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Old 06-23-2011, 01:20 PM
 
Location: Southern California
15,080 posts, read 20,479,858 times
Reputation: 10343

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
This morning on the news they mentioned a special job fair for vets only.
I believe for many public service jobs you get points added on to your test score for military service.
I think there was a time when we had the draft and young people did not have a choice but to be drafted into the military it was fair.
But does that still hold true in today’s world where we have an all voluntary army.
Military service should be considered in the interview process as something that could be a positive but I don't think that one who has served in the military should receive additional 'points' simply for serving.

Last edited by MIKEETC; 06-23-2011 at 01:31 PM..
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Old 06-23-2011, 01:22 PM
 
Location: Wasilla, Alaska
17,823 posts, read 23,458,697 times
Reputation: 6541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clownster View Post
Not that I'd paint all, or even most military veterans with this brush, but every single kid I went to high school with who ended up in the military did so because of (a) total lack of other options and/or (b) he was encouraged to do so by exasperated parents and teachers who couldn't handle the scumbag kid anymore.

Probably shouldn't have even brought that up, considering how veterans respond when you say this, but it's true in my experience.

It was even more true with the draft in the 60s, when college deferments didn't work for working-class kids who weren't college-ready. You ended up with insanely high drug-use levels in the military, and a low-morale force.
As someone from a working-class family who served during the draft I can tell you that you are mistaken. I spent two years in college before voluntarily joining the Marine Corps, I received my draft notice while I was in boot camp. I received no deferments because I did not ask for one.

The low morale was the direct result with the shameful acts committed by the Democrat controlled Congress in March 1975 that ended up leaving hundreds of MIAs and POWs in Vietnam and sparking the fall of Saigon only one month later. President Carter did not help the situation when he pardoned deserters and draft dodgers, that lowered morale even more. Nor did he help improve morale when he lowered the standards to be Politically Correct and allow more women to join the military. It was that low morale and extremely poor leadership on the part of the Commander-In-Chief that led many in the military to use drugs. It had absolutely nothing to do with the draft. The draft was suspended in 1974, two-years before Carter was elected President.
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Old 06-23-2011, 01:26 PM
 
8,263 posts, read 12,201,832 times
Reputation: 4801
No, vets should not get preference, an employer should hire based on the most qualified candidate.

There are vets who spent 3-4 years driving a shuttle bus around a stateside Air Force base, that person gets preference for what?
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Old 06-23-2011, 01:35 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,437 posts, read 4,868,630 times
Reputation: 2746
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdwardA View Post
I'm surprised vets have a hard time getting hired. When I was at B-school recruiters made it known that they had a preference for veterans. All of the vets at my school had multiple job offers at graduation.
When WWII ended and the troops came home businesses changed gears to the peace time economy, unemployment was around 3%
I'm no expert, far from it but I would think if we ended these wars and closed down some of the 865 military bases we could use the money we save to help create jobs, peaceful jobs where people are not killed or injured and people pay taxes from their paychecks and turn around and buy other products to really stir the economy, wait! that would make to much sense, lets just keep pouring money into the war machine and have our sons and daughters come home in body bags.
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Old 06-23-2011, 01:39 PM
 
Location: East Lansing, MI
28,353 posts, read 16,389,243 times
Reputation: 10467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitch View Post
That makes no sense. Why would an employer give a good employee their job back only to fire them after fulfilling the minimum requirements under the law? Businesses want to keep good employees, they do not look for the first opportunity to be rid of them.

It makes perfect sense if the guy that has been doing the job for the last 18mos while the service member was deployed is doing a good job as well, quite possibly for less money.
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Old 06-23-2011, 01:43 PM
 
Location: Pleasant Ridge, Cincinnati, OH
1,040 posts, read 1,334,890 times
Reputation: 304
Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
This morning on the news they mentioned a special job fair for vets only.
I believe for many public service jobs you get points added on to your test score for military service.
I think there was a time when we had the draft and young people did not have a choice but to be drafted into the military it was fair.
But does that still hold true in today’s world where we have an all voluntary army.
I was in the military and I think that the experience is desirable for prospective employers. However, I think that employers should hire based on who would best fit the job - bias for military members should be based on the employer's judgement, not on public policy.
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Old 06-23-2011, 01:44 PM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,531 posts, read 24,704,444 times
Reputation: 9980
Quote:
Originally Posted by slackjaw View Post
No, vets should not get preference, an employer should hire based on the most qualified candidate.

There are vets who spent 3-4 years driving a shuttle bus around a stateside Air Force base, that person gets preference for what?
And at any moment he and his bus could have been shuffled off to Khandahar. He/She probably did not pick their assignment but went where they were ordered. Therein lies the difference.
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Old 06-23-2011, 01:54 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,437 posts, read 4,868,630 times
Reputation: 2746
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
I agree, Clown. Some have become so preconditioned by an ideology that they will support the right of capital above all else. I fully expect to be hearing arguments for slavery within the next few decades ... of the "voluntary" sort of course, some system where poor slobs are conned into thinking that signing a contract of indentured servitude is a good idea.

You're wrong about the service though. A decade is a long time. You'd be hard pressed to find a Soldier or Marine who served over the past 10 years who hasn't been in harm's way. Sailors and Airmen have been doing their part too. I don't think a few extra points on a federal hiring application is a lot to grant.
I think right to work = slavery
I belong to a union back in N.J. for 36 years, moved to Virginia took a job where they expected me to work for free after my workshift ended, the other employees would stay to finish up( not get paid for it ) and would get mad at me when I walked out the door at quitting time.
And you know what, most of them thought unions were a bad idea.
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Old 06-23-2011, 02:09 PM
 
1,167 posts, read 2,170,936 times
Reputation: 804
The thing is, the military is a VOLUNTARY, paid job with all sorts of benefits. Tons. It's not fair to others that they should get passed over.

If an employer wants to personally hire a vet, fine, you'd never know, but to make it required to give them "points" is some crap.
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Old 06-23-2011, 02:11 PM
 
350 posts, read 416,317 times
Reputation: 396
Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
This morning on the news they mentioned a special job fair for vets only.
I believe for many public service jobs you get points added on to your test score for military service.
I think there was a time when we had the draft and young people did not have a choice but to be drafted into the military it was fair.
But does that still hold true in today’s world where we have an all voluntary army.

I agree. When we had the draft I believe the preference was fair. With an all volunteer military, sign on bonus', more competitive pay and the like, I don't think the preference is needed.

I almost would opt for only those who had served in the military running for political office or alternatively having mandatory service for all citizens (similiar to Switzerland).
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