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I already told you that my argument is that there is concern and vaccination should be a choice.
The reason they don't want to disclose is because... why? It's suspect. The woman is unnamed and supposedly got measles from some unnamed unvaccinated source... and the family doesn't call for all people to be vaccinated? Still sounds fishy to me. If we don't have a positive ID then there is a chance that the woman is fictional. IMO.
Yet if you read the bill, it includes public and private school... this leaves hiring a credentialed tutor... um... a teacher to homeschool.
I added the [sic] because I spell it differently. Meaning that it is not my spelling but theirs.
Actually the definition of immunization is: "
the fact or process of becoming immune, as against a disease."
Being vaccinated does not mean being immune. You and others have said so. Some who are vaccinated are not immune because the vaccine is not 100% effective.
So my question was more about the actual disease. I had chicken pox but when I applied for a job at the local hospital they wanted to vaccinate against chicken pox. I had to prove my immunity by a titer which cost me $200... Why when I know I had the disease already. Should we have to prove immunity? Really?
This brings up an interesting point; California Day Care Workers Mandatory Vaccinations. $200 is a lot of money for a titers test to prove you had a disease. Well, then just get vaccinated (for free?) for all the diseases you had? Is this going to be next? We will not take your word. Either prove it with an expensive titers, or get vaccinated? Just think how many adults do not have their immunization records for those vaccinations they did get? Sounds like a whole lot of money to be made for the pharms and medical industry to satisfy the paranoid people in society who do not trust your word or unvaccinated natural immunity itself.
This goes beyond schooling to the ability to earn a living. My daughter would be in the same category as your were. She had chicken pox in 1991, and would either have to get titers or be vaccinated against chicken pox.
Edit: My SIL had Shingles at the age of 33. Would a doctor's note saying that he did be proof enough for chicken pox immunity? lol
I already told you that my argument is that there is concern and vaccination should be a choice.
The problem is that you are not just talking about choice, you are repeating misinformation about vaccines. When you do, I will challenge it.
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The reason they don't want to disclose is because... why? It's suspect. The woman is unnamed and supposedly got measles from some unnamed unvaccinated source... and the family doesn't call for all people to be vaccinated? Still sounds fishy to me. If we don't have a positive ID then there is a chance that the woman is fictional. IMO.
It appears that the idea that measles is not a benign disease is extremely threatening to you. You should be worried, because measles can and does kill people. Why on earth would the Washington DOH make up a story about a death from measles? You and I may not know her name, but her relatives, friends, and the people who cared for her while she was dying do. It is not necessary for us to know her name. For goodness' sake, if the whole thing is "fictional" they could just make up a name for her. The other cases of measles in that outbreak were fictional, too, I guess. I do not seem to recall that the names of any of the measles victims have been published. Fictional - all of them - huh?
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Yet if you read the bill, it includes public and private school... this leaves hiring a credentialed tutor... um... a teacher to homeschool.
You do not need to hire a tutor to home school. There are three other options. You may want to reread my previous post. It lists them all.
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I added the [sic] because I spell it differently. Meaning that it is not my spelling but theirs.
No, it is used when you are pointing out that the passage you are quoting contains an error. A word spelled in the standard way used by another country is not an error.
Actually the definition of immunization is: "
the fact or process of becoming immune, as against a disease."
Being vaccinated does not mean being immune. You and others have said so. Some who are vaccinated are not immune because the vaccine is not 100% effective.
The Australians refer to vaccinations as immunisations. In the context of the financial penalties we were discussing, immunisation and vaccination are synonyms. Quibble about it all you want, but that is the convention in Australia.
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So my question was more about the actual disease. I had chicken pox but when I applied for a job at the local hospital they wanted to vaccinate against chicken pox. I had to prove my immunity by a titer which cost me $200... Why when I know I had the disease already. Should we have to prove immunity? Really?
You can thank those who lie to avoid being vaccinated for that. Yes, you should have to prove immunity. Really.
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Originally Posted by Jo48
Majority had it and didn't even know it. Ok.
But a significant minority have HPV and develop complications from it, from simple warts to cancers.
There is no vaccine controversy because those who fear and oppose vaccines have no evidence to support their views. The "controversy" is entirely manufactured by the anti-vaccinationists. Physcians and research scientists know that vaccines are safe and effective.
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Originally Posted by leebeemi
I can't speak for the above poster, but I read it as "Vaccines SHOULDN'T be controversial."
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Originally Posted by Kibbiekat
There is no "vaccine controversy." Vaccines save lives. period. It is a fact. I have no patience for science deniers.
The patience the posters above (and the others that support public health) demonstrate on this thread is admirable.
I am SO thankful I don't actually have to interact with people like the anti-vax anti-science "you're not the boss of me, who gives a rats *&*&ss if my unvaccinated kid gets an immune compromised kid sick" crowd. In my regular life I get to spend time with folks who can process information and risk, and actually consider the public good as an element of their decision making.
Plus, we don't run short on tin foil after dinner because nobody's making hats
"You can thank those who lie to avoid being vaccinated for that. Yes, you should have to prove immunity. Really."
I knew you would say something like that. So you would say that millions of people, who were children before these vaccines ever came out, should have to prove that they had these diseases? Don't bother just get your MMR or Varcilla vax instead? Oh, yeah, you medical professionals, and the pharms, would love that one.
You can go take a hike if you think I am ever going to prove to you or anyone else that I those childhood diseases before the vaccinations came out.
My daughter was born in 1984 AFTER the 1980 date of birth for presumption by the CDC of being exposed to or having chicken pox. The majority of kids born in the early 80's were teenagers when your vax came out. Did you or the CDC consider that younger siblings caught the pox from their older siblings born before 1980?
Medical control freaks with a superiority complex is what this is all about. Don't you realize by this attitude you are pushing more and more people farther and farther away? Quoting science won't matter when people feel they are being threatened by the PEOPLE in Medicine, not necessarily by the Science itself.
Get off your pedestals and come back down from Heaven. Maybe you will convince far more people with a better ATTITUDE.
If believing in science and facts makes me "superior" then I guess it's true. Personally, I think it's the ultimate in misplaced ego to believe you're smarter than thousands and thousands of medical professionals.
I also read scientific studies and am interested in facts. I love science. Health is a high priority in my life. I'm also well aware of how money, power and control can and do influence industries, including research and the field of science. I wish the field of science was pure, operating objectively and entirely free of influence and corruption, but it's not. In addition o loving science and health I highly value my freedom as an individual to make healthcare decisions for myself an my family.
I also read scientific studies and am interested in facts. I love science. Health is a high priority in my life. I'm also well aware of how money, power and control can and do influence industries, including research and the field of science. I wish the field of science was pure, operating objectively and entirely free of influence and corruption, but it's not. In addition o loving science and health I highly value my freedom as an individual to make healthcare decisions for myself an my family.
Which vaccines do you contend were approved and manufactured because of corruption and improper influence?
Please describe your background in science for us.
Exactly when in your life did you decide that vaccines were unreasonably dangerous?
Describe all fields of study that you believe are "free of influence and corruption".
For that matter, I'd like to hear your own definition of the word "corruption".
Describe how refusing to take a recommended vaccine is a "health care decision". (I would call it a decision to engage in unhealthy practices)
Does it ever bother you that you are making these decisions for your children who have no say in the matter?
Which vaccines do you contend were approved and manufactured because of corruption and improper influence?
Please describe your background in science for us.
Exactly when in your life did you decide that vaccines were unreasonably dangerous?
Describe all fields of study that you believe are "free of influence and corruption".
For that matter, I'd like to hear your own definition of the word "corruption".
Describe how refusing to take a recommended vaccine is a "health care decision". (I would call it a decision to engage in unhealthy practices)
Does it ever bother you that you are making these decisions for your children who have no say in the matter?
Look at the industry as a whole, Mark. I don't need to have a background in science to understand this. It's not rocket science.
Regarding your bolded statement, I am always thinking of my children, putting them first and doing what I think and feel is best for them. That is what good parents do, Mark.
Last edited by MissTerri; 07-23-2015 at 02:45 PM..
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