Nice place,but not really too important compared to the rest.
I also left out The Golden Isles of Georgia: According to the latest statistics provided by the Glynn County Board of Realtors[citation needed], the average single-family dwelling on Sea Island sells for $3.4 million. St. Simons Island is more affordable, with the average household selling for $299,850. The most expensive house on the island sold in 2004 for $4.4 million. The most expensive house in the Golden Isles sold in 2004 was on Sea Island for just over $12 million. Jekyll Island is the least expensive, with houses selling at an average of $208,000. Land on Jekyll is owned by the State of Georgia, but residents have long-term leases. Due to the high number of affluent residents, the Golden Isles have been able to enjoy many of the finer retailers usually found in upscale neighborhoods in large cities such as Atlanta or Miami.Sea Island hosted the G8 Summit in 2004.Even most people in Georgia are not aware of its prominence in hosting the super rich.http://www.architecturaldigest.com/images/homes/2006/09/cloister/hoar01_cloisters.jpg (broken link)The Cloister Resort
By your cryptic answer I'm going to guess you're referring to the Texas Medical Center? That's a big asset but what does that have to do with the diversity of major corporations HQed in Houston? I don't think something made of non-profits will have much affect on the fortune 500. I admit you do raise a good point considering overall economy though but Atlanta is still more diversified.
Last edited by destinedtodave; 10-19-2009 at 11:40 PM..
Atlanta is served by 2 Class I railroads, Houston has 3.
^ the most important hubs are the ones with the most colors.
First of all, how can a city at the far edge of a region be the hub?
CSX uses Atlanta a lot and has a rail yard there. Norfolk Southern also has a yard in Atlanta. Both of these railroads have extensive coverage of the South East of Louisiana.
Let's see for Houston: Union Pacific has a yard there, but how relevent is this to the South? Here's a little visual aid: File:Union Pacific Railroad system map.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I know of no Class 1 railroads that are important to the South that have a presence in Houston and not Atlanta. But the opposite is true. Seriously, you'd have to be insane to think Houston is the rail hub of the South.
Houston's rail freight (at least there Class 1) seems to have little to do with the South!
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestbankNOLA
I-85 goes through Charlotte before ending at I-95.
I-75 goes to Detroit and Florida
I-20 goes from I-10 to I-95
I-45 connects with I-20, I-30, and I-35 once it hits Dallas, so it indirectly has a broad reach
I-10 connects to Los Angeles, all of the oil cities on the Gulf and west to Florida where it meets I-75 and I-95
Your point? I-10 is busier than I-20, I-75 & I-85 and only rivals I-90 or 80 and I-95 when it comes to national importance.
Stats about I-10? Doesn't really matter though since we're not talking about the West Coast are we? If we were talking about national importance than an interstate going to Cali would bare some importance.
So we have Houston with only 1 interstate! If you're going to claim I-45 has an "indirect" reach than Atlanta's I-20 reaches I-95 in South Carolina, and I-85 reaches I-77 in Charlotte. According to your "indirect" measure that connects Atlanta with the North. But indirect is meaningless since they are all actually connected-the point is Atlanta has 3 interstates while Houston has 1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestbankNOLA
That would be nice if importance was a popularity contest.
In some ways it is. For example, I think Atlanta's glut of pop culture is quite important to record companies so this impacts the South's economy. Importance can be measured in many ways, and only a fool would deny cultural influence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestbankNOLA
^ Mostly subjective.
Perhaps my last sentence. But do you care to dispute Atlanta's historical importance? It's central location? Really anything that I mentioned there?
Jluke's "facts" were merely this: "Outside of oil, Houston has the ports, NASA, TMC, international airport, Rice, and more. If anything, ATL is trailing behind Houston." Hardly an encyclopedia here. The sentence in bold is pure opinion. There have been "facts" posted for both cities but you seem to only regard some as true.
Again, you're a Houston resident. You have a horse in the race while I don't. I'd be pleased to move to either city if given a nice job
I'm not sure what gave you the impression I'm being a Houston "booster." My argument is that there has been some less than credible information on all sides. I could careless weather or not people on CD think Houston is more important than ATL. I've just seen some very ill informed information about Houston as well as Dallas and other city. I'm not sure why you are trying to argue the credibility of CD threads and polls. Not that this isn't entertaining and all, but our lists and polls on this blog site don't prove anything. Their just opinions for the most part.
As far as your "un-bias opinion," I'm sure Atlanta has a much greater influence on South Carolina than most big cities, especially Houston and Dallas.
Also I would agree that Houston and Atlanta are both nice cities and I would also live in either one if offered a good job.
By your cryptic answer I'm going to guess you're referring to the Texas Medical Center? That's a big asset but what does that have to do with the diversity of major corporations HQed in Houston? I don't think something made of non-profits will have much affect on the fortune 500. I admit you do raise a good point considering overall economy though but Atlanta is still more diversified.
I wasn't really trying to make a case for which city is more diversified, I was just replying to that one SPECIFIC question you asked. ATL may very well be more diversified economically then Houston.
There are more cities in the South besides Houston and Atlanta. I would like to see a defense of why Tampa should be in the top 5. I also like the commentary about New Orleans too. I'm surprised there isn't any Nashville supporters on here making there claim as to why Nashville should be on this list.
Because they don't compare to the Big 4 in the South. The fifth spot is a wash.
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