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I would bet my house that this forum exaggerates the so-called freeze considerably. You don't even have to live in Seattle to realize that. If posts in this thread were accurate, you wouldn't see anyone walking in groups, nobody eating at a restaurant with friends, no socializing, and no propagation of the species. I only half jest.
I've detected a culture found in parts of Europe where people don't feel a need to say hi to strangers, but I highly doubt it's much worse than that. Again, you don't need to live there to use common sense on this. Sit on a bench somewhere and take note of all of the groups of people you will see. Go to a restaurant and take note of the numerous groups of people you see together. They don't all look like family. Just look around on any visit and ask yourself if you see what looks like a bunch of isolated hermits who don't interact with each other. You won't. People appear pretty much normal, and I don't hang out in the tourist areas when I visit.
I don't doubt that there is a cultural difference, but I'm fairly certain it's exaggerated by a factor of 1000 here.
No one ever said Seattleites don't have friends, just that they display anti-social tendencies towards new people/outsiders.
When you move here, give us your assessments in about 6 months.
I moved here close to four months ago and have made a few good friends. I have several hobbies, decided to get a part-time job in order to supplement my contract work (where I reduced hours), joined a few meetup groups, and hang out at places such as Crossroads Shopping Center (play chess and card games there every now and then). Its very easy to make friends if you make an effort and do not have anger issues. One of my best friends in my prior city has major anger/patience/self-righteousness issues and finds it impossible to make new friends. I am going to get another part-time job early next year that will hopefully be something I like and that enables me to meet new people. In most mid-to-large sized cities, meetup group events are not as well attended as in Seattle. People here are more adept at getting online and finding out about sites such as meetup.
Probably helps that I am male. I have heard that females make friends more readily, but I think its easier if you are male and reasonably social. I can visit strange places without fear of getting attacked.
No one ever said Seattleites don't have friends, just that they display anti-social tendencies towards new people/outsiders.
When you move here, give us your assessments in about 6 months.
Like I said, I'm sure there is a cultural difference, just nowhere near as bad as portrayed here. In my mind, it's simply common sense. In another thread the 2006 census was brought up. According to the 2006 census, only 37% of the population of Seattle were even born in the state of Washington. It's pretty hard to logically pin such a cultural trait on a city where most of the people come from somewhere else. If I had to guess:
1. Since so many transplants end up moving away after a short while, perhaps the residents don't make much of an effort to become friends with people who may only move away? Might be a stretch, but a similar phenomena exists when renters move into a residential neighborhood of mostly homeowners. Some people just figure the renters will move on in a year or two and don't really bother trying to become friends with them.
2. It's simply reached urban legend status and has a life of its own. You could live somewhere else and find people who don't call you back, seem standoffish, etc, but never attribute it to anything other than people just being people. Anything short of a warm bear hug from a stranger in Seattle must be due to the "freeze" though.
Like I said, I'm sure there is a cultural difference, just nowhere near as bad as portrayed here. In my mind, it's simply common sense. In another thread the 2006 census was brought up. According to the 2006 census, only 37% of the population of Seattle were even born in the state of Washington. It's pretty hard to logically pin such a cultural trait on a city where most of the people come from somewhere else. If I had to guess:
1. Since so many transplants end up moving away after a short while, perhaps the residents don't make much of an effort to become friends with people who may only move away? Might be a stretch, but a similar phenomena exists when renters move into a residential neighborhood of mostly homeowners. Some people just figure the renters will move on in a year or two and don't really bother trying to become friends with them.
2. It's simply reached urban legend status and has a life of its own. You could live somewhere else and find people who don't call you back, seem standoffish, etc, but never attribute it to anything other than people just being people. Anything short of a warm bear hug from a stranger in Seattle must be due to the "freeze" though.
Report back to us once you've moved there and lived there a few months. Many people are stunned once they get there and they've never even heard of the Seattle Freeze.
Good luck. After you've been there for six months, check back in and let us know how it goes. There are a few posts I've read in this thread where someone who came to Seattle excited and bright-eyed about making friends and having a good time before or right after they moved ultimately asks WTH is going on with people not returning their calls or wanting to make eye contact with them after a few months. It most certainly isn't normal; people will make comments about how there are plenty of people who don't want to socialize with you in NYC or LA, but there's no thread about a "New York" freeze or a "Los Angeles freeze." That's because there are plenty of people who will return your phone calls in those cities. Then, they'll talk about how it takes at least a year in Seattle... or two years... and you can't be too overtly desiring of friendship. You have to follow a formula of reservation, non-intrusion (asking someone to take time out of their schedule to hang out is intrusive, evidently), and general mousey behaviour... and then KA-BOOM! Friends and a social circle. That may be the case, but at the end of the day, it's just a hell of a lot easier to socialize elsewhere.
Some people are cut out for Seattle, some aren't. I sure as hell wasn't. I don't want to spend a couple years pussyfooting around going to grab a beer - I just want to go out and do it.
We work together?
We listen to the same music?
We have the same political beliefs?
We both watch the same movies?
We both like burritos?
Well then by jove, let's go out and get a damn burrito after work! Talk about some bands and I'll loan you this awesome DVD.
We both live in the same neighborhood. There's a good taqueria out that way.
Let's go next Friday. I'll even give you a lift, since it's supposed to be raining and I know you take the bus.
Oh, okay, well maybe next week.
(repeat as necessary until you lose it and leave)
This isn't my passing judgement on Seattle being a bad place, it's just my making an observation about why it was a bad place for me. I lived there for a little over a year, and couldn't get out of there fast enough after having spent that time there.
The younger you are, the easier it will be; if you're college-aged, you'll have a lot of young, enthusiastic classmates who aren't from there originally and that will probably be your saving grace. Moving there as a professional adult is another matter.
this makes me sad.
come to think of it, i have a friend who lived in Seattle and moved away. He told me that he had a really hard time making friends, and once he did make some connections they ended up turning him away. And he's 19!
"I don't want to spend a couple years pussyfooting around going to grab a beer - I just want to go out and do it."
this is exactly how i feel. i think i actually come off pushy in friendships, like if my friends dont answer their phone i'll call them 5 more times and then ask why they didnt want to answer next time i see them. I HATE when people dont return calls or texts. and if i want to hang out with someone i'll just ask if they want to or not, no small talk or pussyfooting. im still holding on to the hope that its not as bad as this thread makes it out to be, and not everyone in Seattle is a passive aggressive weirdo. but only time will tell, i will be arriving early february and will give my take on it after a couple months.
I think for those who are social, they should at least read the end of that article and check out that organization-- I think perhaps it'll helps ease the transition.
Otherwise, resistance is futile, you will be assimilated to the Seattle fabric... you may not like that people don't return their calls/texts, but soon you'll be doing it yourself.
this makes me sad.
come to think of it, i have a friend who lived in Seattle and moved away. He told me that he had a really hard time making friends, and once he did make some connections they ended up turning him away. And he's 19!
Well, again, Seattle obviously does work for a good many people, otherwise they wouldn't live there. I didn't work for me and some other people here, and it didn't (or doesn't) for other people for the same reasons.
It may work for you. You're young, and if you're going to be going to school, so you'll likely meet people there.
I'm 27 now; I was just shy of 25 when I moved there. All told, I found most of the people my age in Seattle to be about the same as the older people: socially avoidant.
Quote:
"I don't want to spend a couple years pussyfooting around going to grab a beer - I just want to go out and do it."
this is exactly how i feel. i think i actually come off pushy in friendships, like if my friends dont answer their phone i'll call them 5 more times and then ask why they didnt want to answer next time i see them. I HATE when people dont return calls or texts. and if i want to hang out with someone i'll just ask if they want to or not, no small talk or pussyfooting. im still holding on to the hope that its not as bad as this thread makes it out to be, and not everyone in Seattle is a passive aggressive weirdo. but only time will tell, i will be arriving early february and will give my take on it after a couple months.
Yeah, this is the sort of behaviour that generally isn't rewarded with friendship in Seattle.
I moved here close to four months ago and have made a few good friends. I have several hobbies, decided to get a part-time job in order to supplement my contract work (where I reduced hours), joined a few meetup groups, and hang out at places such as Crossroads Shopping Center (play chess and card games there every now and then). Its very easy to make friends if you make an effort and do not have anger issues. One of my best friends in my prior city has major anger/patience/self-righteousness issues and finds it impossible to make new friends. I am going to get another part-time job early next year that will hopefully be something I like and that enables me to meet new people. In most mid-to-large sized cities, meetup group events are not as well attended as in Seattle. People here are more adept at getting online and finding out about sites such as meetup.
Probably helps that I am male. I have heard that females make friends more readily, but I think its easier if you are male and reasonably social. I can visit strange places without fear of getting attacked.
Great post...just don't expect too many people to agree with your post, and as you can see it is already getting ignored. I moved here seven months ago and have met more cool people in seven months of Seattle as I have my last seven years back in Jersey. All you have to do is be willing to make the effort and get out there. Plenty of people move to the Seattle area every day and they too are looking for friends, unlike allot of other cities that have no population of transplants. You just have to make an effort and reach out to people.
Personally, I think this whole "Seattle Freeze" thing is a cover people use for their own lack of social skills and unwillingness to meet people. Like I said before, the only in real life I have encountered who complain about people in Seattle being "reserved" are people who themselves have awful attitudes that no one anywhere would want to be around.
People in Seattle are not unfriendly...a bit passive aggressive?Yes, but not unfriendly. From my own experience the whole "Seattle Freeze" thing is exactly what I thought it would be before I came here: a myth....
BUT, I will say that by and large, Seattleites are simply NOT FUNNY, as in they don't make half as many jokes as most Easterners, Southerners, or Midwestern people do. Not too many stand up comedians come from the North West, and I see why. One thing...maybe THE ONLY THING I can say good about Jersey people that I can't say about Seattle people is that they are a hell of allot funnier, but I just think that humor is especially high in Jersey where people need to make themselves laugh to get over the stress of the rat-race.
People in Seattle are not unfriendly...a bit passive aggressive?Yes, but not unfriendly. From my own experience the whole "Seattle Freeze" thing is exactly what I thought it would be before I came here: a myth....
BUT, I will say that by and large, Seattleites are simply NOT FUNNY, as in they don't make half as many jokes as most Easterners, Southerners, or Midwestern people do. Not too many stand up comedians come from the North West, and I see why. One thing...maybe THE ONLY THING I can say good about Jersey people that I can't say about Seattle people is that they are a hell of allot funnier, but I just think that humor is especially high in Jersey where people need to make themselves laugh to get over the stress of the rat-race.
For the most part I agree with most of what you wrote above. However, After spending about a month in Seattle last summer and having the opportunity to meet and interact with many locals, it does seem that part of what was written in the "Seattle Freeze" article seems pretty accurate; epecially when describing people in general to be polite but distant.
In general it seems as if people have more of a "dry" personality in Seattle compared to many other big cities. Obviously that is not the case with everyone as I met quite a few lively and outgoing people in Seattle. As you mentioned above about people not being funny. I think part of it is that there are many more introverts in Seattle than extroverts. This has very little to do with actually being polite or not, as I found many people to be polite in Seattle. Yet, it does seem as if keeping to themselves is more common in Seattle than other big cities . Even a person I spoke to that has lived in Seattle for over 10 years when discussing the "Seattle Freeze" topic agreed and told me that it sounded very accurate to him.
Not having lived in Seattle, but having visited a few times including 1 month in the summer and speaking to locals I have met, I am coming to the conclusion that people ARE more polite and civil in Seattle, but developing close friendship with people and developing FRIENDS NOT ACQUAINTANCES is much more difficult than in other places. This is not bashing Seattle at all, my opinions are from personal observation and opinions of those that I have met that live in Seattle. All in all, I still like Seattle and plan on returning this summer.
Great post...just don't expect too many people to agree with your post, and as you can see it is already getting ignored. I moved here seven months ago and have met more cool people in seven months of Seattle as I have my last seven years back in Jersey. All you have to do is be willing to make the effort and get out there. Plenty of people move to the Seattle area every day and they too are looking for friends, unlike allot of other cities that have no population of transplants. You just have to make an effort and reach out to people.
Personally, I think this whole "Seattle Freeze" thing is a cover people use for their own lack of social skills and unwillingness to meet people. Like I said before, the only in real life I have encountered who complain about people in Seattle being "reserved" are people who themselves have awful attitudes that no one anywhere would want to be around.
People in Seattle are not unfriendly...a bit passive aggressive?Yes, but not unfriendly. From my own experience the whole "Seattle Freeze" thing is exactly what I thought it would be before I came here: a myth....
BUT, I will say that by and large, Seattleites are simply NOT FUNNY, as in they don't make half as many jokes as most Easterners, Southerners, or Midwestern people do. Not too many stand up comedians come from the North West, and I see why. One thing...maybe THE ONLY THING I can say good about Jersey people that I can't say about Seattle people is that they are a hell of allot funnier, but I just think that humor is especially high in Jersey where people need to make themselves laugh to get over the stress of the rat-race.
I wouldn't say that Seattleites are not funny, but it's more low key, droll, not the kind of humor that translates into being stand up comics.
But being a fellow exile from the Garden State, I gotta agree with you 100%. People from New Jersey are funny. Humor is especially high in New Jersey, and so are a lot of the people.
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