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I just want to hear from one of the 'opposed', one of you who view healthcare as a handout, I just want one of you to tell me how you get through a week without being involved with something the government provided, like:
The roads you drive on
Air Traffic Control System
Inspection of meat and produce
Approved AND tested drugs
Etc, etc, etc....................
You're all so happy to whine about handouts and that people should take care of themselves. Any of you actually do that 100%? If not it's only a matter of degree, I'd bet my $ that we all take advantage one way or another. Ya'll' talk the talk, who can honestly say they walk the walk?
You're seriously comparing those things to a large population of unmotivated people? Doesn't EVEN make sense.
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,330 posts, read 54,400,252 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coyote_Blond
You're seriously comparing those things to a large population of unmotivated people? Doesn't EVEN make sense.
Why? People have been trying to claim that we shouldn't depend on the government yet we do in so many ways. Who's to decide what's OK and what isn't?
And I think you're chatracterization of a large group of people as ummotivated is way off base. Are people who lose long term jobs through no fault of their own and then have a difficult time because of age or changing job requirements necessarily unmotivated?
Why? People have been trying to claim that we shouldn't depend on the government yet we do in so many ways. Who's to decide what's OK and what isn't?
And I think you're chatracterization of a large group of people as ummotivated is way off base. Are people who lose long term jobs through no fault of their own and then have a difficult time because of age or changing job requirements necessarily unmotivated?
We don't milk the system for roads. My point is TEMPORARILY helping someone's one thing. But they need to work damn hard to get back on their feet. Everyone's got a sob story. But a majority can work or make wiser decisions and don't. Why should they? I'm supporting their butts!
The only thing I am certain of, is that there is no simple, easy fix for the USA's current health insurance situation.
I don't think that government-sponsored (read: taxpayer-funded) universal coverage (for everyone, regardless of employment status or income) is the perfect answer.
Neither do I think that the current state of affairs, which has resulted in millions of uninsured people, is acceptable.
Some states, such as Massachusetts, and some counties within states (such as upstate NY, but not downstate) have come up with their own solutions. Whether those models would be workable across the board, nationally, is still uncertain.
I think that government-sponsored health insurance should be made more available that it currently is. And I think that catastrophic health insurance should DEFINITELY be made more available than it is! Right now it is up to the individual states to determine whether such coverage is even allowed to be sold privately, or provided by the state. People who cannot afford $1000/mo for a standard individual policy might then be able to afford a high-deductible (catastrophic) policy for half or less that amount, which would cover them in the event of (as the name implies) catastrophic illness -- which is, after all, what we are all paranoid about! It's not the $2000 or so per year medical expenses that keep most of us up at night; it's the spectre of long hospitalizations or cancer or other life-threatening and bankruptcifying scenarios.
I think that the current low-income state-sponsored plans have set the income ceiling qualification far too low. It disqualifies many people who are older, have lost jobs or are working part-time (no benefits) or fulltime for employers that do not provide health insurance (and there are MANY, MANY of those small businesses!!) but are not old enough to qualify for Medicare (or in dire enough financial straits to qualify for Medicaid). In many areas of the country, one cannot afford individual health insurance on a salary of $30K/yr (gross) after paying for the basics of putting a roof over one's head and food on the table... and yet for most state plans that is "too high" of an income level to qualify. These plans have got to get a better grip on the economic realities of their residents and modify themselves accordingly.
There's no easy simplistic answer to this mess, nor one that will please everyone on both sides of the fence.
(p.s. - No, I am not at all sure that "bankruptcifying" is a real word. I was trying to think of a word that would describe what I was thinking of, and that word seemed to work! )
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,330 posts, read 54,400,252 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coyote_Blond
We don't milk the system for roads. My point is TEMPORARILY helping someone's one thing. But they need to work damn hard to get back on their feet. Everyone's got a sob story. But a majority can work or make wiser decisions and don't. Why should they? I'm supporting their butts!
We may not milk the system for roads but we sure use them. I think you'd be singing a different song if your child had a serious illness and you had no health insurance or other resources.
I think the reality with many is if they already have something or don't need it they don't think the government should be involved with it, if it's something they need they're all for it. Or why are so many OK with the government providing some services and not others? Who should make these decisions?
Personally I'd rather see $$ spent on Americans than propping up some of the bums like Marcos, The Shah, Maliki, and others we happily throw money at with little/no return.
I am not unsympathetic to your sons injury, however you state you can't afford the co-pay, and you question is this fair? Well, life isn't necessarily fair but I am just wondering, do you have cable TV? Does everyone in your family have a cell-phone? Do you drive a new car, go to movies, have a vacation planned this summer? I am just asking not because you should not have or do these things but when one says they can't afford something, sometimes it really boils down to priorities. And is it fair that others or the gov't pay for his treatment?
No everyone in my family does not have cell phones; I do and my two eldest sons do they pay for it themselves, they work.
New car no..I have a 2001 Chevy Venture, bought used paid for, my husband has a 1996 Mazda, my son has a mazda also some kind of hatchback that has to be about 12 yrs old
Have basic cable, do not go to movies, I do pay blockbuster total access $19/month
Also their dad pays over 375/month for there health coverage so I do not find it outragious to say that it is atleast unfair with that kind of premium to still have to pay $30 co pay for each PT visit. Thats 360/month, yes to me thats ALOT for someone that has health insurance. IMO its not only unfair but a rip off!!!
His surgery is recent and the football injury 7 mo ago? It seems strange that the policy won't cover the rehab services that go along with the recuperation from this surgery. Have you gone back to the billing person at the surgeon's office to discover what is what? Have you rec'd an EOB (Explanation of Benefits) that explain what the insurance has paid and denied? I would also check with your primary care provider to see if they can help. Did he have school athletic insurance? (notice my assumption )- that should cover somethings also.
No we did not carry athletic insurance, I thought we would be ok with his health insurance, the premium is high enough. The surgery was 7 months ago the injury about eight months ago. Under United Health Care at least through AA, they do not consider it extended care, if he was an impatient in a rehab facility it would be different (funny it would also cost them more) but since it is OP PT it has the normal 30/co-pay..it really sucks!!! The surgeons office told me that they were sorry but thats how my plan works. If I would go to another PT faciloity it might not be in network. It is definately a catch 22.
And in many ways so do you, I'd imagine. What do you think we have firemen, police, and a millitary for?
Or are you one of those extreme right econ-libertarians who thinks we should privatize those as well?
I am! finally someone gets it! from welfare to warfare there is only one thing that cant be done better in the private sector, and that is our national defense. why is it that people have this notion that for some reason only government could ever do some things?
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,330 posts, read 54,400,252 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silas777
I am! finally someone gets it! from welfare to warfare there is only one thing that cant be done better in the private sector, and that is our national defense. why is it that people have this notion that for some reason only government could ever do some things?
And why is it YOU have the notion that national defense is an exception?
And why are people so content to send hundreds of billions of unaccounted for $$$$$$$$$$ overseas with questionable purpose/results and so opposed to spending $$$ in our own country for our own people?
And why is it YOU have the notion that national defense is an exception?
And why are people so content to send hundreds of billions of unaccounted for $$$$$$$$$$ overseas with questionable purpose/results and so opposed to spending $$$ in our own country for our own people?
Well burdell , that is the one thing that the constitution requires the federal government to do!
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Have you gone back to the billing person at the surgeon's office to discover what is what? Have you rec'd an EOB (Explanation of Benefits) that explain what the insurance has paid and denied? I would also check with your primary care provider to see if they can help. Did he have school athletic insurance? (notice my assumption 
)- that should cover somethings also.
