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Men are not helpless, MM. Most men today live on their own for some time before they get married, and they know how to slice a tomato. I'm not saying spouses shouldn't cook for each other, but I dispute the notion that a man whose wife doesn't cook "has no choice" but to eat out. That starts us down the slippery slope to a place where a man whose wife didn't do the laundry on time has "no choice" but to wear dirty clothes, and a man whose wife didn't clean the house for one reason or another has "no choice" but to live in a pig sty. I know it can be tempting to think it "cute" that married men are so helpless and clueless, it's a wonder they don't need their wives to move their diaphragm muscles for them (just like it can be tempting to think it "cute" that women are brainless), but it bites both ways, you know.
Did you finish reading the whole post Redisca, or did you just jump to reply while only reading it half-ass? I said: "of course he can learn how to cook too, but you are not giving him much of a motivation". If a wife doesn't want to lift a finger in a kitchen, why in the world would he want to learn? Or perhaps he already knows, but just doesn't feel like doing it, being part of a bad habit.
Men are not helpless, MM. Most men today live on their own for some time before they get married, and they know how to slice a tomato. I'm not saying spouses shouldn't cook for each other, but I dispute the notion that a man whose wife doesn't cook "has no choice" but to eat out. That starts us down the slippery slope to a place where a man whose wife didn't do the laundry on time has "no choice" but to wear dirty clothes, and a man whose wife didn't clean the house for one reason or another has "no choice" but to live in a pig sty. I know it can be tempting to think it "cute" that married men are so helpless and clueless, it's a wonder they don't need their wives to move their diaphragm muscles for them (just like it can be tempting to think it "cute" that women are brainless), but it bites both ways, you know.
Not disagreeing with you, but it's not a matter of men being "helpless", we know they aren't.
But even the most capable ones really enjoy being cared for in this way - having a meal lovingly prepared for them. For men, this just speaks volumes about how much their women really appreciate them
Did you finish reading the sentence Redisca, or did you just jump to reply while only reading it half-ass? I said: "of course he can learn how to cook too, but you are not giving him much of a motivation". If a wife doesn't want to lift a finger in a kitchen, why in the world would he want to learn? Or perhaps he already knows, but just doesn't feel like doing it, being part of a bad habit.
No, I think I got what you are saying. I just don't see why it can't be turned the other way around. Why does a married man have to learn how to cook? Why is it that his wife should motivate him to cook and not the other way around? In fact, as I explained earlier, I don't see what doing necessary household chores -- which are necessary regardless of one's marital status -- has to do with pleasing one's husband. Why is cleaning the house about the husband? Does it mean that if you lived alone, you wouldn't clean? Or that you wouldn't enjoy living in a well-maintained space? How come men who live alone don't starve to death, manage to clean their residence and take care of their wardrobe? I am not saying spouses shouldn't do things for each other -- and I can't count how many times I've repeated it -- I just don't see the point in infantilizing married men.
I'm the first one to joke about the B and B method of keeping a man happy--keep the belly full and the balls empty--but the whole issue that I rail against is woman working fulltime, man working fulltime, woman doing all the daily household chores, man mowing the lawn once a week and thinking he's done.
But to counter your argument, I think that given the choice between a woman who is good in the bedroom and a woman who is good in the kitchen, they'll take the one who is good in the bedroom and call for reservations.
LOL I can't rep you right now, but I would rep all of your posts here in a heartbeat
I'm okay with some women (like the OP and others who've posted here) finding entoyment and fulfillment cooking meals and cleaning after their husbands. I can see why they should be happy that way. The same goes for men who love to cook for their wives and clean up the house, etc. But please, stop assuming all females are potential housewives or that all males would rather find themselves a female who will do all the household chores (except fixing things, which is oh-so-masculine and my mind and my hands are too obtuse and feminine to learn anyway ) for them. My boyfriend is with me because it's ME he loves and wants to be with, not because I can cook or iron his clothes. We both take care of the home and of each other. I wouldn't settle for less ('less' being any other arrangement which I or he might perceive as unfair) and neither would he.
As I said, I understand how somen men and women prefer the traditional way and I sincerely applaud their choice, but a man who would presuppose I'm the one to cook and clean? Not my type of man, anyway...
Not disagreeing with you, but it's not a matter of men being "helpless", we know they aren't.
But even the most capable ones really enjoy being cared for in this way - having a meal lovingly prepared for them. For men, this just speaks volumes about how much their women really appreciate them
I don't know why it would be so difficult for anyone to understand.
Women really are shooting themselves in the foot with this "feminist" and ultimately useless logic.
I'm out of this discussion. I'm going to clean up the house.
Not disagreeing with you, but it's not a matter of men being "helpless", we know they aren't.
But even the most capable ones really enjoy being cared for in this way - having a meal lovingly prepared for them. For men, this just speaks volumes about how much their women really appreciate them
I understand -- but that goes back to the statement I made about how women shouldn't have a monopoly on caring and men shouldn't have a monopoly on being cared for. Everybody enjoys having a meal lovingly prepared for them. For women, this just speaiks volumes about how much their men really appreciate them. On the other hand, men who expect this to be a "woman thing" and don't reciprocate demonstrate conclusively how little they appreciate their wives. Cooking isn't a wifely thing -- and that's from someone who truly enjoys cooking.
No, I think I got what you are saying. I just don't see why it can't be turned the other way around. Why does a married man have to learn how to cook? Why is it that his wife should motivate him to cook and not the other way around? In fact, as I explained earlier, I don't see what doing necessary household chores -- which are necessary regardless of one's marital status -- has to do with pleasing one's husband. Why is cleaning the house about the husband? Does it mean that if you lived alone, you wouldn't clean? Or that you wouldn't enjoy living in a well-maintained space? How come men who live alone don't starve to death, manage to clean their residence and take care of their wardrobe? I am not saying spouses shouldn't do things for each other -- and I can't count how many times I've repeated it -- I just don't see the point in infantilizing married men.
The cleaning of the house is not only for the husband, it's for myself and my family. I'm guessing a woman who doesn't bother cleaning her house while in a relationship will live in a messy hole of a place if she had to live by herself.
I do get what you are saying though, about doing it for your own enjoyment rather than doing it for the spouse.
No, I think I got what you are saying. I just don't see why it can't be turned the other way around. Why does a married man have to learn how to cook? Why is it that his wife should motivate him to cook and not the other way around? In fact, as I explained earlier, I don't see what doing necessary household chores -- which are necessary regardless of one's marital status -- has to do with pleasing one's husband. Why is cleaning the house about the husband? Does it mean that if you lived alone, you wouldn't clean? Or that you wouldn't enjoy living in a well-maintained space? How come men who live alone don't starve to death, manage to clean their residence and take care of their wardrobe? I am not saying spouses shouldn't do things for each other -- and I can't count how many times I've repeated it -- I just don't see the point in infantilizing married men.
Amen
A man should be motivated by the fact that eating at home is less expensive, better (you get to choose the menu, you're more comfortable, it's more intimate, etc.) and knowing how to cook is extremely useful in life. Same goes for all household tasks. They're grown-up men, aren't they? Do they need to be motivated (or talked into, or nagged) by another adult to do things like kids need it? That's so sad
Women really are shooting themselves in the foot with this "feminist" and ultimately useless logic.
Not sure we are shooting ourselves in the foot, MM. Contrary to popular belief, it appears that self-identified feminists are more likely to be in a long-term heterosexual relationship and their men report greater satisfaction than is the case with "traditional" women. Source.
Not sure we are shooting ourselves in the foot, MM. Contrary to popular belief, it appears that self-identified feminists are more likely to be in a long-term heterosexual relationship and their men report greater satisfaction than is the case with "traditional" women. Source.
I don't know about this source, Redisca. Feminists are a broad group of people.
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) for them. My boyfriend is with me because it's ME he loves and wants to be with, not because I can cook or iron his clothes. We both take care of the home and of each other. I wouldn't settle for less ('less' being any other arrangement which I or he might perceive as unfair) and neither would he.
