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This move cost Gillette ~$12,000,000,000. I'd say that's a big big effect.
In their case, yes, but in case of a president that alienated minorities and women still got their undying support. Even the guy who he insulted in his rally said he would still support Trump all the way. Trump followers are quite something.
Anyways, I agree, it was a big effect. Wonder how they will fix their mistake if they can.
In their case, yes, but in case of a president that alienated minorities and women still got their undying support. Even the guy who he insulted in his rally said he would still support Trump all the way. Trump followers are quite something.
Anyways, I agree, it was a big effect. Wonder how they will fix their mistake if they can.
I'm glad you agree that Gillette messed up big time with this SJW nonsense.
We dont have to agree on the phrase toxic masculinity for you to explain what specifically you disagree with from the commercial, and honestly I feel like you saying so is a cop out because you know there is nothing you actually disagree with.
Lets break it down
First video segment: 5+ guys chasing one guy, calling him freak and sissy. Do you approve of this ?
Second video segment: cat calling, physical touching of a women without her permission . Do you approve of this ?
third video segment: Play fighting, this is the one area where you and others could call Gillette out for going to far, but because you want to defend the other 2 areas for some reason, you never get to the part you actually could disagree with.
The arguments you and others are making seem to be more about the general climate and some random article you read from Huffington post about men than it does the actual Gillette commercial.
The message is clear - there's a problem with men. That's what the phrase and discussion about toxic masculinity is about. It's a manufactured phrase meant to shame and manipulate an entire group, the same way the phrase white privilege is meant to shame and manipulate an entire group. There is no such thing in either case.
There are men who are dbags. There are also women who are....I won't go further out of respect for the women reading the post. Everyone knows this. To make it a problem 'with men' or 'with women' is unfair and utter b.s.
When people discuss angry black women or the violence of black men, the same people who made up the phrases toxic masculinity and white privilege have a fit. Why? Because they have an agenda.
Buy into whatever you want. I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion here.
The message is clear - there's a problem with men. That's what the phrase and discussion about toxic masculinity is about. It's a manufactured phrase meant to shame and manipulate an entire group, the same way the phrase white privilege is meant to shame and manipulate an entire group. There is no such thing in either case.
There are men who are dbags. There are also women who are....I won't go further out of respect for the women reading the post. Everyone knows this. To make it a problem 'with men' or 'with women' is unfair and utter b.s.
When people discuss angry black women or the violence of black men, the same people who made up the phrases toxic masculinity and white privilege have a fit. Why? Because they have an agenda.
Buy into whatever you want. I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion here.
I agree in general, but the bolded to me is just basic common sense and is how we should view the world in general.
Over in the Relationship board every other thread is why do women do this, why do men do that.
I think people should start learning to exercise some restraint and use qualifiers like "some" I mean it would just take the edge off of people becoming insulted. There's no reason to insult an entire group of people because some people annoy you.
I mean that sentiment should apply across every facet of life, race, religion, sex etc etc etc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPowering1
The message is clear - there's a problem with men. That's what the phrase and discussion about toxic masculinity is about. It's a manufactured phrase meant to shame and manipulate an entire group, the same way the phrase white privilege is meant to shame and manipulate an entire group. There is no such thing in either case.
There are men who are dbags. There are also women who are....I won't go further out of respect for the women reading the post. Everyone knows this. To make it a problem 'with men' or 'with women' is unfair and utter b.s.
But GIllette didnt do that, thats my point.
Quote:
When people discuss angry black women or the violence of black men, the same people who made up the phrases toxic masculinity and white privilege have a fit. Why? Because they have an agenda.
The analogy doesnt work.
One phrase is meant to talk about certain people who do stupid things, where as the other is actually mean to be a blanket statement.
Clearly someone can take toxic masculinity and make it a blanket statement, but Gillette didnt do that, hence, the argument that most here are just projecting or making assumptions instead of actually debating or discussion the context of the commercial itself.
The anger at Gillette come from reading that one Huff Post Article, or watching that one feminist on youtube, or the person who gets shamed through #MeToo.
As I stated by going through the video, there isnt really anything there you guys would disagree with.
Quote:
Buy into whatever you want. I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion here.
The point isn to change minds, its actually to discuss differences of opinion. I mean, thats the point of this forum right ?????
So men should sexually harass women and bully. I'm not saying women don't, but this was taught to us as "alpha" qualities. Granted another person broke it down better, but it still rings true.
Here's what you aren't getting. It's a very small percentage of men who sexually harass women and bully them, but the impression being made is that it's a systemic problem based on gender and most, if not all, men are guilty of those things.
There is a good percentage of men in certain cultures that feel it's okay to smack your woman around if they're not *behaving*. Let's pretend these are black males or Muslims. If an ad geared toward black men or Muslims included the message that it's wrong to get physically abusive with women and this behavior needs to stop, some of you would be upset that this ad suggests that all black males and Muslims beat their women.
Can you honestly sit there and deny that??
What if Kotex created a commercial telling women that PMS doesn't give women a license to be witchy toward others.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chowhound
I agree in general, but the bolded to me is just basic common sense and is how we should view the world in general.
Over in the Relationship board every other thread is why do women do this, why do men do that.
I think people should start learning to exercise some restraint and use qualifiers like "some" I mean it would just take the edge off of people becoming insulted. There's no reason to insult an entire group of people because some people annoy you.
I mean that sentiment should apply across every facet of life, race, religion, sex etc etc etc
Gillette didnt say all men though, you put that imaginary "all" in front of it.
no different than people who say "only" black lives matter, even though there isnt an only there. If anything, there is an imaginary "too" at the end.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPowering1
Here's what you aren't getting. It's a very small percentage of men who sexually harass women and bully them, but the impression being made is that it's a systemic problem based on gender and most, if not all, men are guilty of those things.
There is a good percentage of men in certain cultures that feel it's okay to smack your woman around if they're not *behaving*. Let's pretend these are black males or Muslims. If an ad geared toward black men or Muslims included the message that it's wrong to get physically abusive with women and this behavior needs to stop, some of you would be upset that this ad suggests that all black males and Muslims beat their women.
Can you honestly sit there and deny that??
What if Kotex created a commercial telling women that PMS doesn't give women a license to be witchy toward others.
That wouldn't be offensive?
Some would, some would have an honest discussion about culture or in the example you used, allowing women to get away with acting angry by saying "im on my period".
but again, Gillette never said all. You are just assuming that is what they meant.
Gillette didnt say all men though, you put that imaginary "all" in front of it.
no different than people who say "only" black lives matter, even though there isnt an only there. If anything, there is an imaginary "too" at the end.
I understand that. I pay attention to myself, I monitor my views and what's going on in my head, I do this and try to be as objective as I can. That said the commercial just didn't sit well with me. I understand the larger context, I really do. It just didn't come off well. As others have said, why were all of the jackoffs white? Another layer of PC SJW horsecrap that just sorta annoyed a bit.
I just think companies, as I've posted upthread should, for their own profit margins, generally avoid promoting social messages just for fear of possibly offending people. It just doesn't make good business sense as the dip in sales and revenue prove out. If an organization feels the need to push a message, it should be something universal, curing cancer, ending childhood diseases, I mean fill in the blank. The blank not being some SJW agenda.
Yeah, some men are bad, most probably aren't. Aim your ads to that group.
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